Help me prevent PVC damage

scotty4449

Hello all,

When I first got into coins I bought mostly raw coins and I have accumulated a ton of really nice AU/BU copper and silver. Now I mostly buy graded coins, so I don't spend as much time with them as I did. I want to prevent PVC damage, currently they are stored all kinds of ways using at least one of the products below. Which of these are safe and which do I need to get rid of?

Thanks for the help, I appreciate it!

Supposedly "PVC Free" & "Acid Free" 20-pocket pages

Regular 2X2 cardboard flips

Vinyl Coin Flips (I think I may have gotten rid of all these)

"Unplasticized" vinyl (uPVC) flips

lkeigwin

Toss any soft, flexible ones that smell like shower curtains.
Lance.

Kliao

The BCW and Guardhouse flips both have PVC so I would get rid of both.

Oldhoopster

It isn't the PVC that's the problem, its the plasticizer that makes it soft.

I use Saflips made from PET

ricko

I use airtites for special coins and 2x2's for general coins not worth slabbing. Cheers, RickO

Kliao

@Oldhoopster said:
It isn't the PVC that's the problem, its the plasticizer that makes it soft.

I always thought that it was PVC that was the problem. I'll look more into it. Thanks!

DollarAfterDollar

Ikeigwin hit it on the nose.

MetroD

@Kliao said:
I always thought that it was PVC that was the problem. I'll look more into it. Thanks!

NGC Reference

Sapyx

@Kliao said:
I always thought that it was PVC that was the problem. I'll look more into it. Thanks!

The problem with PVC is that its really not a very suitable plastic to make coin flips or holders out of. People only use it because it's much cheaper than the alternatives. PVC in its "raw" or "pure" state is translucent and very hard and brittle, both of which are properties not very suitable for coin holders. To make it transparent and flexible, something has to be added to the PVC. Traditionally, this is done with phthalate-based plasticizers. And it's those plasticizers, rather than the PVC itself, that slowly leach out of the plastic over time, breaking down on metal surfaces into acidic by-products, causing the classic "green goo PVC damage". So theoretically, a solid block of pure PVC could sit on top of a coin indefinitely and do no damage. Wouldn't do terribly much in the way of protecting the coin from the environment, either, though.

But I'd be very curious as to how the maker of those "unplasticized vinyl" flips manage to turn PVC into something "ultra-clear and flexible" without plasticizers, because it sounds to me like that breaks the laws of physics. Or chemistry, at least.

And yes, the stuff we normally call "vinyl" when we're buying shower curtains or cheap flooring is exactly the same stuff that we coin collectors call "PVC" - the proper name in both cases is "polyvinyl chloride".

Kliao

@MetroD Thanks for the NGC article. Very informative.

@Sapyx Really appreciate the detailed explanation that plasticizers that hurt the coin and not the PVC itself.

Thanks all!

MetroD

If anyone is interested, here is a more technical reference about PVC ...

lkeigwin

@Kliao said:

@Oldhoopster said:
It isn't the PVC that's the problem, its the plasticizer that makes it soft.

I always thought that it was PVC that was the problem. I'll look more into it. Thanks!

Don't get distracted here. PVC flips use compounds to stabilize (for durability) and soften (for flexibility). Yes, technically PVC is not the problem. It's the softener agent (plasticizer), reacting with its environment that produces harmful acid. But that's what you get with PVC holders.

There are safety flips made of PVC with very low levels of plasticizers that are less likely to be harmful if they're kept from excess heat and humidity. There are other risks though because they are pretty rigid and coin scratches can happen, inserting and removing. Over time they crack and yellow. (They are commonly called "non-PVC" incorrectly because they are safer.)

It's smart to just avoid all flips made with PVC. Mylar flips are 100% safe. They resemble PVC flips in size and form but you'll know the difference instantly. They're stiff, they crackle and don't stink. Lots of other safe options too like air-tites, kointains, intercept shield, whitman gallery, etc.
Lance.

Kliao

Yeah. I'm only using mylar saflips now after the scare I has when I learned that the flips I used were made of PVC.

scotty4449

@lkeigwin said:
Toss any soft, flexible ones that smell like shower curtains.
Lance.

Those 20 pocket pages definitely smell like a shower curtain, into the garbage with them! The GuardHouse flips are rigid and smell like nothing, still not safe you think?

scotty4449

Thanks for all the advice! I think I will just get rid of all the plastic junk and put everything in the 2X2 cardboard flips. I love having an album with pages, any Mylar pages you all would recommend?

lkeigwin

I have no experience with them. But "unplasticized vinyl" sounds like PVC with some softener...probably low level plasticizer. PVC (vinyl) is very hard and brittle and needs help.

Short term the flips are safe, I'm sure. But I wouldn't use them for long term storage or where they are exposed to heat, sunlight or humidity.

FWIW, just several years ago PCGS used to supply the dreaded PVC flips at shows for coin submissions. They reasoned it was perfectly safe for temporary use. I'm sure they were right but customers complained. Today you will only see mylar flips.
Lance.

MetroD

@scotty4449 said:
Those 20 pocket pages definitely smell like a shower curtain, into the garbage with them! The GuardHouse flips are rigid and smell like nothing, still not safe you think?

From the manufacturer's website ...
"[...] unplasticized flips [...] are considered safer for coin storage than soft vinyl. This is why some manufacturers will refer to unplasticized flips as “Safe for long term storage”, or even "Archival". [...]

If you really want archival, however, you must abandon PVC all together.

The most common non-PVC archival material used today in called Polyethelyene Teraphalate, or PET. As a member of the polyester family, PET is basically the generic version of Dupont brand Mylar. [...]"
Source: https://www.translinesupply.com/store/pg/42-PVC-and-PET-Flips.aspx

As others have stated, your safest option is PET (e.g., SAFLIP).

scotty4449

@MetroD

Thanks for that link up above, that was really informative!

Sapyx

@scotty4449 said:
Thanks for all the advice! I think I will just get rid of all the plastic junk and put everything in the 2X2 cardboard flips. I love having an album with pages, any Mylar pages you all would recommend?

When I buy coin album pages, I don't go to the coin supplies stores. I go to the photography supplies stores. Because standard photographic slides are exactly the same size as 2x2 coin holders. And the plastic they use for slide album pages is usually far superior quality to the plastic the coin album page manufactuers use, because an album page damaging a photographic slide through solvent migration is a far, far worse problem than a similar issue happening with a 2x2, so they tend to take the importance of quality plastic more seriously.

I always use PrintFIle pages. I also like the "safe-t-binder" albums they sell.

I've also found it amusing that, with the decline of photography in recent decades, the folks over at PrintFile and other photography supplies stores have cottoned on to the fact that coin collectors are buying their products. Their website even has a "coin collector storage" tab to show you all their stock items they think are coin-compatible options.