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Guess the grade, 1902 Double Eagle

erwindocerwindoc Posts: 5,190 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

The 1902 is the unofficial key to the 20th century portion of the set. What do you think this one grades???

Comments

  • SoldiSoldi Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2022 3:19AM

    MS 62

  • WilliamFWilliamF Posts: 831 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My first thought was 64 but on closer examination I don't think it quite got there, it has some great luster but quite a few little marks on the obverse that probably hurt the grade a little and brought it down to 63, I don't know gold too well though so I might be way off on that assessment :)

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  • sumduncesumdunce Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭✭

    MS63

  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,544 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Luster like a 64, but the scratch keeps it it to a 63.

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  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A lot of 'chatter' on Liberty and the fields.... 62 is my assessment. Cheers, RickO

  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 8,169 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Initial impression is MS62, maybe a shot at 63...

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  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,416 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I thought the 1905 was the rarest 20th century Liberty double eagle.
    Nice coin. Looks MS 62. Without that mark in the right obverse field, I would guess MS64.

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  • TomBTomB Posts: 21,596 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is there cloudiness in the fields especially around stars 9-12 on the obverse and scattered about the wording on the reverse? Perhaps there is even a partial print between "DOLLARS" and "AMERICA" on the reverse. This might not be visible in-hand and may be an artifact of the strong lighting, but it makes me wonder what is going on with the coin.

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    image
  • erwindocerwindoc Posts: 5,190 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:
    I thought the 1905 was the rarest 20th century Liberty double eagle.
    Nice coin. Looks MS 62. Without that mark in the right obverse field, I would guess MS64.

    Per PCGS Coin Facts, the 1902 has a mintage of 31,140; the 1905 comes in at 58,910. Both are very low.

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,591 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm in the 62 camp

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  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,678 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Lock 63, possibly with a plus due to the originality.

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,416 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @erwindoc said:

    @PerryHall said:
    I thought the 1905 was the rarest 20th century Liberty double eagle.
    Nice coin. Looks MS 62. Without that mark in the right obverse field, I would guess MS64.

    Per PCGS Coin Facts, the 1902 has a mintage of 31,140; the 1905 comes in at 58,910. Both are very low.

    The Numismedia price guide shows the 1905 as being priced slightly higher than the 1902 which leads me to believe the 1902 had a slightly higher survival rate than the 1905. They're both scarce coins.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
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  • The_Dinosaur_ManThe_Dinosaur_Man Posts: 998 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think it's only a 62 technically, but I can see it getting a 63 on a really good day.

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  • FlyingAlFlyingAl Posts: 3,502 ✭✭✭✭✭

    MS-62 for me.

    Coin Photographer.

  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2022 7:51AM

    @TomB said:
    Is there cloudiness in the fields especially around stars 9-12 on the obverse and scattered about the wording on the reverse? Perhaps there is even a partial print between "DOLLARS" and "AMERICA" on the reverse. This might not be visible in-hand and may be an artifact of the strong lighting, but it makes me wonder what is going on with the coin.

    .
    i agree.

    i won't call foul though as it doesn't seem to be in any area of any use, so i'd guess random schmutz. also, it shouldn't hurt the surfaces but perhaps it could start looking worse over time? i would be BLOWN away to find out that pcgs/ngc etc has never used lighting on the non-visible spectrum to detect crap on coins that is not favorable. i know if i shine a bright light at the ceiling and it reflects back down to some coins surfaces, it will show stuff which is virtually not detectable any other way i've tried. fwiw (edited to add, especially proofs)

    62 but 63 wouldn't surprise.

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  • ParadisefoundParadisefound Posts: 8,588 ✭✭✭✭✭

    63 what a beautiful find !

  • scotty4449scotty4449 Posts: 717 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Nice double eagle, I would say 62.

  • erwindocerwindoc Posts: 5,190 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2022 9:13AM

    Lots of good guesses and Im glad to hear most of the people felt the same way about it that I did(MS62/62+). Yes, MS61!

  • ashelandasheland Posts: 23,400 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I was at 62. great coin!

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  • ms71ms71 Posts: 1,546 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The 61 grade makes me think the marks in the right obverse field by Liberty's lower curls may be even more serious than the photo would lead me to believe.

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  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ms71 said:
    The 61 grade makes me think the marks in the right obverse field by Liberty's lower curls may be even more serious than the photo would lead me to believe.

    .
    it was also graded what, 25-30 years ago? although you may be right as the coin has a lot of contact but a LOT of gold has upgraded from older holders in the past 5-10 years. just for semantics, i doubt this would go 62 today having said that though.

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  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,678 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Probably gold cac or 62+ now; old holder lock upgrade (sometimes).

  • erwindocerwindoc Posts: 5,190 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2022 10:04AM

    @logger7 said:
    Probably gold cac or 62+ now; old holder lock upgrade (sometimes).

    I think Id like CAC to have a look at it when they are back up and running again. I hate to lose the old holder.

  • streeterstreeter Posts: 4,312 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Obv: between stars 9-11
    Rev: outer field between Dollars and America and right above the arrow tips.

    Cloudiness in those confined areas does not seem natural.

    I bought a graded coin that had a similar look. It was a 94 2 1/2 in 63. Looked so nice. Thought it was lock 64/65.

    Turned out to be lasered.

    Have a nice day
  • Dave99BDave99B Posts: 8,603 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would have gone MS62 myself. Looks a bit nicer than a 61.

    Dave

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  • alaura22alaura22 Posts: 3,334 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Off to CAC, then a trip to PCGS for reconsideration
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  • CryptoCrypto Posts: 3,738 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @streeter said:
    Obv: between stars 9-11
    Rev: outer field between Dollars and America and right above the arrow tips.

    Cloudiness in those confined areas does not seem natural.

    I bought a graded coin that had a similar look. It was a 94 2 1/2 in 63. Looked so nice. Thought it was lock 64/65.

    Turned out to be lasered.

    Looks like putty by the stars to these eyes, with cheek rub, milkiness and the gash 61 looks right to me. I bet it has been tried 1/2 a dozen times already for an upgrade. The 1902 is one of the keys of the 20cen short set and has been worth more than type for a long time. Every grade up is a decent bump so I would be shocked if you were the first to think it would look better in a 62 holder

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  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 9,021 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I was going to say 62 because of the eye appeal. Even at 61 it's still a very nice example.

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,678 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited June 13, 2022 3:45PM

    @Crypto said:

    @streeter said:
    Obv: between stars 9-11
    Rev: outer field between Dollars and America and right above the arrow tips.

    Cloudiness in those confined areas does not seem natural.

    I bought a graded coin that had a similar look. It was a 94 2 1/2 in 63. Looked so nice. Thought it was lock 64/65.

    Turned out to be lasered.

    Looks like putty by the stars to these eyes, with cheek rub, milkiness and the gash 61 looks right to me. I bet it has been tried 1/2 a dozen times already for an upgrade. The 1902 is one of the keys of the 20cen short set and has been worth more than type for a long time. Every grade up is a decent bump so I would be shocked if you were the first to think it would look better in a 62 holder

    I agree, and that is a common phenomenon. Got faked out by a better date in an old holder 63 that dipped out ok but another issue materialized. A couple other $20s in old holders dipped out, one upgraded. Were they lasering these coins back then, in the early 90s? I know they were puttying a lot. !

  • TomBTomB Posts: 21,596 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Putty is exactly what I was writing about when I wrote "cloudiness" in my post, but I don't always want to be that guy who says something negative about a coin when someone asks. So, I thought I would throw that bit out there to see if anyone else agreed. For the record, I think it is puttied from the images.

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image

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