@jesbroken said:
At that price level, I would want to be satisfied. Let Ebay decide. Tell them why you are not satisfied and provide both photos to them when filing and let them make the final decision.
Jim
They won't even look. They'll just approve the return.
@jmlanzaf said:
It sounds like he's interpreting "line" to mean physical damage not toning.
That's what I was wondering but it's hard to judge the seller's response without knowing what he was replying to.
Just to satisfy everyone's curiosity, and probably garner some further advice about my foolishness and lack of tact, here is what the seller was replying to:
_Photos of the coin do not show the distracting and obvious line (scuff mark?) running across the face of the coin. This detracts significantly from the eye-appeal... The photos were not an accurate representation of the coin s appearance
-and-
Sadly (and see my recent message), I'm not at all happy with the coin, and the distracting line across the face.
I'm hoping you can process a return, and I won't have to SNAD (never done one before).
Sorry this didn't work out, I really hoped it would look as good as the photos._
These along with the 2 pictures of the coin in question.
I think this horse is dead here, and I hope I can get a SNAD refund, and I hope the seller **does ** block me.
And I hope I learn my lesson.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
The defining moment for a "great seller" is how they handle a division of opinion.
Moursund deserves a refund, no matter how he may have presented his objections to the seller.
@jmlanzaf said:
It sounds like he's interpreting "line" to mean physical damage not toning.
That's what I was wondering but it's hard to judge the seller's response without knowing what he was replying to.
Just to satisfy everyone's curiosity, and probably garner some further advice about my foolishness and lack of tact, here is what the seller was replying to:
_Photos of the coin do not show the distracting and obvious line (scuff mark?) running across the face of the coin. This detracts significantly from the eye-appeal... The photos were not an accurate representation of the coin s appearance
-and-
Sadly (and see my recent message), I'm not at all happy with the coin, and the distracting line across the face.
I'm hoping you can process a return, and I won't have to SNAD (never done one before).
Sorry this didn't work out, I really hoped it would look as good as the photos._
These along with the 2 pictures of the coin in question.
I think this horse is dead here, and I hope I can get a SNAD refund, and I hope the seller **does ** block me.
And I hope I learn my lesson.
@jmlanzaf said:
It sounds like he's interpreting "line" to mean physical damage not toning.
That's what I was wondering but it's hard to judge the seller's response without knowing what he was replying to.
Just to satisfy everyone's curiosity, and probably garner some further advice about my foolishness and lack of tact, here is what the seller was replying to:
_Photos of the coin do not show the distracting and obvious line (scuff mark?) running across the face of the coin. This detracts significantly from the eye-appeal... The photos were not an accurate representation of the coin s appearance
-and-
Sadly (and see my recent message), I'm not at all happy with the coin, and the distracting line across the face.
I'm hoping you can process a return, and I won't have to SNAD (never done one before).
Sorry this didn't work out, I really hoped it would look as good as the photos._
These along with the 2 pictures of the coin in question.
I think this horse is dead here, and I hope I can get a SNAD refund, and I hope the seller **does ** block me.
And I hope I learn my lesson.
Yeah, I wouldn't call that a scuff...
Yeah, toning line makes more sense. I was shocked by it, and didn't know WHAT it was.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
I've seen coins like this, though usually it's a darker streak lie from a rubber band. The seller's photos pretty much obscure most of that lighter area but as others have said, it's all about the lighting and the angle.
That being said, it would be hard for me to buy a key coin like this with no returns, That seller's response also leaves a lot to be desired, I certainly wouldn't do business with someone like that. This is too costly to chalk up to tuition, hopefully you can return it for a refund.
It would be nice if the buyer was able to return the coin for a refund. It would also be nice if the seller was made whole for his lost shipping expenses and fees. One of these things is likely, the other... ?
@MasonG said:
It would be nice if the buyer was able to return the coin for a refund. It would also be nice if the seller was made whole for his lost shipping expenses and fees. One of these things is likely, the other... ?
If the seller had offered to refund, less a shipping/restocking fee, that might seem fair. Doesn't look like we're going down that road.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
@moursund said:
If the seller had offered to refund, less a shipping/restocking fee, that might seem fair.
The terms were "no returns". You are the one who is insisting on ignoring them.
@moursund said:
Doesn't look like we're going down that road.
That's up to you, isn't it?
edited to add... There isn't a single coin listing on eBay that I couldn't buy and take a photo of that doesn't look like any of the ones the seller included in his listing. And based on that (this is what you've done here, BTW), claimed "SNAD". I know you don't want to spend $4000 on a coin you don't want, but a little humility here would go a long way.
@moursund said:
If the seller had offered to refund, less a shipping/restocking fee, that might seem fair.
The terms were "no returns". You are the one who is insisting on ignoring them.
@moursund said:
Doesn't look like we're going down that road.
That's up to you, isn't it?
edited to add... There isn't a single coin listing on eBay that I couldn't buy and take a photo of that doesn't look like any of the ones the seller included in his listing. And based on that (this is what you've done here, BTW), claimed "SNAD". I know you don't want to spend $4000 on a coin you don't want, but a little humility here would go a long way.
Sure, I was naive and didn't practice due diligence. I've now offered to pay for the return shipping and insurance. We'll see what they say.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
@moursund said:
Sure, I was naive and didn't practice due diligence. I've now offered to pay for the return shipping and insurance. We'll see what they say.
Good on you. I hope they agree.
Edited to add... The item listing appears to indicate that there was no charge for shipping. Perhaps if you were to offer to cover that expense, the seller might be more inclined to agree to a return?
I know you’re feeling bruised, but I hope you realize now that when buying a significant coin it is critical to feel comfortable with the seller in order to avoid situations like this. I also suggest patience in that it would be worth it to go to a coin show where you could see several examples and select what is right for you.
Seated Half Society member #38 "Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
@moursund said:
Sure, I was naive and didn't practice due diligence. I've now offered to pay for the return shipping and insurance. We'll see what they say.
Good on you. I hope they agree.
Edited to add... The item listing appears to indicate that there was no charge for shipping. Perhaps if you were to offer to cover that expense, the seller might be more inclined to agree to a return?
When I offered to pay for the return, the seller became conciliatory. Looks like we can handle this return without a snad.
Also, and you will think it amazing that I never noticed this before, I now realize that you can set your eBay filter to show only items that allow returns... 😉
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
This is actually the King of Morgans, and was going to be the second coin in my Box of 20.
The pictures are showing for the original listing.
$3,999 on a PCGS Price Guide Price of $3,000.
And part of your Box of 20.
Have you reached out to the seller?
Seems to me the seller's comment that the only way that that line could get there is by removing the coin from the holder, adding the line and resealing the holder is BS, esp. when the seller probably knew that the line was more visible in hand than in the auction photo. That alone would cause me to declare SNAD, esp. if I had a witness who would swear to the presence of the line/scuff and the fact that the slab wasn't tampered with.
If buyers wouldn't patronize eBay sellers who don't take returns, there would be very little activity on eBay.
Regardless no returns doesn't mean what it used to.
I don't much follow eBay policy changes, but it seems to me that some years ago there policy changed to disallow returns, but sellers were including it anyway. Whether it was ever officially rescinded or not I don't recall.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
If that feedback is forwarded to eBay they will delete such feedback and strike the buyer for doing so. It is called "negative-positive" feedback and is prohibited by eBay.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
If that feedback is forwarded to eBay they will delete such feedback and strike the buyer for doing so. It is called "negative-positive" feedback and is prohibited by eBay.
.
I didn't know that. Thanks for posting.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
@breakdown said:
That’s one of those coins that it is hard to imagine will ever find a happy home. The eye is immediately and inevitably drawn to the rubber band line.
For the right price. There’s a person for every coin and a coin for most every person. Toners, lo-ball registry? This coin just needs to find its price. 😉🙀🦫
What a lovely example for a type set. No, there’s a home and a value
No returns actually DO have a very good place for some very good resons.
in m,y case, I am starting to dispose of my low and lower end grades and lower value coins.
I make it clear coins I do not want a return and hence, I start each item at $1. I use 3 or more high definition images .
Sometimes I do even free shipping.
Just recently a buyer wanted to know this: he asked if he could return the coin if it was not silver.....
The coin in question was a Canadian 1 cent piece from 1882. silver??
I rest my case.....Buyer is blocked.
@BAJJERFAN said:
I wonder if the seller will re-list it with the same photos.
I wonder that as well. I suspect yes, but I'll be pleasantly surprised if the seller lowers the BIN significantly, and includes better photos.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
@breakdown said:
That’s one of those coins that it is hard to imagine will ever find a happy home. The eye is immediately and inevitably drawn to the rubber band line.
For the right price. There’s a person for every coin and a coin for most every person. Toners, lo-ball registry? This coin just needs to find its price. 😉🙀🦫
What a lovely example for a type set. No, there’s a home and a value
for a 50% discount, I'd be at least tempted to crack it out and put it in my Morgan album.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
After doing so, I had buyer's remorse. It is my fault for not thinking it through before placing an offer (that was quickly accepted). No matter what this coin looks like upon arrival (it's due in a couple of days), I am keeping it as I believe a contract is struck upon sending a "Best Offer," and that contract should be honored.
With that stated, the OP's situation is a bit different, and I think a return is warranted and should have been accepted by the seller as, unlike the coin I purchased (with all the flaws visible), the 1893-S didn't show the problem(s) that exist.
what is going on by the O in OF on the reverse? is the coin overstruck on another coin?
@breakdown said:
That’s one of those coins that it is hard to imagine will ever find a happy home. The eye is immediately and inevitably drawn to the rubber band line.
For the right price. There’s a person for every coin and a coin for most every person. Toners, lo-ball registry? This coin just needs to find its price. 😉🙀🦫
What a lovely example for a type set. No, there’s a home and a value
for a 50% discount, I'd be at least tempted to crack it out and put it in my Morgan album.
Do you really think that coin was purchased for $2000? Do you really think that toning line affects the grade at all?
And I thought you hated the look of that coin...I guess you could learn to love it at half guide...
@breakdown said:
That’s one of those coins that it is hard to imagine will ever find a happy home. The eye is immediately and inevitably drawn to the rubber band line.
For the right price. There’s a person for every coin and a coin for most every person. Toners, lo-ball registry? This coin just needs to find its price. 😉🙀🦫
What a lovely example for a type set. No, there’s a home and a value
for a 50% discount, I'd be at least tempted to crack it out and put it in my Morgan album.
Do you really think that coin was purchased for $2000? Do you really think that toning line affects the grade at all?
And I thought you hated the look of that coin...I guess you could learn to love it at half guide...
No, I said at half price I would be at least tempted to crack it into an album. To me, that's a different kettle of fish than 'box of 20, each and every one a beautiful coin forever'. Filling an album holds a different attraction.
100th pint of blood donated 7/19/2022 . Transactions with WilliamF, Relaxn, LukeMarshal, jclovescoins, braddick, JWP, Weather11am, Fairlaneman, Dscoins, lordmarcovan, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, JimW. God so loved the world that he gave his only begotten son, that who so believeth in him should not perish but have everlasting life.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
.
And no worries about your buyer Feedback
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
US Coins - Trade Dollars - Newly Listed
Out of the first 10 Sellers I found:
1 with 2 Negatives, 1 with 3 Negatives & 5 Neutrals, 1 with 1 Negative
How about that? Must be a mistake, eh?
I don't understand your point. Sellers can get negative feedback. Buyers can't. That's the policy that was posted.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
.
And no worries about your buyer Feedback
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
US Coins - Trade Dollars - Newly Listed
Out of the first 10 Sellers I found:
1 with 2 Negatives, 1 with 3 Negatives & 5 Neutrals, 1 with 1 Negative
How about that? Must be a mistake, eh?
I don't understand your point. Sellers can get negative feedback. Buyers can't. That's the policy that was posted.
My mistake. I misunderstood your comment. My fault entirely.
@PipestonePete said:
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
.
And no worries about your buyer Feedback
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
US Coins - Trade Dollars - Newly Listed
Out of the first 10 Sellers I found:
1 with 2 Negatives, 1 with 3 Negatives & 5 Neutrals, 1 with 1 Negative
How about that? Must be a mistake, eh?
I don't understand your point. Sellers can get negative feedback. Buyers can't. That's the policy that was posted.
My mistake. I misunderstood your comment. My fault entirely.
Comments
They won't even look. They'll just approve the return.
That's what I was wondering but it's hard to judge the seller's response without knowing what he was replying to.
Just to satisfy everyone's curiosity, and probably garner some further advice about my foolishness and lack of tact, here is what the seller was replying to:
_Photos of the coin do not show the distracting and obvious line (scuff mark?) running across the face of the coin. This detracts significantly from the eye-appeal... The photos were not an accurate representation of the coin s appearance
-and-
Sadly (and see my recent message), I'm not at all happy with the coin, and the distracting line across the face.
I'm hoping you can process a return, and I won't have to SNAD (never done one before).
Sorry this didn't work out, I really hoped it would look as good as the photos._
These along with the 2 pictures of the coin in question.
I think this horse is dead here, and I hope I can get a SNAD refund, and I hope the seller **does ** block me.
And I hope I learn my lesson.
The defining moment for a "great seller" is how they handle a division of opinion.
Moursund deserves a refund, no matter how he may have presented his objections to the seller.
peacockcoins
Yeah, I wouldn't call that a scuff...
Yeah, toning line makes more sense. I was shocked by it, and didn't know WHAT it was.
I've seen coins like this, though usually it's a darker streak lie from a rubber band. The seller's photos pretty much obscure most of that lighter area but as others have said, it's all about the lighting and the angle.
That being said, it would be hard for me to buy a key coin like this with no returns, That seller's response also leaves a lot to be desired, I certainly wouldn't do business with someone like that. This is too costly to chalk up to tuition, hopefully you can return it for a refund.
10-4,
My Instagram picturesErik
My registry sets
It would be nice if the buyer was able to return the coin for a refund. It would also be nice if the seller was made whole for his lost shipping expenses and fees. One of these things is likely, the other... ?
If the seller had offered to refund, less a shipping/restocking fee, that might seem fair. Doesn't look like we're going down that road.
The terms were "no returns". You are the one who is insisting on ignoring them.
That's up to you, isn't it?
edited to add... There isn't a single coin listing on eBay that I couldn't buy and take a photo of that doesn't look like any of the ones the seller included in his listing. And based on that (this is what you've done here, BTW), claimed "SNAD". I know you don't want to spend $4000 on a coin you don't want, but a little humility here would go a long way.
Sure, I was naive and didn't practice due diligence. I've now offered to pay for the return shipping and insurance. We'll see what they say.
"I've now offered to pay for the return shipping and insurance. We'll see what they say."
Very good!
I hope the seller is smart enough to accept.
Good on you. I hope they agree.
Edited to add... The item listing appears to indicate that there was no charge for shipping. Perhaps if you were to offer to cover that expense, the seller might be more inclined to agree to a return?
I know you’re feeling bruised, but I hope you realize now that when buying a significant coin it is critical to feel comfortable with the seller in order to avoid situations like this. I also suggest patience in that it would be worth it to go to a coin show where you could see several examples and select what is right for you.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
...Ebay pictures (and there are several) look like this:
.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
Yeah, I would just call that a toning streak.
When I offered to pay for the return, the seller became conciliatory. Looks like we can handle this return without a snad.
Also, and you will think it amazing that I never noticed this before, I now realize that you can set your eBay filter to show only items that allow returns... 😉
Seems to me the seller's comment that the only way that that line could get there is by removing the coin from the holder, adding the line and resealing the holder is BS, esp. when the seller probably knew that the line was more visible in hand than in the auction photo. That alone would cause me to declare SNAD, esp. if I had a witness who would swear to the presence of the line/scuff and the fact that the slab wasn't tampered with.
If buyers wouldn't patronize eBay sellers who don't take returns, there would be very little activity on eBay.
eBay search for "Morgan dollar" = 98,000+ results
eBay search for "Morgan dollar" & "Returns accepted" = 76,000+ results
Nearly 78% of the "Morgan dollar" listings allow for returns. Looks like more than "very little", but maybe that's just me.
Regardless no returns doesn't mean what it used to.
I don't much follow eBay policy changes, but it seems to me that some years ago there policy changed to disallow returns, but sellers were including it anyway. Whether it was ever officially rescinded or not I don't recall.
Is SNAD return info made available to prospective buyers/bidders?
I don't know. But then again, I'm not sure it would be of much use when "SNAD" can mean "I changed my mind and don't want it".
Ebay policy on returns is irrelevant. Credit card chargebacks are much easier and actually supercede ebay policy.
There is no such thing as "no returns" unless you exchange cash in an alley.
You tried to do it the easy way but were rejected. SNAD is now appropriate for this coin.
SNAD may indeed be the easiest route to conclude this return. You will officially have Ebay in your corner if you procede that way.
.
And no worries about your buyer Feedback score:
"Sellers are NOT able to leave negative or neutral Feedback for Buyers.
That is, all ebay seller Feedback is scored as positive.
But sellers can still post negatively-worded feedback -- as if anybody reads that stuff.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
This thread has been educational for sure!
K
If that feedback is forwarded to eBay they will delete such feedback and strike the buyer for doing so. It is called "negative-positive" feedback and is prohibited by eBay.
peacockcoins
.
I didn't know that. Thanks for posting.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
I wonder if the seller will re-list it with the same photos.
That’s one of those coins that it is hard to imagine will ever find a happy home. The eye is immediately and inevitably drawn to the rubber band line.
"Look up, old boy, and see what you get." -William Bonney.
For the right price. There’s a person for every coin and a coin for most every person. Toners, lo-ball registry? This coin just needs to find its price. 😉🙀🦫
What a lovely example for a type set. No, there’s a home and a value
🎶 shout shout, let it all out 🎶
No returns actually DO have a very good place for some very good resons.
in m,y case, I am starting to dispose of my low and lower end grades and lower value coins.
I make it clear coins I do not want a return and hence, I start each item at $1. I use 3 or more high definition images .
Sometimes I do even free shipping.
Just recently a buyer wanted to know this: he asked if he could return the coin if it was not silver.....
The coin in question was a Canadian 1 cent piece from 1882. silver??
I rest my case.....Buyer is blocked.
I wonder that as well. I suspect yes, but I'll be pleasantly surprised if the seller lowers the BIN significantly, and includes better photos.
for a 50% discount, I'd be at least tempted to crack it out and put it in my Morgan album.
what is going on by the O in OF on the reverse? is the coin overstruck on another coin?
Perhaps a clashed die? I hadn't noticed it.
This coin should arrive Tuesday, I'll take a better look then.
peacockcoins
Do you really think that coin was purchased for $2000? Do you really think that toning line affects the grade at all?
And I thought you hated the look of that coin...I guess you could learn to love it at half guide...
No, I said at half price I would be at least tempted to crack it into an album. To me, that's a different kettle of fish than 'box of 20, each and every one a beautiful coin forever'. Filling an album holds a different attraction.
US Coins - Trade Dollars - Newly Listed
Out of the first 10 Sellers I found:
1 with 2 Negatives, 1 with 3 Negatives & 5 Neutrals, 1 with 1 Negative
How about that? Must be a mistake, eh?
I don't understand your point. Sellers can get negative feedback. Buyers can't. That's the policy that was posted.
My mistake. I misunderstood your comment. My fault entirely.
It wasn't my comment, but thanks.