Options
*UPDATE* Snipe nose M. 33.28-Z.16, 1787 Connecticut Copper?
InGodWeTrustCoins
Posts: 132 ✭✭✭
Update
"The coin was shipped to Stacks Bowers Auctions and was lost by FedEx in New York. We have been unable to attain any information from them for weeks. If the coin is found by anyone, please let us know!"
Is this the scarce snipe nose variety?
1
Comments
yes. (did you edit your thread asking about rarity?)
this is per heritage:
one obv, 4 known reverses
1787 COPPER Connecticut, Draped Bust Left, M. 33.28-Z.11, W-3765, R.6, XF45 NGC. 154.3 grains. Obverse die 33.28 is known with reverse dies Z.7, Z.11, Z.16, and Z.20. Reverse die Z.11 is known with obverse dies 33.20, 33.28, 33.33, 33.34, 33.37, and 33.41. The rim-to-rim horizontal die break passes the point of the effigy's nose, confirming the popular 33.28 obverse die.
Four "Snipe Nose" varieties are known, three of which are represented in the Donald G. Partrick Collection. Lustrous golden-tan obverse color displays olive overtones throughout the reverse. This Choice XF example has an impressive pedigree that includes the Dr. Thomas Hall collection, Virgil Brand, Herbert Oechsner, and Anthony Terranova, prior to acquisition by Donald G. Partrick in 1988. The coin has been off the market since then, its first appearance in more than 30 years. A few light abrasions along the bridge of the nose do not distract or diminish the coin's Condition Census status. Listed on page 66 of the 2021 Guide Book.
This is the original post.
Thank you very much for the help. It is greatly appreciated.
InGodWeTrustCoinsandCurrency.com
i must've been seeing things as the first thing i started looking up was rarity but when i came back to the thread, i didn't see that. not a big deal, just wondering if i'm seeing things! having too many threads/tabs open and doing too much has its drawbacks sometimes. lol
You Want A Second Opinion!
That's not the Z.16 reverse, but appears to be Z.7 instead. The Bowers Colonial Encyclopedia calls it URS-1, meaning then thought to be... unique! That is potentially a 5-figure coin if so.
Ed. S.
(EJS)
Snipe nose? I see the issue, but where did that name come from? I cannot see any relationship whatsoever to a snipe. Cheers, RickO
Oooh, watching.
Professional Numismatist. "It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
don't snipes have long and/or curve beaks?
I agree, that is a Z.7, a very rare coin!
just because i spent a lot of time looking for the 4 listed reverses and organizing images. i would agree it is not the z11, z16 or z20. not even close to those. so if there is only 4 known, it is z7 or new but others confirmed it z7, so i'll have to confirm because finding images of z20 has been tough and i never found a z7 which says a lot about the availability/scarcity.
@LanceNewmanOCC... Yes... but not a straight line protruding from the nose/head. Cheers, RickO
Thank you all very much for the help! Any advice on getting it authenticated? Should I just send it to PCGS walkthrough with variety attribution? I don't know if they will attribute the Z-7...
InGodWeTrustCoinsandCurrency.com
.
if no one else answers with a definitive answer, you can always check the pops.
Well, this is super interesting!!
Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
I pm'd JK for his opinion, but he's not been on for awhile, so.... In any case, I would think you'd want to ask a colonial expert before a slab company.
Ed. S.
(EJS)
does anyone see a z7 example that can be posted here?
I posted a link to this thread on the Colonial Coin Collectors club message group and the responses, all from some of the top experts in the field, agreed with the Z.7 attribution. It is a 33.28- Z.7, no doubt about it.
JK confirmed the 33.28-Z.7 attribution, saying it's an item that should be sold at auction.
Lance: I strongly doubt you'll find a photo of this variety elsewhere than above. It was thought to be unique before this thread (AFAIK; I don't have the recent CT copper book.) But the Z.7 reverse exists with other obverses; I don't consider myself anything of a Connecticut guru, but I think obverse 33.29 is paired with this reverse. And checking the StB archives, also 33.10 and 33.13.
Ed. S.
(EJS)
Small update: while fumbling around the Newman Portal, I found a photo of the other specimen.
Ed. S.
(EJS)
The coin was shipped to Stacks Bowers Auctions and was lost by FedEx in New York. We have been unable to attain any information from them for weeks. If the coin is found by anyone, please let us know!
InGodWeTrustCoinsandCurrency.com
Oh no, absolutely terrible. Being that rare, if it shows up it will be identifiable.
I hope you insured it for the maximum, it gets expensive but in case of loss you have no recourse without insurance.
.
fwiw, JUST in case you didn't know or think of it, we could just get a high-grade example of the 33.28 obv and match it to ANY z7 reverse from another marriage and put the 2 together for a nice viewable specimen. i ALMOST took the time to do it. of course, i would label the image as such so someone didn't think the 2 images were actually from 1 coin. i have seen this done in the past until suitable examples of whatever coin(s) came to light, if ever.
i did see the diagnostics are completely unmistakable for the z7 reverse. kinda makes it a slam-dunk attribution! BUT, to be safe, in case a certain area is damaged/corroded, secondary diagnostics are nice to have.
Most bad shipping stories I hear are about FedEx lately. Gonna avoid using them.
Any further updates on the coin?