All You Guys Need to Get Off the Dime.
cladking
Posts: 28,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
I mean it, let's shake a leg. Ralph Kramden was once cursed by being wished a rich uncle would die and leave him a million dollars... ...in bus tokens. Well, I've been cursed in this way. I spent a lifetime accumulating rare modern world coins that had no demand at all. I could smell rarity from a mile away and could peruse coins at the rate of thousands per hour without missing much of anything. I stuffed safety deposit boxes with Gems of coins rarely even seen in Unc.
Now demand is up a hundred fold and prices are often just through the roof. Sets I paid a few dollars for and stashed away when they listed for $20 now routinely sell for $500.
The problem is simple enough; even though demand is up so much it's still infinitesimal compared to 18th century coins. Where old coins can be sold almost anywhere for half their value or more it requires great effort and a world wide audience to sell my coins for even a tenth of their real value. I've still got a bunch of safety deposit boxes I'd like to dispose of before I shuffle off this mortal coil and at the rate I'm moving them I'll have to live to at least 968.
Surely there's some modern set you've always wanted to assemble. well quit dawdling and do it!
I'm not looking for sympathy here since I deserve none, I'm looking for obedience.
I've been able to sell some of the US material even though it probably involves leaving a lot of money on the table but the foreign is especially difficult. A lot of world modern that is very rare still lists at low prices as well because it is not being collected.
I have no intention of proceeding without you so you might as well cooperate.
Comments
Thin markets can't survive hoards. Once the two serious collectors have their specimens the markets die.
"Real value" is what buyers are willing to pay.
There is very little interest in moderns. Even rare moderns.
My modern Mexican patterns underwhelmed at auction. They may be extremely rare, but people cannot get worked up over them to actually pay real money for them.
On the other hand, literal crap from the 18th & 19th Centuries did very well.
It's not fair. It's not right. Live with it. It's not going to change in our lifetimes.
My problem isn't what the coins will bring. It's the difficulty in selling them. These aren't rare coins made in tiny numbers and they aren't saleable based on being high grade. Many are not "high grade" at all and merely nice attractive BU. Most were made in huge numbers and have a very very wide collector base but it is in the hundreds or maybe thousands and not in the millions like the demand for old coins. I can sell them at a good price but it's a great deal of work and I have to consign almost everything.
I can sympathize with you not being able to get a good price on rare patterns but this is not the issue I have. My problem is just that the markets are thin and widespread because most US collectors hate moderns.
Yes, I've been having an easy time dumping older coins for more than they are worth. Collectors have misled the general public into believing older coins are better because they are scarcer so old sells and rarity does not.
You might be surprised just how few "hoards" I have. Simply stated it was hard to find even one example of most of my best coins. Indeed, there are dozens of moderns with high mintages that I was never able to find even a single example. Most of my favorite coins I have fewer than a dozen examples of.
I did have a few opportunities to acquire hoards of currently popular coins but who knew? There are still no real catalog prices for most of this stuff because the publishers are all modern bashers and understate the value or they pay no attention to the markets and overstate it.
I'm not trying to complain about sale prices. When you pay a couple dollars for something it doesn't matter too much if you sell it for $500 or $1000. I just want to sell it and that's what's hard.
""Real value" is what buyers are willing to pay."
I expect that eventually moderns will be more popular than the old coins. They'll be a victim of their own success. This will take many years to develop and it will require a lot more people to collect them. We collectors are a fickle lot and tend to flock to whatever is hot and then like all people we want to be with the "in-group". We tend to buy high and sell low just like everyone else.
Me? I'd much rather be buying but it's time to unload.
If what you are trying to do is to sell much of the stuff that you have, then you are using the wrong tone. What I get from your posts is that you bought many many modern world coins and are trying to find a way to offload them. The way I read it is that you have a lot of stuff that no one wants ... what do I do?
I was going for humor. It apparently failed.
With an 18th century coin there might be 10,000 of them but there are 20,000 collectors so they are easily sold. connecting with a buyer is easy. With a modern there may be 10 of them and 20 collectors. Connecting with a collector is difficult.
As I said I don't really care about getting full value because it's all profit anyway; I just want them sold.
I don't really think anyone should collect moderns. I think everyone should collect whatever they find interesting and enjoyable.
Find some young guys who will list them on eBay or instagram on your behalf
if you paid a couple dollars per
coin or set ….like you mentioned …sell them for 10, 15 or 25 to 50 bucks and give them a 50 % cut after expenses .
They can move them for you on these platforms at basically low prices ( I’m guessing ) to newer collectors especially instagram 😊
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Moderns are not always Modern, especially if you live to be 968!
There are many portions of the ancient and medieval market that tend to fluctuate wildly due to limited collector demand, even though the issues are rare (absolute and conditionally). It’s not just a modern coin phenomena.
My area of expertise is medieval, and even though British medieval is a mature market relative to other parts of the world, it would be challenging to maximize liquidation without the right venue and promotion. Certainly other areas share this problem.
Let me know when you are going to sell as there are some moderns that I collect for Love, not Profit! Even if it is when you put them on ebay.....
Well, just Love coins, period.
That's was funny. 😂
I'll take your Spanish colonialals. ☺️
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
CK, are you with us? Picture a couple as teases....
Well, just Love coins, period.
I've got buyers lined up for the Russian and Indian as well as the best of the Chinese but little else. I don't have a lot of any of the better stuff but I started buying Gems in 1976 and liked the scarcer coins a lot more than common ones. I have a little bit of Swiss and love their remarkably nice mint sets. There's no demand though.
I worked hard on Russia but just couldn't find the stuff no matter how hard I worked. I rarely shopped lists and this is where I went wrong. I always wanted to see stuff before I bought it. When I bought a $200 Russian mint set for $2 it just wouldn't matter today if the coins weren't as nice or some were tarnished. I have a really nice high end Gem 1970 Gambian 8S at hand. Perhaps I'll try to get a picture and post it. This coin isn't as tough as its price might suggest but most specimens are typical at best.
I could get the last laugh yet. Realistically though there are likely to be a few safety deposit boxes left for my heirs.
When you think in terms of great pyramids and trees of life it's hard to think there are any coins that aren't modern. Even by our standards though the "moderns" that began worldwide in 1946 are getting very long in the tooth now days. In less than a quarter century they'll start turning 100 years old.
I have a vintage mason jar full of uncirculated pre-Euro Italian Republic coins. I see them staying in that jar. Displays nicely.
I hesitate to jump into such a mess, but what do you have from Germany?
I knew it would happen.
Just odds and ends mostly.
I picked up a few BU's but not many Gems.
I don't really want to try selling here. It may be years before I start offering these coins.
I only want silver and gold world moderns ...sometimes
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Ah, Sam, we understand. I think it is the fanatic in all of us & look forward to what may be. Shortly I will note a coin that I got that is the type that would have been right up your alley.....I'll wait until delivery though, and the price was definitely right.
Well, just Love coins, period.
What kind of prices are you asking?
I ask because in the past, the examples you used in your posts weren't worth anywhere near what you claimed or believed, going by the limited prior sales.
It's not just world "moderns" either. I no longer buy South Africa Union but still have somewhere in the vicinity of 100 slabbed coins, a combination of better AU, MS and proofs. The better proofs aren't that hard to sell but everything else is difficult because no one outside of South Africa will pay the supposed "market price". The pricing is bifurcated. There is one South African price and a second international (mostly US) price. I don't follow this coinage much at all anymore and the spread isn't as large as it used to be since the prices have collapsed, but it's still there somewhat.
It's also uneconomical to sell low value coins to non-US buyers because of the shipping costs which now represent a disproportionate percentage of the value. When I used to somewhat regularly on eBay over 10 years ago, I'd still list group slabbed lots for this reason.
I haven't tried to sell much in a long time and it was from a few countries or series. Having said that, my inference is that a lot of it also has to do with who is doing the selling. Well known dealers don't have any trouble selling the same coins I do because the buyer doesn't know me. I didn't have this problem when I sold most of my better South African coins back from 2009-2011 but that's because buyers in that country knew me.
For most collectors attempting to sell, my inference is that they have the same challenge you do, even if it involves world "classics". If you are selling world gold, popular world crowns, or minors from a low number of series or countries, it's easy to sell. Otherwise, not. A few years ago, I sold a few pillars and colonial quarter real in better grades. Those sold easily. The Spanish 18th century MS, only to Spanish based collectors. No one else wanted it and my ask prices weren't "moon money" either.
No matter what aspect of coin collecting appeals to one the most of us enjoy buying, selling, and trading them and we assemble collections. You post a lot of very rare coins. Some of these aren't very important but most will be the scarcities of the future. Even unimportant ones though will surely have a demand higher than the mintage. There are a lot of really great moderns with mintages under 1000 that are inexpensive and very highly desirable.
My favorite moderns are high mintage coins that just weren't saved and then the worn out ones were turned into refrigerators and washing machines.
Frankly I'd be ecstatic to get 40 to 80% of what other sellers are getting right now.
For some reason my coins just aren't selling well.
Are they certified? If so, Great Collections WILL sell whatever you consign. Fer Shure!
Done and gone.
Most of them are worth only 10 to $50. These aren't worth it are they?
I do have some much more valuable ones as well including mint and proof sets. If I certify these will they sell at market prices? They cost about $30 each to grade, right?
per coin. Yours are for sale Sam?
Well, just Love coins, period.
Yes and no.
I'll sell everything that has already skyrocketed or that I've given up on ever going higher. I'd throw in some of the still cheap stuff if someone wanted a lot of it. I'm thinking 100% of eBay prices for Gems and at least 50% for chBU. I'd probably hold back most of the superb Gems and a few chGems. I've got some stuff that is Gem for coins that are rarely seen choice.
I'm nearing the point I could be called a motivated seller. Most of these are in safety deposit boxes I've yet to get to.
Your tastes in modern world are so sophisticated I'm not sure a lot of it would interest you at all. A lot of it is high mintage seldom seen coins.
I'm still investigating but it looks like they mostly sell older coins. I have some older coins but little trouble selling them.