@1948_Swell_Robinson said:
There is a Patrick Mahomes card at Goldin currently bid up to $425,000 that is ending tonight....someone must have went all in with their stimulus money
Due to increase in food prices, poor folks no longer will be able to continue to use there $1200 in stimulus money towards PSA8 1952 Mantle's and 1933 PSA9 Goudy Ruth's
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Well, central banks injected 9 trillion dollars of stimulus into global economies the past 2 years so ya, stimulus is impacting the price of that Mahomes card.
Again, this amount of stimulus is far greater then the 1500 cheques received or the support programs for bartenders. A significant portion of that 9t made it’s way to the top, Bezos net worth up 40b. I think Musk close to double that.
If all that money that was printed was removed from the economy that Mahomes would sell for a fraction of that price.
Heard a BofA analyst today call this moment peak asset, I agree. Not sure people understand the scale of stimulus that was injected into economies the past 2 years.
I don't pretend to be a stock expert, but I do know just from the headlines that at least two of those stocks listed above released earnings reports that immediately pushed their stock prices down, which hardly makes them evidence of a crash.
When a company's stock tanks after earnings are released, that means they had a bad quarter. Why did they have a bad quarter? Inflation is cutting into profits. Inflation will eventually choke out the ridiculous prices currently being paid in the sports card hobby. Remember, it's just a hobby. We all have to eat, but no one has to buy sports cards.
There is a Patrick Mahomes card at Goldin currently bid up to $425,000 that is ending tonight....someone must have went all in with their stimulus money
Just becaause someone is bidding $425k for a card doesn't mean they'll ever pay for it. I rarely auction anything on eBay any more because of all the nonpaying bidders.
There is a Patrick Mahomes card at Goldin currently bid up to $425,000 that is ending tonight....someone must have went all in with their stimulus money
Just becaause someone is bidding $425k for a card doesn't mean they'll ever pay for it. I rarely auction anything on eBay any more because of all the nonpaying bidders.
There are many similar priced ones in that same auction at Goldin. I highly doubt none of them will get paid. I'm sure some do go unpaid, but not at the level you are thinking.
Like the beaten down stocks because of the fear mongering during covid, when they drop, just buy more. Fear mongering has a temporary effect. If you are right and elite vintage HOF cards see a drop in five years, I will be shopping, because in the test of time, those have maintained their value or have gone up.
I agree and have concerns over the market where there are 50 PSA 9's or 20 PSA 10's to buy on Ebay on any given day of the week. Sellers holding out top dollar on those...one will cave eventually and then another. Then those will probably correct.
Part of the food inflation you are seeing is coming from policies/leaders creating a supply shortage/worker shortage....because the demand for food has not changed a single bit from before covid, during covid, or now. That will settle down when the causes of that inflation are no longer there.
Anyway, I'm still buying eggs for .99 cents or so a dozen. 72 grams of protein for a buck...can't beat that. There are viable options.
@dan89 said:
Dr J rookies at the peak in an 8 were 8-10K. Now In an 8 they are 3-4K. Agree on volume of 86 Jordan, however demand is strong and the Doc rookie may have taken a bigger hit since peak?
The above is accurate. I still kick myself for not getting rid of my Dr. J rookie and my Jim Brown rookie at their peaks.
Successful coin BST transactions with Gerard and segoja.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Didn't realize the 54 Brown was so far off peak price, an 8 sold for 60K a year ago and the most recent sale was 27K. Now looking at the history, hard to believe the two prices that Heritage realized. Not sure if funny stuff was going on there. But if they are to believed, then that card is way down.
Heritage also sold the Rose 9 in 2016 for 131k, that card sold for 75% less over the coming years. In fact sold a year later, by Heritage, for 40K lol.
Think the morale of the story here is don't trust Heritage? And also, prices on this stuff will swing dramatically, and that a lot of this stuff is way off peak already and we haven't even entered a tightening cycle.
@lawyer05 said:
PSA should allow registry set builders get a economy rate or we will never be able to finish our sets and this taking the fun out of collecting
The 1990 Fleer Jordan....yikes...when 10's are that common your instincts should tell you something right away. Plus there are tons of those tucked in closets somewhere. Heck, I know of several raw 1986 Fleer Jordan's still tucked in closets waiting to hit the market.
I think even as late as 1990, 10s are fairly hard to come by, though the cards are so plentiful it is easy enough to find 100 of them and get a 10 or two among them. Someone posted a stack of cards a few days ago that included a 1990 Hoops Jordan in 8. Now 1990 Hoops is roughly as common as dirt, and it is reasonable to expect 8s straight out of the pack. I was astonished to learn that that card has sold between $15 and $50 in the past month!
Um. There is not a recent market "crash." That's a patently absurd contention.
Don't comment about something you know nothing about:
Stocks prices this past week or so:
1) Paypal was $175.80 on 2/1 and it closed at $126.08 on 2/4.
2) Facebook was $323.00 on 2/2 and it closed at $237.00 on 2/4.
3) Netflix was $457.13 on 2/1 and it closed at $410.17 on 2/4.
4) Ford was $20.63 on 2/1 and it closed at $17.96 on 2/4
5) Clorox closed at $168.74 on 2/1 and it closed at $141.41 on 2/4.
I think I proved my point that you are wrong, yet again.
Oh my goodness. Even the stocks you [pathetically] hand-picked to prove your "point" would not be considered a crash; just sad. Let me dumb this down for you:
You were wrong. There has NOT been a stock market crash that you have referenced. Your ineptitude reminds me of a Headline News type undersanding of large issues.
At worst, the market has proven to be "choppy" the past 6-12 months.
Guys, please continue the debate, but leave the personal attacks and name calling out. It is the same guys getting heated here that I have warned for doing the same in other threads. It is not difficult to disagree without attacking someone. Next time is happens, here or elsewhere, I will just ban without warning.
Todd Tobias - Grateful Collector - I focus on autographed American Football League sets, Fleer & Topps, 1960-1969, and lacrosse cards.
Todd, I do sincerely apologize for my role in this thread's devolution. However, it is a recurring theme on here that, whenever anything even remotely pro-PWCC (or even neutral-PWCC) is posted, the "predictable jackals" come out in full force, and nastily.
I am merely defending myself and my ethics on here.
You are always fair and I must admit that I have stepped out of line in the past.
There is a Patrick Mahomes card at Goldin currently bid up to $425,000 that is ending tonight....someone must have went all in with their stimulus money
Just becaause someone is bidding $425k for a card doesn't mean they'll ever pay for it. I rarely auction anything on eBay any more because of all the nonpaying bidders.
voxels123, my personal stalker! Took you four days to reply to my post. Take your hostility elsewhere. i won't put up with it and neither should the mods. Your personal attacks need to stop.
A 1958 Pele card graded PSA 9 just sold for $1.33M. It was owned by some fractional ownership company (Rally Rd), and had 464 investors in it. Evidently, the exact same card (by PSA serial #) was sold by Goldin Auctions for $288,000 in Nov 2020; so, in 15 months, the card went from $288G to $1.33M!
This exemplifies the huge problem for collectors now; an individual collector is not competing against other individual collectors.....they're competing against these "fractional ownership" groups and hedge fund managers. It isn't one collector competing against another collector; it's one collector competing against 464 combined investors!
@MisterTim1962 said:
voxels123, my personal stalker! Took you four days to reply to my post. Take your hostility elsewhere. i won't put up with it and neither should the mods. Your personal attacks need to stop.
It really is sad to come on here and see what used to be an enjoyable forum devolve into middle aged men typing mean comments to each other. Honestly just feel bad for some of you who haven't emotionally matured past 12 years old. Can we just start handing out suspensions for the members who constantly troll? These threads are brutal.
Seriously, Todd issues a warning like 6 posts back, and someone responds with an apology and then immediately in the VERY NEXT POST starts another argument. Toddlers have more self control.
@West22 said:
It really is sad to come on here and see what used to be an enjoyable forum devolve into middle aged men typing mean comments to each other. Honestly just feel bad for some of you who haven't emotionally matured past 12 years old. Can we just start handing out suspensions for the members who constantly troll? These threads are brutal.
Dear West22,
To assume I am a middle-aged man is most unfortunate. Why would you assume as such? Get woke, bro!
I pointed out a solid fact that Goldin auctions are well-patrolled and one should not make off-the-cuff remarks about their items not selling. If that's trolling, so be it. Bro.
Anyways, it sounds like you have a not-so-subtle hankerin' to become an oh-so-official moderator. Why don't you contact the Collectors Forum higher-ups and request such privileges?
I would think that being a moderator is difficult, balancing big brother censorship w/ tyranny of the masses.
But you seem to have a clear handle on such matters.
It really is sad to come on here and see what used to be an enjoyable forum devolve into middle aged men typing mean comments to each other. Honestly just feel bad for some of you who haven't emotionally matured past 12 years old. Can we just start handing out suspensions for the members who constantly troll? These threads are brutal.
You complain about "mean comments" here, but then you insult us! Lol! (just teasing you).
I do agree that some here feel the need to insult people when they disagree with their point of view. Everyone has an opinion. No need to try and belittle or insult someone just because you don't like their point of view.
It would be great if you can to please shut this down. And my vote is you be more assertive to block out the noise and get rid of those not contributing in any positive way.
@West22 said:
It really is sad to come on here and see what used to be an enjoyable forum devolve into middle aged men typing mean comments to each other. Honestly just feel bad for some of you who haven't emotionally matured past 12 years old. Can we just start handing out suspensions for the members who constantly troll? These threads are brutal.
Dear West22,
To assume I am a middle-aged man is most unfortunate. Why would you assume as such? Get woke, bro!
I pointed out a solid fact that Goldin auctions are well-patrolled and one should not make off-the-cuff remarks about their items not selling. If that's trolling, so be it. Bro.
Anyways, it sounds like you have a not-so-subtle hankerin' to become an oh-so-official moderator. Why don't you contact the Collectors Forum higher-ups and request such privileges?
I would think that being a moderator is difficult, balancing big brother censorship w/ tyranny of the masses.
But you seem to have a clear handle on such matters.
Best regards.
I actually agree with your argument, but you and some others have a very abrasive and confrontational manner in which you present your ideas. There really is no good reason for it. Just be pleasant. When you really think about it, we’re a bunch of grown men fighting over little pieces of cardboard. I’m not asking for censorship. Just be cool.
I honestly don't see fighting over cards; it's more about egos and personalities on here. But I am glad you agree with my argument. My points are always fair. And you might be a good moderator someday, who knows? I always say to my kids - reach for the stars!
When I'm attacked, I will always respond intelligently and appropriately. I owe that to myself, and those who read my comments. I will never call names or be unfair.
I have now banned a couple of people who refused to fall back in line after my warning. If you feel the need to defend yourself from a post on this forum, instead of fighting back, please send me a DM and let me handle it. I want to let you all discuss things and be as "hands off" as possible, but when things devolve into personal attacks and throwing around baseless speculation as though it is fact, I need to step in. It's not that difficult to be civil on a message board.
Todd Tobias - Grateful Collector - I focus on autographed American Football League sets, Fleer & Topps, 1960-1969, and lacrosse cards.
This seems like a pretty straightforward question at least economical…Inflation raises prices of assets and cards are assets so card prices will rise.
Now not every single card will rise and not all cards will rise at the same rate but a general representation of all cards will rise over time. Just follow the prices of Ty Cobb and Honus Wagner rookies over time and you will see that every decade they are more expensive than the decade before because of inflation.
@rtimmer said:
This seems like a pretty straightforward question at least economical…Inflation raises prices of assets and cards are assets so card prices will rise.
Maybe but maybe not. Prices for cards rose astronomically after COVID hit and have generally been coming down in the last year or so. That bubble could continue to deflate even in an overall inflationary environment. Not saying it will but I think it is certainly a possibility. Also, even if nominal card values increase, real values (i.e., prices adjusted for inflation) will still decrease if inflation increases faster than nominal card values increase.
Comments
Due to increase in food prices, poor folks no longer will be able to continue to use there $1200 in stimulus money towards PSA8 1952 Mantle's and 1933 PSA9 Goudy Ruth's
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Well, central banks injected 9 trillion dollars of stimulus into global economies the past 2 years so ya, stimulus is impacting the price of that Mahomes card.
Again, this amount of stimulus is far greater then the 1500 cheques received or the support programs for bartenders. A significant portion of that 9t made it’s way to the top, Bezos net worth up 40b. I think Musk close to double that.
If all that money that was printed was removed from the economy that Mahomes would sell for a fraction of that price.
Heard a BofA analyst today call this moment peak asset, I agree. Not sure people understand the scale of stimulus that was injected into economies the past 2 years.
PSA should allow registry set builders get a economy rate or we will never be able to finish our sets and this taking the fun out of collecting
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_from_Panama
When a company's stock tanks after earnings are released, that means they had a bad quarter. Why did they have a bad quarter? Inflation is cutting into profits. Inflation will eventually choke out the ridiculous prices currently being paid in the sports card hobby. Remember, it's just a hobby. We all have to eat, but no one has to buy sports cards.
Just becaause someone is bidding $425k for a card doesn't mean they'll ever pay for it. I rarely auction anything on eBay any more because of all the nonpaying bidders.
There are many similar priced ones in that same auction at Goldin. I highly doubt none of them will get paid. I'm sure some do go unpaid, but not at the level you are thinking.
Like the beaten down stocks because of the fear mongering during covid, when they drop, just buy more. Fear mongering has a temporary effect. If you are right and elite vintage HOF cards see a drop in five years, I will be shopping, because in the test of time, those have maintained their value or have gone up.
I agree and have concerns over the market where there are 50 PSA 9's or 20 PSA 10's to buy on Ebay on any given day of the week. Sellers holding out top dollar on those...one will cave eventually and then another. Then those will probably correct.
Part of the food inflation you are seeing is coming from policies/leaders creating a supply shortage/worker shortage....because the demand for food has not changed a single bit from before covid, during covid, or now. That will settle down when the causes of that inflation are no longer there.
Anyway, I'm still buying eggs for .99 cents or so a dozen. 72 grams of protein for a buck...can't beat that. There are viable options.
The above is accurate. I still kick myself for not getting rid of my Dr. J rookie and my Jim Brown rookie at their peaks.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Didn't realize the 54 Brown was so far off peak price, an 8 sold for 60K a year ago and the most recent sale was 27K. Now looking at the history, hard to believe the two prices that Heritage realized. Not sure if funny stuff was going on there. But if they are to believed, then that card is way down.
Heritage also sold the Rose 9 in 2016 for 131k, that card sold for 75% less over the coming years. In fact sold a year later, by Heritage, for 40K lol.
Think the morale of the story here is don't trust Heritage? And also, prices on this stuff will swing dramatically, and that a lot of this stuff is way off peak already and we haven't even entered a tightening cycle.
Which PSA has always said they intend to do.
I think even as late as 1990, 10s are fairly hard to come by, though the cards are so plentiful it is easy enough to find 100 of them and get a 10 or two among them. Someone posted a stack of cards a few days ago that included a 1990 Hoops Jordan in 8. Now 1990 Hoops is roughly as common as dirt, and it is reasonable to expect 8s straight out of the pack. I was astonished to learn that that card has sold between $15 and $50 in the past month!
Oh my goodness. Even the stocks you [pathetically] hand-picked to prove your "point" would not be considered a crash; just sad. Let me dumb this down for you:
You were wrong. There has NOT been a stock market crash that you have referenced. Your ineptitude reminds me of a Headline News type undersanding of large issues.
At worst, the market has proven to be "choppy" the past 6-12 months.
Period.
Guys, please continue the debate, but leave the personal attacks and name calling out. It is the same guys getting heated here that I have warned for doing the same in other threads. It is not difficult to disagree without attacking someone. Next time is happens, here or elsewhere, I will just ban without warning.
Todd, I do sincerely apologize for my role in this thread's devolution. However, it is a recurring theme on here that, whenever anything even remotely pro-PWCC (or even neutral-PWCC) is posted, the "predictable jackals" come out in full force, and nastily.
I am merely defending myself and my ethics on here.
You are always fair and I must admit that I have stepped out of line in the past.
Best regards,
voxels123
Goldin is NOT eBay. This card will sell.
voxels123, my personal stalker! Took you four days to reply to my post. Take your hostility elsewhere. i won't put up with it and neither should the mods. Your personal attacks need to stop.
.
I just saw this on espn.com:
A 1958 Pele card graded PSA 9 just sold for $1.33M. It was owned by some fractional ownership company (Rally Rd), and had 464 investors in it. Evidently, the exact same card (by PSA serial #) was sold by Goldin Auctions for $288,000 in Nov 2020; so, in 15 months, the card went from $288G to $1.33M!
This exemplifies the huge problem for collectors now; an individual collector is not competing against other individual collectors.....they're competing against these "fractional ownership" groups and hedge fund managers. It isn't one collector competing against another collector; it's one collector competing against 464 combined investors!
https://www.espn.com/sports/soccer/story/_/id/33272568/pele-rookie-card-becomes-soccer-first-1-million-card-sells-133-million
Steve
huh?
the card will sell on Goldin. Period.
Sorry you were wrong.
Humm, so what you got for sale lol
"Knowledge speaks, but wisdom listens" Jimi Hendrix.
instagram dgilbert008
It really is sad to come on here and see what used to be an enjoyable forum devolve into middle aged men typing mean comments to each other. Honestly just feel bad for some of you who haven't emotionally matured past 12 years old. Can we just start handing out suspensions for the members who constantly troll? These threads are brutal.
Seriously, Todd issues a warning like 6 posts back, and someone responds with an apology and then immediately in the VERY NEXT POST starts another argument. Toddlers have more self control.
Dear West22,
To assume I am a middle-aged man is most unfortunate. Why would you assume as such? Get woke, bro!
I pointed out a solid fact that Goldin auctions are well-patrolled and one should not make off-the-cuff remarks about their items not selling. If that's trolling, so be it. Bro.
Anyways, it sounds like you have a not-so-subtle hankerin' to become an oh-so-official moderator. Why don't you contact the Collectors Forum higher-ups and request such privileges?
I would think that being a moderator is difficult, balancing big brother censorship w/ tyranny of the masses.
But you seem to have a clear handle on such matters.
Best regards.
.
You complain about "mean comments" here, but then you insult us! Lol! (just teasing you).
I do agree that some here feel the need to insult people when they disagree with their point of view. Everyone has an opinion. No need to try and belittle or insult someone just because you don't like their point of view.
MOD,
It would be great if you can to please shut this down. And my vote is you be more assertive to block out the noise and get rid of those not contributing in any positive way.
This forum deserves better.
I actually agree with your argument, but you and some others have a very abrasive and confrontational manner in which you present your ideas. There really is no good reason for it. Just be pleasant. When you really think about it, we’re a bunch of grown men fighting over little pieces of cardboard. I’m not asking for censorship. Just be cool.
West22:
I honestly don't see fighting over cards; it's more about egos and personalities on here. But I am glad you agree with my argument. My points are always fair. And you might be a good moderator someday, who knows? I always say to my kids - reach for the stars!
When I'm attacked, I will always respond intelligently and appropriately. I owe that to myself, and those who read my comments. I will never call names or be unfair.
Best regards.
I have now banned a couple of people who refused to fall back in line after my warning. If you feel the need to defend yourself from a post on this forum, instead of fighting back, please send me a DM and let me handle it. I want to let you all discuss things and be as "hands off" as possible, but when things devolve into personal attacks and throwing around baseless speculation as though it is fact, I need to step in. It's not that difficult to be civil on a message board.
This seems like a pretty straightforward question at least economical…Inflation raises prices of assets and cards are assets so card prices will rise.
Now not every single card will rise and not all cards will rise at the same rate but a general representation of all cards will rise over time. Just follow the prices of Ty Cobb and Honus Wagner rookies over time and you will see that every decade they are more expensive than the decade before because of inflation.
Join the Rookie stars on top PSA registry today:
1980-1989 Cello Packs - Rookies
Maybe but maybe not. Prices for cards rose astronomically after COVID hit and have generally been coming down in the last year or so. That bubble could continue to deflate even in an overall inflationary environment. Not saying it will but I think it is certainly a possibility. Also, even if nominal card values increase, real values (i.e., prices adjusted for inflation) will still decrease if inflation increases faster than nominal card values increase.