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Non-Mexican Cap & Rays Numismatic Items

pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited September 12, 2022 3:27PM in World & Ancient Coins Forum

I mainly collect non-US things, but I am fascinated by the use of the cap & rays device on coins, tokens, and medals of other (non-Mexican) countries. Here's a sampling of the US part of my cap & rays collection. I try to buy pieces in silver, if possible.


1836 US Pattern Gold $1 Judd-69 [silver] (ex Simpson)
(1860s restrike. About 10 known in this metal.)


1850 US Pattern Trime Judd-125 [silver]
(Common as patterns go.)


1849 US Territorial Gold Pacific Company Pattern Quarter Eagle [gilt silver]
(Very rare.)



1834 US Hard Times Token [brassy-looking bronze] (ex Partrick, Bowers, Miller)
(Very scarce.)


(1864) US Bolen Medalet [silver] (ex Garrett, Cogen)
(Only one known.)



1864 Another Bolen Medalet [silver] (ex Bowers, Tanenbaum, Cogen, Woodward)
(One of two now known.)


1864 Die trial of the Bolen cap & rays design before the rays were engraved [lead] (ex Bolen)
(Finest of 3 known.)



1836 US First Coinage from a Steam Press Medal [bronzed copper] (ex The Strong)
(I actually have this medal in silver, but don't have a good photo since it's in a NGC slab.)

Comments

  • bidaskbidask Posts: 13,823 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Wowee !

    I manage money. I earn money. I save money .
    I give away money. I collect money.
    I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.




  • 1960NYGiants1960NYGiants Posts: 3,441 ✭✭✭✭

    That is a very nice collection!

    Gene

    Life member #369 of the Royal Canadian Numismatic Association
    Member of Canadian Association of Token Collectors

    Collector of:
    Canadian coins and pre-confederation tokens
    Darkside proof/mint sets dated 1960
    My Ebay
  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Posts: 1,656 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Those pieces are beautiful and I think it's very easy to see how they are a great non-Mexican compliment to a collection/collector of Mexican material.

  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,492 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very nice pieces!

    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 18, 2022 11:19AM

    I'm working on some European pieces now.

    Here is one from Great Britain that I recently picked up (a Conder token):

    And one from France. (As an aside, I've heard of Liberty, Equality, and Fraternity, but Probity? This is the first time I've seen that in the slogan.)

  • BoosibriBoosibri Posts: 11,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Outstanding pieces as always

  • neildrobertsonneildrobertson Posts: 1,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Those are all wonderful. It's still funny to me that a cap like that every became the symbol that it did. Such a silly thing.

    IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
    "Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2022 11:54AM

    Here's another one that I forgot I had. This is a reproduction of the first steam press medal, in gold, engraved by Ron Landis at the Gallery Mint for the ANA. The history behind the piece is as follows.

    In 1999, the Franklin Institute in Philadelphia lent the first US steam coining press (the one that struck the original medals in 1836) to the ANA. As a fundraiser to help with the expenses of moving the press from Philadelphia to Colorado Springs, the ANA sold (20) 22K gold examples, (200) 0.999 silver examples, and (2000) copper examples of the Ron Landis reproduction. I purchased one of each. ANA Press Release.

    Here is an image of the gold medal. (This is not my example since mine is still raw and I don't have a good photo. This is an example that was sold by Stacks in 2014. To the best of my knowledge, no others have been publicly sold since that time.)


  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Posts: 1,656 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2022 10:42AM

    @pruebas said:
    Adding my newp. Now I have a silver and a gold DCAM example of this pattern.

    A coin such as this is so far beyond the depths of my limited knowledge but the piece is so very attractive that it piqued my curiosity enough to try and look it up to learn a little more about it.

    In looking around one of the things raised was the registry of U.S. pattern gold.
    Currently the Simpson set contains two of these patterns. I have to say, granted I am only going off of pictures, but the coin you've presented here looks even finer than those two. It's strikingly clean, sharp and void of anything that would otherwise distract the eye.

    Did they accidentally put the "C" in America backwards or sideways initially?

    Really a lovely coin, congratulations on its acquisition.

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    To be honest, I haven't looked at the SImpson Collection in the Registry. He did have (and sell) two gold examples, but slight varieties of this. One was a gold/silver alloy (this one is the traditional gold/copper) and the other was a gilt silver example. I didn't care for the look of either, and they sold for more than I thought they were worth.

    This example is one of two DCAMs at PCGS in the traditional gold alloy. Mine (shown above) is a PR65DCAM. There is also a PR66+DCAM which I have not seen in person, but didn't like from the PCGS photo. It seems to have more distracting marks than mine. There is also a PR65CAM example coming up from the Bass Collection.

    Here is the link to the PCGS Coinfacts page for side-by-side photos of both.

    The silver example in the OP above is ex-Simpson. I also viewed his copper specimen which sold a few years ago, but decided to wait for a nicer one.

    The "C" does appear to have been punched incorrectly and repaired, doesn't it?

  • scubafuelscubafuel Posts: 1,716 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I love this pattern, great pickup!

    It’s interesting that while there are originals and restrikes known, it’s not known which are which, except for one.

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @scubafuel said:
    I love this pattern, great pickup!

    It’s interesting that while there are originals and restrikes known, it’s not known which are which, except for one.

    Which one is a confirmed original? I don’t know.

  • scubafuelscubafuel Posts: 1,716 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I don't think there are any definitively confirmed originals, though @MrEureka might know better? But there is for sure one restrike confirmed, and it's this one:

    https://coins.ha.com/itm/patterns-and-prototypes/1836-1-gold-dollar-judd-67-restrike-pollock-70-r5-pr65-cameo-pcgs-pcgs-537377-/a/1341-3815.s?ic4=GalleryView-Thumbnail-071515

    Recently sold, and struck over a 1859 G$1!
    Undertype clearly visible.

  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Posts: 1,656 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @pruebas said:

    The "C" does appear to have been punched incorrectly and repaired, doesn't it?

      

     

    This post showed up on Instagram today, same characteristic re-punched C

    Once again, it does not appear to be as sweet as your example.

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Whose auction is that?

  • ELuisELuis Posts: 769 ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 3, 2023 4:22PM

    I saw this one some weeks ago that was for sale:

  • ELuisELuis Posts: 769 ✭✭✭✭
    edited March 3, 2023 5:14PM

    Found this one, is expensive for sure:

  • AbueloAbuelo Posts: 1,755 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @pruebas never disappoints.

  • EASilverEASilver Posts: 35 ✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2023 5:37AM

    What a wonderful theme. And an amazing collection!

  • JohnnyCacheJohnnyCache Posts: 1,656 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 9, 2023 10:55AM

    @pruebas said:
    Whose auction is that?

    Heritages

    EDIT now I can't find it anymore, strange?

  • harashaharasha Posts: 3,077 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Coincidentally, I was considering Mexican Republic 25 centavos and obtained 8 of them recently. I was not too impressed until I put them under the macro lens of my camera. Once I saw the detail at a glance, I realized what a beautiful coin it was!

    Honors flysis Income beezis Onches nobis Inob keesis

    DPOTD
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Adding the 1864 Bolen Liberty Cap token struck in “Oreide,” which must be some alloy of copper. (Ex. Bolen himself).

  • coinsarefuncoinsarefun Posts: 21,662 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @pruebas said:
    Adding the 1864 Bolen Liberty Cap token struck in “Oreide,” which must be some alloy of copper. (Ex. Bolen himself).

    .
    One of my favorites. I picked this one up years back.
    1864 MA F-760A-8a S. TANENBAUM COLLECTION EX. LESLIE HEILBRONNER NGC MEDAL MS 65

    .
    From Stacks auction:
    Massachusetts--Springfield. Undated (1861-1865) John Adams Bolen. Fuld-760A-5a, Musante-JAB M/E-10. Rarity-9. Copper. Plain Edge. 28 mm. MS-65 RB (NGC).
    The Liberty Cap motif is one of the favorite Bolen dies. The symbol has a rich numismatic history that has antecedents on circulating Mexican coinage and the 1836 March 23 Mint medal for the steam press launch, as well as a pattern gold dollar of that year, both by Christian Gobrecht. The surfaces are about 50% blazing mint red deepening to navy blue.
    Provenance: From the Q. David Bowers Collection. Earlier ex J. Kuehnert; J. Harris; Steve Tanenbaum Collection.

    .

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinsarefun said:

    @pruebas said:
    Adding the 1864 Bolen Liberty Cap token struck in “Oreide,” which must be some alloy of copper. (Ex. Bolen himself).

    .
    One of my favorites. I picked this one up years back.
    1864 MA F-760A-8a S. TANENBAUM COLLECTION EX. LESLIE HEILBRONNER NGC MEDAL MS 65

    .
    From Stacks auction:
    Massachusetts--Springfield. Undated (1861-1865) John Adams Bolen. Fuld-760A-5a, Musante-JAB M/E-10. Rarity-9. Copper. Plain Edge. 28 mm. MS-65 RB (NGC).
    The Liberty Cap motif is one of the favorite Bolen dies. The symbol has a rich numismatic history that has antecedents on circulating Mexican coinage and the 1836 March 23 Mint medal for the steam press launch, as well as a pattern gold dollar of that year, both by Christian Gobrecht. The surfaces are about 50% blazing mint red deepening to navy blue.
    Provenance: From the Q. David Bowers Collection. Earlier ex J. Kuehnert; J. Harris; Steve Tanenbaum Collection.

    .

    What a lovely token! We have similar taste in numismatics....

    I believe that cap & rays die is in the collection of the ANS now, having been donated by someone decades ago.

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