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When is this disgrace going to end?

doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

I'm sorry, but this just bothers me.

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  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No, it's not ok, and I'd like to put my thumb in Dan Snyder's eye!

  • HydrantHydrant Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 30, 2021 10:37AM

    Never.

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 22,653 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 30, 2021 11:24AM

    @doubledragon

    Seize the moment as this is your opportunity to be part of the solution. Suggest a name...

    How about the Washington Filibusters?

    Sort of fits in with all talk and no action as to the inability of the franchise to offer a new team name

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinkat said:
    @doubledragon

    Seize the moment as this is your opportunity to be part of the solution. Suggest a name...

    How about the Washington Filibusters?

    Sort of fits in with all talk and no action as to the inability to offer a name

    I sent Dan Snyder a suggestion, he ignored me, he's too good to speak with a common peasant like me. I even showed him my design for the helmets, the Washington Red Rats.

  • coinkatcoinkat Posts: 22,653 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Maybe you need to take it in a new direction... The Washington Drats...

    Simple name that says it all...

    Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinkat said:
    Maybe you need to take it in a new direction... The Washington Drats...

    Simple name that says it all...

    The Drats sounds good, if Mr. Snyder wants to compromise, I'm a very reasonable man. 🤔

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Another suggestion that has been popular, particularly among the younger fans, is the Walking Deadskins.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This whole WFT name thing is a total mess, it's just a disgrace, like that time Mustache Jerry Jones hired Stephen A. Smith to be a replacement Cowboys cheerleader for a few games.

  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 8,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @doubledragon said:

    @coinkat said:
    @doubledragon

    Seize the moment as this is your opportunity

    The "Swamp Rats" moniker is definitely fitting.......

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is one of the best suggestions to date.

  • PaulMaulPaulMaul Posts: 4,670 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Whatever one thinks about whether these team names are offensive, I just can’t handle this kind of change. I will never be able to take the “Cleveland Guardians” seriously, just can’t do it.

  • Alfonz24Alfonz24 Posts: 2,997 ✭✭✭✭✭

    How about the Washington Georges?

    #LetsGoSwitzerlandThe Man Who Does Not Read Has No Advantage Over the Man Who Cannot Read. The biggest obstacle to progress is a habit of “buying what we want and begging for what we need.”You get the Freedom you fight for and get the Oppression you deserve.
  • LandrysFedoraLandrysFedora Posts: 1,698 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Washington Toilet Paper (WTP) NFC East has been wiping their butts with this team for years.

  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 8,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PaulMaul said:
    Whatever one thinks about whether these team names are offensive, I just can’t handle this kind of change. I will never be able to take the “Cleveland Guardians” seriously, just can’t do it.

    When I hear the "Guardians" mentioned on the radio I still don't recognize they are talking about the indians - sounds more like a minor league hockey team.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This one is reasonable.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    One thing I'll say about Dan Snyder, he's kind of weird, just like that guy that owns the Raiders, that Davis guy, with his weird hairstyles.

  • BrickBrick Posts: 4,907 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Washington Georges is also offensive. George is ok. Washington was a slave owner. The name should simply be Football Team.

    Collecting 1960 Topps Baseball in PSA 8
    http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/

    Ralph

  • Alfonz24Alfonz24 Posts: 2,997 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 4, 2022 8:30AM

    how about the POP TARTS. No mascot provided at the moment.

    #LetsGoSwitzerlandThe Man Who Does Not Read Has No Advantage Over the Man Who Cannot Read. The biggest obstacle to progress is a habit of “buying what we want and begging for what we need.”You get the Freedom you fight for and get the Oppression you deserve.
  • SlipKidSlipKid Posts: 49 ✭✭✭

    @doubledragon said:
    This one is reasonable.

    The potato is a good one. Make it a red potato and they could keep the same nickname.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 4, 2022 8:30AM

    @Alfonz24 said:
    how about the POP TARTS. No mascot provided at the moment.

    Oh, there's a logo though, believe me, I wanted to post it, took everything I had not to!

  • TiborTibor Posts: 3,138 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 4, 2022 8:30AM

    @Alfonz24 said:
    how about the POP TARTS. No mascot provided at the moment.

    The front office is full of them. Take your pick.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 4, 2022 8:30AM

    That's right, there's a logo for the Washington POP TARTS, and it's a beautiful piece of comedy, and I can't show it to you!

  • pocketpiececommemspocketpiececommems Posts: 5,689 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @perkdog said:
    If I’m Washington I’m keeping the current name to just piss everyone off for the pressure of getting rid of the real name

    AMEN perkdog

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm looking forward to men playing in the WNBA. Only because I think that would be funny. It would be the first time I ever watched a WNBA game.

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,143 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @stevek said:
    I'm looking forward to men playing in the WNBA. Only because I think that would be funny. It would be the first time I ever watched a WNBA game.

    Yep, I hope it happens.

    It will make the nonsense even more hilarious

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I had read a number of times in past years that the name "Redskins" was used as a sign of respect. Native Americans are our fellow citizens and are a great people.

    My understanding is virtually all, if not all of the "protests" over the Redskins name, didn't even come from Native Americans.

    A lot of Americans who have long roots in this country going back hundreds of years, would be surprised to learn from a genealogy of their families, that they have Native American heritage. I think a blood test or some sort of test can do this as well.

    Lonely male settlers whose wives died in harsh conditions, and lonely Native American females whose husbands died in war. All of which was a fairly common occurrence back then. They got together and started their own families.

    Of course because the male last name was now the female last name thru marriage, the female's maiden last name was forgotten over time. However the Native American blood still flows thru millions of American veins without them even knowing it.

  • SanctionIISanctionII Posts: 11,585 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It would be hilarious if Luka and/or Nikola and/or Giannis announced that they "identify" as female, they "transitioned" to female and that they have decided to leave the NBA and have joined WNBA teams.

    Could you imagine the response that such announcements would generate. B)

  • galaxy27galaxy27 Posts: 7,036 ✭✭✭✭✭

    someone wake me up when the woke culture goes back to sleep

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I certainly feel different now about the use of Native American imagery in sports, you have to understand that a genocide was inflicted upon them, a genocide that I would compare to the Nazi Holocaust. We took everything from them, their land, their way of life, even took their children and tried to program them to think like us. It was the ultimate rape of the human soul. I don't blame them for not wanting their image used on our sports logos, I don't blame them for hating us, it makes me sick to think how this country was founded, and I'm not woke or any of that crap, just telling it like it is. If you don't believe it, do the research, watch the documentaries, read the books, the testimonies, look at the photos of the bodies in mass graves.

    https://youtu.be/YA070bgUuq8?si=xYJ_y86cVk8M2W2f

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @doubledragon said:
    I certainly feel different now about the use of Native American imagery in sports, you have to understand that a genocide was inflicted upon them, a genocide that I would compare to the Nazi Holocaust. We took everything from them, their land, their way of life, even took their children and tried to program them to think like us. It was the ultimate rape of the human soul. I don't blame them for not wanting their image used on our sports logos, I don't blame them for hating us, it makes me sick to think how this country was founded, and I'm not woke or any of that crap, just telling it like it is. If you don't believe it, do the research, watch the documentaries, read the books, the testimonies, look at the photos of the bodies in mass graves.

    You are exactly right. But the fact is that most if not virtually all civilizations were founded in the exact same manner. Review the history of almost any country, and somewhere along the way, similar or even worse atrocities occurred.

    Yes the old saying goes, those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it. That being said, it doesn't have to be repeated. At some point peoples in a society need to learn to assimilate and get along. Fortunately, many Native Americans have done just that. Although more work needs to be done.

    But frankly, a bit of a problem now is between Native Americans themselves. They hit the jackpot with the Native American casinos thing. However it seems as if too many Native Americas who have gotten filthy rich off this endeavor, don't wish to share their gains with their fellow Native Americans. If at least some of that big money would be distributed fairly, it would go a long way towards helping those Native Americans in poverty.

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 10,215 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If i am not mistaken, the term "redskin" has horrible connotations for first nations people. I believe it refers to when Andrew Jackson had a "bounty" out on NA's and wanted proof of a kill. that proof came in the form of skins. "red" skins brought back to the government as proof.

    terrible times and a terrible name. personally, i am glad they changed it.

    George Brett, Bobby Orr and Terry Bradshaw.

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    If i am not mistaken, the term "redskin" has horrible connotations for first nations people. I believe it refers to when Andrew Jackson had a "bounty" out on NA's and wanted proof of a kill. that proof came in the form of skins. "red" skins brought back to the government as proof.

    terrible times and a terrible name. personally, i am glad they changed it.

    Well yes, but the fact is that European settlers when traveling West, were told when there was an "Indian" raid on their wagon train, to always leave one last bullet in the chamber of your gun. That was for in case the Indians were about to enjoy a successful raid. To commit suicide with that last bullet, rather than be subjected to horrific torture from the Indians. The Indians gave as good as they got.

    Another fact is that Indian tribal wars among themselves in the Americas, were exercises in sheer brutality. Indians were not babes in the woods. They had honed warfare for many thousands of years. It was only because the Europeans had superior numbers and weapons, which led to the downfall and conquest of the Indian tribes.

    So all that being said, there was certainly enough evil on both sides to go around. Which is simply the history of human beings.

    Wanna go back further? I forget the exact numbers, but around 100,000, 250,000 or whatever years ago, fossil evidence from back then shows there were 9 particular species of human type creatures, us being one of them. We systematically wiped out the other 8. That's our history, like it or not.

    I think the best way moving forward is to appreciate our various differences, cultures, etc, and make the world a better place. And to collect cards and coins. 😊

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,143 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited February 6, 2024 4:50PM

    The one thing that Indian sympathizers always forget is the Indians themselves committed horrendous genocide to rival tribes long before Europeans touched down on the Americas.

    Taking Indian names away from Sports teams is one step closer to forgetting they ever existed.

    This topic infuriates me, nobody cares that my Great Grandfather remembered "Irish Need Not Apply" signs from his youth.

    He moved on, he wasn't out looking for reparations or apologies his whole life and he certainly never had a problem with the fighting Irish logo

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,143 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is a very enlightening book

  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 8,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @doubledragon said:
    I certainly feel different now about the use of Native American imagery in sports, you have to understand that a genocide was inflicted upon them, a genocide that I would compare to the Nazi Holocaust. We took everything from them, their land, their way of life, even took their children and tried to program them to think like us.

    Don't feel too bad DD, if you look back in history you will see that Indian Tribes were doing the exact same thing to other Indian Tribes before "the white man" even showed up. (But the media never mentions that)

  • galaxy27galaxy27 Posts: 7,036 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @perkdog said:

    Taking Indian names away from Sports teams is one step closer to forgetting they ever existed.

    which is precisely what the article i linked above is saying. everyone thinks that the woke crowd is acting in the best interest of Native Americans. but when you pull out your shovel and dig a little deeper, it becomes plain to see that their "efforts" are instead removing them from the public conscienceness............and THAT is more damaging to their self-esteem.

    i wonder how many ignorant people have no clue that the Redskins' logo depicted a real freaking Indian -- one who, mind you, worked closely with Calvin Coolidge to bridge cultural gaps. the logo itself was created by a Blackfeet tribal council member, for crying out loud! multiple tribal chiefs are quoted in that article and they universally condemned the removal. i myself have spoken to people with Native American ancestry and the overwhelming majority of them viewed it as an HONOR, and now they want absolutely nothing to do with the Washington Commodes because they view it as an attempt to eradicate their memory.

    do you think the woke community wants anyone to know any of this? of course freaking not, because it would destroy their miserable narrative. that movement is just so revolting.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Steven59 said:

    @doubledragon said:
    I certainly feel different now about the use of Native American imagery in sports, you have to understand that a genocide was inflicted upon them, a genocide that I would compare to the Nazi Holocaust. We took everything from them, their land, their way of life, even took their children and tried to program them to think like us.

    Don't feel too bad DD, if you look back in history you will see that Indian Tribes were doing the exact same thing to other Indian Tribes before "the white man" even showed up. (But the media never mentions that)

    Trying to portray native Americans as nothing more than evil savages who deserved to exterminated by the millions and have their land taken is a load of bullshit. I'm pretty sure expansionism and the gold rush had something to do with it, the natives resisted and were removed by force or if they chose to fight back they were slaughtered. And anyone who thinks that the native Americans are just fine and dandy with the redskins name needs to look it up, there are plenty of native Americans who resent the hell out of it.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Native American people lived off the land, Buffalo were a sacred animal to them, Buffalo provided them with food, they made teepees to live in out of Buffalo hide, and they made clothes to wear out of Buffalo hide. The Army slaughtered over 20 million Buffalo just to starve and get at the native Americans . Just look at this pile of bison skulls.

  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 8,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well, this is why I usually stay away from discussions......................

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,428 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm just glad that my two favorite professional sports teams, the Philadelphia Eagles and Philadelphia Phillies have non-offensive team names, so I don't need to worry about it.

    Although I guess a few out there may say that eagles are a bird of prey, eating poor little innocent squirrels, rabbits, mice, fish, etc, so that name should be changed. 😉

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This is nothing new, native Americans were protesting the use of the redskins name back in 2014. Some native Americans might not mind, but a lot do mind. I know it's hard for loyal fan bases to part with their team names, but the fact is that the team names do offend a lot of native American people.

    https://www.espn.com/blog/playbook/fandom/post/_/id/18144/native-americans-speak-on-sports-imagery

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There are native Americans that find the Chiefs name insulting. If you don't like it I'm sorry, but these are the facts.

    The Super Bowl’s Kansas City Chiefs Are a Cruel Insult to Native Americans

    Rhonda LeValdo, a Native teacher, activist and subject of the doc Imagining the Indian, writes about why she’s at the Super Bowl protesting the Chiefs’ name and chant

    We have had beer thrown at us, people walking up to us doing the chop, people yelling in our faces asking why we are here, and telling us to go home. Guess what? We are home.

    We, the Not in Our Honor Coalition, have been protesting Kansas City football’s appropriation of our culture since 2005, and there have been many other Native people raising their voices against them long before us, like Suzan Shown Harjo, who started the toppling of the Washington, D.C. football team’s racist Native slur of a name.

    This is Indigenous land, our country before it was stolen with treaty promises still not upheld. Native nations are sovereign and should be seen as such, but are not. A perfect example of a treaty obligation that was disregarded: granting the Cherokee Nation one congressional delegate. That still has yet to be honored.

    With another Super Bowl coming up, the Kansas City football team once again chooses to make a mockery of Native cultures and people with their “arrowhead” chop, offensive name, and overall bastardizing of our traditions. There is statistical data that shows it has an impact on our people. But why do we need to prove this with quantitative data? If someone says it hurts them, we should believe them! No other group of people needs to prove this with numbers to say, “Oh okay, I believe them now.”

    A historical perspective on our Native Nations needs to be understood by the public, which can be seen in the new documentary Imagining the Indian: The Fight Against Native American Mascoting. There was a massive holocaust carried out against our people. Our lands were illegally stolen, our children were taken away to boarding schools, our ceremonies were forbidden, and our languages were told not to be spoken or face consequences like being beaten or having mouths washed out with soap.

    So, we ask: Why is it okay for non-Native people to play Indian when we were not allowed to practice our culture?

    This is not about being politically correct. It is about understanding the atrocities and continued historical trauma we as Native people face through the stereotypes that Kansas City football perpetuates.

    This Super Bowl will be seen all over the world. To many countries, they will see this as an OK thing to do. But we are trying to yell as loud as we can: It is not!

    Stop appropriating Native culture, Kansas City! Do the right thing: Change the name. If you kept the Chiefs name, would you change it to the KC Police Chiefs? Of course not. So why is one OK and the other not? People say it is just a name, but it’s so much more.

    In recent years, since the murder of George Floyd, this country has recognized many racial injustices as forms of racism. Why is it taking so long for people to understand that this name, these antics, are all forms of racism against Native Nations? Native people deserve to be treated like human beings, not as “its.” Kansas City can look so much better by including Native people without denigrating us.

    We are the first people of this land. We never left. We are still here, and will continue to be here to represent our ancestors who were massacred. We honor them by being here and continuing to fight for our identity.

    The award-winning documentary feature Imagining the Indian: The Fight Against Native American Mascoting will open exclusively in movie theaters beginning on March 31 in New York, followed by other cities throughout April. For more go to

    www.imaginingtheindianfilm.org.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I grew up a Redskins fan and a Atlanta Braves fan, I'm sure there are plenty of Cleveland Indians fans here, but even I understand that the names do offend native American people.

  • doubledragondoubledragon Posts: 22,146 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think my time on this forum is done, I'll probably be labeled as woke or cancel culture after this, that's fine, call me whatever the hell you want to, just telling it like it is.

  • perkdogperkdog Posts: 29,143 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @doubledragon said:
    I think my time on this forum is done, I'll probably be labeled as woke or cancel culture after this, that's fine, call me whatever the hell you want to, just telling it like it is.

    DD, enough of the drama

    You have more than enough right to feel the way you do just like people who disagree with you, no need to get all upset over this thread especially since nobody is attacking you.

    This is probably the 10th time you have threatened to quit the forum after going on a tirade, nobody is calling you out for your beliefs, nobody is crapping on you and now your getting way too emotional and and assuming people are thinking negatively about you, just settle down for God sakes

    How about typing out your post, and standing by it regardless if you have support or not, tough subjects are tough for a reason no matter which side of the fence your on, but again nobody is attacking you

    I politely sent you a PM and for the first time ever you ignored it, that's fine and maybe you missed so I will say it again here that I respect your thoughts but I do have a right to respectfully disagree with you as does anyone else

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