CRO Newp #1
Desert Moon
Posts: 5,910 ✭✭✭✭✭
It has been a while since I've shown a newp. My frequency of purchases is way down this year bc, a, the runaway pricing in the coin market, b, the uncertainty posed by the fragile stock market right now, and c, my pending retirement with no regular pay check. All of these things have made me more cautious to buy.
The other issue is that my current primary foci are bust and barber quarters in grades of 25 to 58. In those grades one has to be very careful as so many of both of these series are full of cleaned or other problem examples. For example, I haven't found a single 1900-O or 1906-O barber quarter that I like in those grades in 5 years of looking. The other caveat is, if I am buying online, it has to have a CAC sticker so I know someone really good has seen it and decided it was strong for the grade. For many even relatively unexpensive Barbers in say 45 to 58, that ain't happening, yet if you buy one from the typical lousy images online, and it does not CAC, then you can be out a few hundred green backs. So I have bought a total of 4 coins in 2022, 2 gold, and now 2 bust quarters.
So I was able to get 2 upgrades to my bust quarter die marriage set from CRO. One of these, the one imaged below, an 1819 B3, upgraded a graded AU example in a TPG holder with cleaned surfaces that degraded the luster that I should have never bought in the first place and paid much more for than the example below (tuition, etc. etc.). In grade, the newp downgraded to 35, but IMO, and oh so nice 35. Bust quarters are superhard to get with nice colorful toning not cleaned heavily, in any grade. For my budget, 30-45 is a sweetspot but sometimes I go higher in grade if the coin is nice. I have learned they have to be CAC at the prices these guys cost. Again, one is assured that one of the best has seen it, evaluated it, and approved it. Too much tuition paid buying from online images to do otherwise.
So this is the B3 die marriage for the year 1819. There are 4 die marriages for 1819. This is the most common and carries the R1 designation. The reverse which is shares with B4 (R4+) has some cool features. Strong repunching in the 5 of 25, and a second period above the correct one that is smaller. You gotta think, what was going on at the mint that day, too much whiskey or whatever they had to drink in 1819? The 2 on the 25 is the curl base 2. B1 (R5-) and B2 (R3) have the square base 2 and are each a different die not shared with other 1819 marriages. Each of the obverses are different dies for the 4 die marriages.
I show below in order my 1-3 die marriages for 1819. I don't have the B4 yet, we will see if the right coin ever comes along.
Best, SH
Die marriages 1-3, SH View - warning I have 3 B2's, too nice to pass up, compare the features and die states between the grades:
Here is my B1, did not pass CAC because of the 'old cleaning' it took according to what CAC told me. The reverse luster is somewhat subdued for the grade and relative to the obverse, from the old cleaning probably. Not any obvious hairlines so the cleaning was probably chemical that affected the surface luster. Still a nice coin even if not CAC and given the rarity, a keeper.
my B2's:
And here is my image of the new B3, compare to the Troo Veeoooh.
Comments
Man, those are some awesome Capped Bust Quarters! Finding attractive ones like those is not an easy thing to do.
PS if you have large capped bust quarters, please post them!
I always look forward to your new purchase posts. Never disappointed! Thanks for sharing.
If the sticker doesn't stick, you must resubmit... As many CAC rejects get a sticker when sent through a second time.
I even know of one that was rejected 6 times and just recently stickered the seventh time submitted.
Was it attempted with different cert numbers?
Very nice coin @spacehayduke! Congrats. Looks like a beautiful coin from the SHView and TrueView!
Nope, same slab as there's been no need to hide things from them resubmitting since they started, as it seems it's all about how it looks on a different day.
I don't think it will sticker even if sent in a 2nd time. The 'cleaned long ago' reason for rejection I am pretty sure goes into their notes about it.......
So, do you think the 4 CAC'd examples you posted aren't also secondary skinned toning? A huge majority of FH, DB, & CB coinage has all been molested at some point re-toned/skinned in envelopes or albums and market acceptable since it's mostly only available that way. I actually like your newp better than the rest of your 1819 varieties and think it's worth sending in a second time since having a sticker seems to be important to you.
A few from the collection.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
Yes pretty much all of the older US silver has been cleaned to some degree and especially ones with color in <MS grades. At least that is what experienced numismatists like QD Bowers writes over and over in his books. After sending in over a 100 bust and seated silver coins to CAC, you see a pattern of what is CAC 'cleaned' acceptable and what is not. This one is not based on my experience but tried and had it confirmed - subdued luster on the reverse as I stated I interpret to be likely a result of a chem dip/wash in the distant past. I have one small capped bust quarter that seemed to be within their 'cleaned' acceptable category that would not bean for 3 times and I just did not agree nor understand. So I gave it one more shot and it beaned. Beaning is subjective, just like grading, there is a transitional area in there and sometimes it is worth trying again. For obvious ones like the B1 above, it is not.
Broadie, this was never the point of this thread, the point was to present some nice quarters with commentary and hopefully have others share theirs, but if you want to go down that path Broadie, share your experience with CAC. How many coins have you sent to CAC? You seem to know alot about it and in particular for re-submissions. Do share................
Excellent coins!
I only have these two:
To my eyes, these are extremely original and should sticker if I ever send them in.
Either way I’m very happy with both!
My YouTube Channel
I had a dream about CAC and JA when it first started. It came true.
I meant.... only favored coins would be stickered.
All of these were submitted (raw) by me, and have never been sent to CAC.
PCGS AG03
NGC VG8
NGC MS62
PCGS VF20
PCGS VG08
Returning to your comment about Barber quarters:
"For example, I haven't found a single 1900-O or 1906-O barber quarter that I like in those grades in 5 years of looking"
I have to agree, as far are the 1900-O I have been able to get one [raw] that I self graded as a 58. I was able to get it back in February 1998, and have only gotten two other decent ones: a F-12 and a VG 10, plus a VG-08.
Tough date, David Lawrence called it an R-4, I think tougher.
On the 1906-O the best I was ever able to find was an XF-40, also raw, bought back in September 2000.
Dave mentions that the '06 O is poorly struck as a rule.
BHNC #203
"My frequency of purchases is way down this year bc, a, the runaway pricing in the coin market, b, the uncertainty posed by the fragile stock market right now, and c, my pending retirement with no regular pay check. All of these things have made me more cautious to buy.
The other issue is that my current primary foci are bust and barber quarters in grades of 25 to 58. In those grades one has to be very careful as so many of both of these series are full of cleaned or other problem examples. For example, I haven't found a single 1900-O or 1906-O barber quarter that I like in those grades in 5 years of looking. The other caveat is, if I am buying online, it has to have a CAC sticker so I know someone really good has seen it and decided it was strong for the grade. For many even relatively unexpensive Barbers in say 45 to 58, that ain't happening, yet if you buy one from the typical lousy images online, and it does not CAC, then you can be out a few hundred green backs."
Well said!
Good to find out that others have the same issues with some of the Barber quarter issues that I am having, explains alot. Well I will just keep searching........
Best, Sh
Wonderful coins!
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
Great looking set of 1819s! So hard to find with a nice look like that.
I had one that might have worked for you but unfortunately it was sold last year. Pics below.
Really nice examples, and I always enjoy your presentation. My B-4 fits right in with those.
I once brought 100+ bust quarters to CAC, but in hindsight think they would have done better percentage wise if I had done them in smaller batches. Its been a while, but I haven't tried to resubmit any, and no Golds. Thanks for sharing.
1TwoBits
Some really nice coins in this thread. Interesting comments about CAC resubmissions. Cheers, RickO
What is CRO?
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/publishedset.aspx?s=142753
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
Coin Rarities Online
@spacehayduke what a wonderful lineup’s ☺️ The non beanie is beautiful though!
I thought about acquisition a Details just for the eye appeals.
Great new pickup and wonderful images of your other 1819 examples. My favorite may be your VF30 B2 with greenish fields. These are my two 1819’s:
Large 9 B2:
Small 9 B4 LDS retained cud at date:
Really nice quarters!!
Great coins wahoo! the B4 LDS is extremely rare, just a dozen or so in the wild..........