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Am I losing my MInd or is this a triple die 1981 Lincoln Memorial?















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  • DCWDCW Posts: 6,935 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yep, losing your mind :D
    This is die deterioration which mimics doubling
    Keep looking and start with the known varieties

    Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
    "Coin collecting for outcasts..."

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 11,920 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You’re probably not, but it isn’t.

    Read up on the differences between doubled dies and mechanical/machine doubling, etc.
    There are numerous threads and a number of helpful websites on the topic.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • rodeo514rodeo514 Posts: 215 ✭✭✭

    well they couldnt be any shinier, but 1 little scratch and its over! I am losing it. I can only do this for so many hours at a time. Im dead!

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 11,920 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited April 23, 2022 8:50AM

    @rodeo514 said:
    well they couldnt be any shinier, but 1 little scratch and its over! I am losing it. I can only do this for so many hours at a time. Im dead!

    “Shinier” has nothing to do with whether the coin is a doubled die or an error. And in many cases, it doesn’t necessarily mean that a coin is of high grade.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 14,641 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @rodeo514 said:
    well they couldnt be any shinier, but 1 little scratch and its over!

    I'm not sure what this means. "Shiny" does not equate to high grade.

    I am losing it. I can only do this for so many hours at a time. Im dead!

    I've said it many times before, but I realize that newer collectors generally only read the threads they started, so here is my suggestion again: if you want to find interesting/valuable/rare coins, look at more coins, don't look at your coins more closely.

    I'm not sure what you are spending "so many hours at a time" doing, but it doesn't seem to be paying off.

    My strong suggestion is to make a list of known varieties. Set any coins from those dates/mintmarks aside for closer scrutiny. Give everything else a quick once over for obvious anomalies and then move on.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not a TDO as stated above... machine doubling, die wear etc..... Read the suggested book/sites and learn.... Cheers, RickO

  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 24, 2022 9:36AM

    @rodeo514 @MFeld

    Here is two Lincolns fresh out of what they call mint rolls, even though I don't believe the mint rolls coins (?????)
    So, I could state these to be MS (Mint State) how would they grade in the MS details grade I don't know, I'd guess low.
    But, as stated shinier wouldn't have anything to do with doubling.
    Now smoothness + shiny + higher than normal details most likely would be from a batch of coins produced from newer dies, details tend to drop off as the die (dies) turns out more coins.

    They're what some call first run or early strikes, then there is this as labeled with this coin of mine "First Day Of Issue" but even with this one it graded a 69 and not a 70

    "I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
    Thomas Jefferson!

  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭

    I can't state this enough, be careful of to much magnification, it has a purpose yes! but to an untrained eye it can be very deceiving, all kinds of things can appear, and if a person is looking for wealth in a rare, or error coin rather than just a deep desire of interest in them HIGH magnification and your mind will work against you, surface imperfections will start looking like mint marks, or mint errors, also, if you look at most what's considered mint errors they're not on a microscopic level.
    High magnification contributes to are mind seeing what it wants to see, that's the deception.

    "I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
    Thomas Jefferson!

  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 25, 2022 4:31PM

    Okay, really shiny.
    Considered old.
    Must mean valuable, I mean look how nice!
    I have a pretty nice Lincoln collection for mostly a RAW collection, and I know its not a High End collection.
    But lets say I was to remove 10 select coins, what's left isn't of much value at all, its the Key dates, a few Proofs, and my 55DDO that makes up 95% of its value.
    Take a look at this Fleabay listing,
    Its a buy it now,
    Look how many of them they've sold?
    Look at the condition of the Memories? (BU= Brilliant Uncirculated)
    What are they worth, and they're making money!
    A Wise Man Never Told Me Any Lies (but in many cases they may tell us something we don't want to hear)
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/265389077913?hash=item3dca6bf599:g:CxYAAOSwhdRgOc5b

    "I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
    Thomas Jefferson!

  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭
    edited April 25, 2022 4:42PM

    We here have very little to actually go when a new member shows up with what often times ends up being someone running some kind of scam (that's not accusation)

    Just about any Lincoln Memorial Cent can be had on ebay in BU condition in rolls of 50 for nearly nothing, now BU Wheat cents are a little different, and ones before 1930 in BU can start to get pricey for sure!
    2 rolls of 1961,
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/154962395271?hash=item24147a8087:g:sxQAAOSwpqpiVfnN
    I have no idea why anyone would pay $8.95 for a roll of these, but its 50 coins!
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/294947810469?hash=item44ac426ca5:g:SV8AAOSwgoliZpTC

    "I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
    Thomas Jefferson!

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,765 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have to agree with all the above.

  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭
  • MarkW63MarkW63 Posts: 1,532 ✭✭✭✭

    I've said this before,
    There is a parallel universe or "Twilight Zone" world of make believe coins.
    This make believe world adds nothing to the real world of coin collecting, in fact its a black mark for the hobby.
    It was created by con's and scammers.
    Let me give you an example of how in part it got started. A scammer could buy say a roll of 1943 Steel Wheat Cents off ebay for will say $12.00 that put up some stupid listings on say itsy for just ONE of them, they title it something like this,
    Extremely RARE ERROR 1943 Lincoln Penny No Mint Mark Sticks to a magnet
    Add a couple of pictures and put a $10,000 price on this trophy, then wait a couple of days until they see some views.
    Then they go to their fleabay account and the put up a listing selling the same coins, with pretty much the same title except they put a price on it for say $2,500 BOOM its sold!! this con makes $2,500 off a $1.00 common penny!
    Now, dozens of these types of listings start popping up on ebay, same con's, but more of them, they add a 1946 No Mint Mark VERY RARE Lincoln Penny to itsy, list it on fleabay for a steal price, BOOM it sells!
    So, there is now a list of these high price coins actually SOLD on ebay, boy that adds fuel to the frenzy.
    Not the first collector bought into this foolishness, just get rich people that know nothing about coins! they think their grandma's little tin full of the most common Lincoln pennies is a gold mine, and so on in goes!
    Here are just a few of these make believe Twilight Zone listings.
    This coin for the most part is worthless, it may top the list of the Twilight Zone specials, notice the watchers! they're not looking to buy, they're looking to see if it sells, because all of them have found 4 or 5 of them in that tin grandma had.
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/403208559055?hash=item5de11a59cf:g:nZ4AAOSw9hNhW0N2
    Here is another one, it should just be tossed in the trash :D
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/255178872947?hash=item3b69d89873:g:SosAAOSwJT9haFeO
    Attention Collectors what a frigging joke!
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/324365222988?hash=item4b85ac844c:g:XGkAAOSwMalfigiX
    This garbage is endless!
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/284630560191?hash=item42454dadbf:g:6CsAAOSwx01h9cd7
    They're even creating their own RARE Lincoln's and you can buy as many as you want!
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/275011816849?
    Its so bad that for someone like me who's not into error coins I have to ask myself, what's real, what's not?
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/194999072181?
    So, anyone just starting into this could possible think they are losing their minds.

    "I Prefer Dangerous Freedom Over Peaceful Slavery"
    Thomas Jefferson!

  • rodeo514rodeo514 Posts: 215 ✭✭✭

    @JBK said:

    @rodeo514 said:
    well they couldnt be any shinier, but 1 little scratch and its over!

    I'm not sure what this means. "Shiny" does not equate to high grade.

    I am losing it. I can only do this for so many hours at a time. Im dead!

    I've said it many times before, but I realize that newer collectors generally only read the threads they started, so here is my suggestion again: if you want to find interesting/valuable/rare coins, look at more coins, don't look at your coins more closely.

    I'm not sure what you are spending "so many hours at a time" doing, but it doesn't seem to be paying off.

    My strong suggestion is to make a list of known varieties. Set any coins from those dates/mintmarks aside for closer scrutiny. Give everything else a quick once over for obvious anomalies and then move on.

    I've been visiting varietyvistas and trying to cross reference. Is there never a new find of a double die, or is the list complete?.its these and only these, or can new discoveries show up?The shiny comment wasn't about high grade.It was about staring at these shiny coins under a scope with NY brain frying lol

  • JBKJBK Posts: 14,641 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yes, new DDs can be found, but the chance of a newer collector finding them is very small since they don't usually understand DD from machine doubling, etc.

    A few years back an 80-year old "new" doubled die on a Mercury dime was first discovered.

    Pm brand new current/recent date coins, a new collector might indeed be the first to see an unknown DD.

  • rodeo514rodeo514 Posts: 215 ✭✭✭

    Makes perfect sense.what is PM?

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