@jmski52 said:
78% as reported by Forbes. Paycheck to paycheck. Nice, eh coho? Keep'em borrowing and in debt.
This only means folk live AT their means. Someone who makes $50k will find a way to live at a 50k lifestyle. Someone who makes 100k will live at a 100k lifestyle. It's called lifestyle creep or lifestyle inflation. There are many articles written about it. Here is one from a popular "influencer"...
You seem to think that folk live like you and exercise diligence and prudence with living below their means and having savings. But most don't, probably 3 out 4 don't. They spend what they make.
Folk want to keep up with Joneses, but truth is that only 10% are the Joneses and 10-20% don't give a rats ass about the Joneses, so the remaining 75ish% live at or beyond their means. This is no one's fault but themselves.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
@tincup said:
While there are certainly some who may be doing very well in this environment and making lots of 'profit' at least on paper.... there are plenty more who are not.
@jmski52 said: why are folk spend so much on crap they don't need?
Take a look at the chart that derryb posted. What do you think it means? It's a reflection of what the banking system has foisted onto the American Public. More and more debt = slaves to the banking & political systems. Very easy to see.
It's a lack of personal responsibility.
You blame the people for things that they have zero control over. You blame the people who go into debt because they simply don't want to change their habits, like smoking cigarettes, or ordering food delivery for example.
That's exactly correct. I'm glad your listening.
I blame the ones in control, and the bankers (and their bought politicians) are at the top of that heap. That's who dictate the rules - i.e. no mark to market on bad debts, tbtf banks & bank bailouts, no transparency on gov.com spending - you name it.
Of course you do as you carry deep biases and burdensome contempt.
I'm looking at the numbers. Have you? It's not rocket science. Let's do a little basic analysis...
What does it mean to you that 78% are living paycheck to paycheck? "the numbers" reveal that 300 million x 78% = 234 million people in the US are paycheck to paycheck. What does that mean to you and your family? Anything?
300 million? You think babies and great-grandma should be earning a paycheck?
Let's look at the other 22%. 300 million x 22% = 66 million
$21,000,000,000 of quarterly disposable income / 66,000,000 = $318 per person of quarterly disposable income
The 66,000,000 people in the US who DO have disposable income, have a disposable income of a little more than $100/month.
You have disregarded many, many, many factors, but have illustrated "basic" (very, very basic" analysis.
You and derry focus so much on those who "have not" or can't be responsible for themselves. Reminds me of this guy.
>
>
>
>
Do you think that these are good numbers, coho? Do you think you're going to be fine in your cocoon when 3 out of 4 people you see on the street are struggling to buy groceries and a percentage of them are from places that have no idea what the Constitution or civil society is? It's already at your doorstep.
Critters that emerge from cocoons are often quite beautiful.
Yes, many of those folk are from right here in this glorious country with no understanding of the constitution or civil society. It's a shame our very own education system, politicians and societal influences have hindered them.
@jmski52 said:
78% as reported by Forbes. Paycheck to paycheck. Nice, eh coho? Keep'em borrowing and in debt.
This only means folk live AT their means. Someone who makes $50k will find a way to live at a 50k lifestyle. Someone who makes 100k will live at a 100k lifestyle. It's called lifestyle creep or lifestyle inflation. There are many articles written about it. Here is one from a popular "influencer"...
You seem to think that folk live like you and exercise diligence and prudence with living below their means and having savings. But most don't, probably 3 out 4 don't. They spend what they make.
Folk want to keep up with Joneses, but truth is that only 10% are the Joneses and 10-20% don't give a rats ass about the Joneses, so the remaining 75ish% live at or beyond their means. This is no one's fault but themselves.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
.
That is not the point.
75% of people living right at or beyond their means (without saving anything) is enough to wreak havoc on the economy and society if things don't go exactly right.
What does it mean to you that 78% are living paycheck to paycheck? "the numbers" reveal that 300 million x 78% = 234 million people in the US are paycheck to paycheck. What does that mean to you and your family? Anything?
300 million? You think babies and great-grandma should be earning a paycheck?
You may not recognize that living paycheck to paycheck also means supporting babies & great-grandma on that paycheck. So the burden on families may be even worse than what the numbers indicate.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
Your "them" and "us" are apparently much different than my "them" or "us".
It's a lack of personal responsibility.
The point about personal responsibility is great, so why do bankers enable irresponsible people to take out loans that they have no expectation of being paid back? Because the tbtf banks will always be bailed out by big gov't - that's why.
I'm glad you've brought up socialism. Let's talk about socialism:
The banks are great capitalists when it comes to keeping their profits, but great socialists (like the grifter you've pictured in your post) when it comes to passing their losses onto taxpayers. Bank managements are ALMOST NEVER forced to take responsibility and lose their jobs & perks for mismanaging their organizations. Why is that?
You and derry focus so much on those who "have not" or can't be responsible for themselves.
derryb can speak for himself, but my focus is on the enablers who own the banks, the media, wall street, hollywood and tech companies. The parasites can't wait to issue more bad loans, pollute the news, rig the markets, produce garbage entertainment and control every other aspect of our lives including how we spend our money, what gets taught in schools, whether a face diaper and a clot shot is required for admission to a hospital or a public venue, and what wars are promoted.
The question has always and should be, "who benefits?"
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
Regarding this much quoted 78 % -- has anyone actually bothered to look at the source? Do you know the methodology? How was the "data" collected?
Nobody can deny that many people are struggling in America. But the now famous "78 %" -- if it causes people think that most Americans are on the brink of poverty -- is a wild exaggeration.
Regarding the source: it is a very casual annual survey conducted by payroll.org. It is simply an online survey asking how people feel. There is no effort to develop a representative sample of the population. As such, it is in the category of "possibly interesting but fundamentally flawed". If anyone is using it to guide public policy (or their view of the health of the US economy), they are misguided.
If you do want to try to draw conclusions from this survey, you might try digging down into the details. The question is asked of families; roughly 40 % of people with kids feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. That's not a good thing, but it is about half of the 78 % figure. How can that be? Since the survey is of working age people (and is very likely skewed to younger ages), this suggests that single people or families without kids are more likely to feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. Some of these are struggling, but many are just getting started and will likely see a markedly better situation as their careers progress and as they mature.
Finally, if you'd like to take the survey itself, please go ahead. You can find it as this link:
I too live paycheck to paycheck. Each payday my checking account is left with a balance of $100. On average about 65% of me and mommas salary goes into the market, the Au, 401Ks/IRAs, savings etc. RGDS!
But as I have frequently mentioned... I am no expert, especially on financial matters.> @blitzdude said:
I too live paycheck to paycheck. Each payday my checking account is left with a balance of $100. On average about 65% of me and mommas salary goes into the market, the Au, 401Ks/IRAs, savings etc. RGDS!
Just make sure you don't skimp on the chickenfeed! Got to keep all the ladies happy! (I assume you still have your layers).
@tincup said:
But as I have frequently mentioned... I am no expert, especially on financial matters.> @blitzdude said:
I too live paycheck to paycheck. Each payday my checking account is left with a balance of $100. On average about 65% of me and mommas salary goes into the market, the Au, 401Ks/IRAs, savings etc. RGDS!
Just make sure you don't skimp on the chickenfeed! Got to keep all the ladies happy! (I assume you still have your layers).
Absolutely, the girls are cranking out eggs. With all the excess they continue to more than pay for themselves. RGDS!
@Higashiyama said:
Regarding this much quoted 78 % -- has anyone actually bothered to look at the source? Do you know the methodology? How was the "data" collected?
Of Course not. We are a headline society. We seek headlines that confirm our biases regardless of accuracy. If its an opinion we agree with then it must be truthful and factual. Derryb stated this a few years ago when he said "perception is fact". LOL
Nobody can deny that many people are struggling in America. But the now famous "78 %" -- if it causes people think that most Americans are on the brink of poverty -- is a wild exaggeration.
Exactly.
Regarding the source: it is a very casual annual survey conducted by payroll.org. It is simply an online survey asking how people feel. There is no effort to develop a representative sample of the population. As such, it is in the category of "possibly interesting but fundamentally flawed". If anyone is using it to guide public policy (or their view of the health of the US economy), they are misguided.
As we've tried to explain to them for decades.
If you do want to try to draw conclusions from this survey, you might try digging down into the details. The question is asked of families; roughly 40 % of people with kids feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. That's not a good thing, but it is about half of the 78 % figure. How can that be? Since the survey is of working age people (and is very likely skewed to younger ages), this suggests that single people or families without kids are more likely to feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. Some of these are struggling, but many are just getting started and will likely see a markedly better situation as their careers progress and as they mature.
Finally, if you'd like to take the survey itself, please go ahead. You can find it as this link:
Even if we turned prices back to 2014 levels and everyone made $10,000 per year more, had 0% inflation and 0% interest rates and 0% unemployment, 50%-75% of the population would still live paycheck to paycheck,.
@jmski52 said:
78% as reported by Forbes. Paycheck to paycheck. Nice, eh coho? Keep'em borrowing and in debt.
This only means folk live AT their means. Someone who makes $50k will find a way to live at a 50k lifestyle. Someone who makes 100k will live at a 100k lifestyle. It's called lifestyle creep or lifestyle inflation. There are many articles written about it. Here is one from a popular "influencer"...
You seem to think that folk live like you and exercise diligence and prudence with living below their means and having savings. But most don't, probably 3 out 4 don't. They spend what they make.
Folk want to keep up with Joneses, but truth is that only 10% are the Joneses and 10-20% don't give a rats ass about the Joneses, so the remaining 75ish% live at or beyond their means. This is no one's fault but themselves.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
.
That is not the point.
75% of people living right at or beyond their means (without saving anything) is enough to wreak havoc on the economy and society if things don't go exactly right.
.
It would actually be much, much more worrisome if only 5% lived paycheck to paycheck.
A simple google search shows several other articles & surveys - from various sources - listing the number living paycheck to paycheck between 60% - 70%.
The various other sources include CNBC, CBS News, Lending Club, GoBankingRateSurvey, Payroll.org, Investopedia, and The Hill.
Respondents typically state that they would be in financial trouble if their paycheck was delayed by 1 week.
Higashiyama, coho: you think it's a nothing-burger? coho condescendingly says "we" the people are weak. I say that the banking system and financial markets are rigged against the public.
We have an obvious difference of viewpoints.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
@jmski52 said:
Higashiyama, coho: you think it's a nothing-burger? coho condescendingly says "we" the people are weak. I say that the banking system and financial markets are rigged against the public.
We have an obvious difference of viewpoints.
Jmski, can you provide evidence that 60-75% living "paycheck to paycheck" is out of historical (75+ years) norm?
We all know your jaded, biased and contemptuous view of all things finance. Fortunately, the public does not embrace your anger.
unfortunately, the more we print the poorer we become. Just last year one of my dollars lost 25 cents.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Comments
This only means folk live AT their means. Someone who makes $50k will find a way to live at a 50k lifestyle. Someone who makes 100k will live at a 100k lifestyle. It's called lifestyle creep or lifestyle inflation. There are many articles written about it. Here is one from a popular "influencer"...
https://www.ramseysolutions.com/budgeting/lifestyle-creep
You seem to think that folk live like you and exercise diligence and prudence with living below their means and having savings. But most don't, probably 3 out 4 don't. They spend what they make.
Folk want to keep up with Joneses, but truth is that only 10% are the Joneses and 10-20% don't give a rats ass about the Joneses, so the remaining 75ish% live at or beyond their means. This is no one's fault but themselves.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Since 1776, when has this never been the case?
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
It's a lack of personal responsibility.
That's exactly correct. I'm glad your listening.
Of course you do as you carry deep biases and burdensome contempt.
300 million? You think babies and great-grandma should be earning a paycheck?
You have disregarded many, many, many factors, but have illustrated "basic" (very, very basic" analysis.
You and derry focus so much on those who "have not" or can't be responsible for themselves. Reminds me of this guy.
>
>
>
>
Critters that emerge from cocoons are often quite beautiful.
Yes, many of those folk are from right here in this glorious country with no understanding of the constitution or civil society. It's a shame our very own education system, politicians and societal influences have hindered them.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
.
That is not the point.
75% of people living right at or beyond their means (without saving anything) is enough to wreak havoc on the economy and society if things don't go exactly right.
.
What does it mean to you that 78% are living paycheck to paycheck? "the numbers" reveal that 300 million x 78% = 234 million people in the US are paycheck to paycheck. What does that mean to you and your family? Anything?
300 million? You think babies and great-grandma should be earning a paycheck?
You may not recognize that living paycheck to paycheck also means supporting babies & great-grandma on that paycheck. So the burden on families may be even worse than what the numbers indicate.
Quit looking for blame in 'them", for them are us.
Your "them" and "us" are apparently much different than my "them" or "us".
It's a lack of personal responsibility.
The point about personal responsibility is great, so why do bankers enable irresponsible people to take out loans that they have no expectation of being paid back? Because the tbtf banks will always be bailed out by big gov't - that's why.
I'm glad you've brought up socialism. Let's talk about socialism:
The banks are great capitalists when it comes to keeping their profits, but great socialists (like the grifter you've pictured in your post) when it comes to passing their losses onto taxpayers. Bank managements are ALMOST NEVER forced to take responsibility and lose their jobs & perks for mismanaging their organizations. Why is that?
You and derry focus so much on those who "have not" or can't be responsible for themselves.
derryb can speak for himself, but my focus is on the enablers who own the banks, the media, wall street, hollywood and tech companies. The parasites can't wait to issue more bad loans, pollute the news, rig the markets, produce garbage entertainment and control every other aspect of our lives including how we spend our money, what gets taught in schools, whether a face diaper and a clot shot is required for admission to a hospital or a public venue, and what wars are promoted.
The question has always and should be, "who benefits?"
I knew it would happen.
The economy is booming like all them bombs that took down the twin towers.
Regarding this much quoted 78 % -- has anyone actually bothered to look at the source? Do you know the methodology? How was the "data" collected?
Nobody can deny that many people are struggling in America. But the now famous "78 %" -- if it causes people think that most Americans are on the brink of poverty -- is a wild exaggeration.
Regarding the source: it is a very casual annual survey conducted by payroll.org. It is simply an online survey asking how people feel. There is no effort to develop a representative sample of the population. As such, it is in the category of "possibly interesting but fundamentally flawed". If anyone is using it to guide public policy (or their view of the health of the US economy), they are misguided.
If you do want to try to draw conclusions from this survey, you might try digging down into the details. The question is asked of families; roughly 40 % of people with kids feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. That's not a good thing, but it is about half of the 78 % figure. How can that be? Since the survey is of working age people (and is very likely skewed to younger ages), this suggests that single people or families without kids are more likely to feel they are living paycheck to paycheck. Some of these are struggling, but many are just getting started and will likely see a markedly better situation as their careers progress and as they mature.
Finally, if you'd like to take the survey itself, please go ahead. You can find it as this link:
https://www.nationalpayrollweek.com/npw-survey/
I too live paycheck to paycheck. Each payday my checking account is left with a balance of $100. On average about 65% of me and mommas salary goes into the market, the Au, 401Ks/IRAs, savings etc. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
But as I have frequently mentioned... I am no expert, especially on financial matters.> @blitzdude said:
Just make sure you don't skimp on the chickenfeed! Got to keep all the ladies happy! (I assume you still have your layers).
Absolutely, the girls are cranking out eggs. With all the excess they continue to more than pay for themselves. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
Of Course not. We are a headline society. We seek headlines that confirm our biases regardless of accuracy. If its an opinion we agree with then it must be truthful and factual. Derryb stated this a few years ago when he said "perception is fact". LOL
Exactly.
As we've tried to explain to them for decades.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Even if we turned prices back to 2014 levels and everyone made $10,000 per year more, had 0% inflation and 0% interest rates and 0% unemployment, 50%-75% of the population would still live paycheck to paycheck,.
Because we are weak.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
It would actually be much, much more worrisome if only 5% lived paycheck to paycheck.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
A simple google search shows several other articles & surveys - from various sources - listing the number living paycheck to paycheck between 60% - 70%.
The various other sources include CNBC, CBS News, Lending Club, GoBankingRateSurvey, Payroll.org, Investopedia, and The Hill.
Respondents typically state that they would be in financial trouble if their paycheck was delayed by 1 week.
Higashiyama, coho: you think it's a nothing-burger? coho condescendingly says "we" the people are weak. I say that the banking system and financial markets are rigged against the public.
We have an obvious difference of viewpoints.
I knew it would happen.
Jmski, can you provide evidence that 60-75% living "paycheck to paycheck" is out of historical (75+ years) norm?
We all know your jaded, biased and contemptuous view of all things finance. Fortunately, the public does not embrace your anger.
Condescending? If you say so.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Print more money. We are rich.
See at least someone gets it. RGDS!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
unfortunately, the more we print the poorer we become. Just last year one of my dollars lost 25 cents.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
get the joke?
if we were rich we wouldn't need to print money