Home U.S. Coin Forum

How many degrees would you say?

gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

I know that what the holder says is wrong. I do not think its worth the cost of recertification. Tell me how many degrees you think this is rotated and after some responses I will show what the holder states.

Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

Comments

  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 22,355 ✭✭✭✭✭

    120 or 60 depending on which way is up for the reverse photo

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @airplanenut up is the top of the photo

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 22,355 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @gumby1234 said:
    @airplanenut up is the top of the photo

    Then 120

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • pmh1nicpmh1nic Posts: 3,321 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 2:18PM

    About 120 degrees if the eagles head is suppose to be at 0 (straight up)

    Edited because I'm disoriented (happens when you get old).

    The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it possible for an empire to rise without His aid? Benjamin Franklin
  • mbogomanmbogoman Posts: 5,222 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 1:53PM
  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 9,877 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If eagles head should be up then I'm in the 120 camp

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 2:14PM

    The coin is rotated 120 degrees as @airplanenut and @Steven59 say. Here is the holder. I need to know if they are required to reslab this at their expense because they mislabeled it.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • rte592rte592 Posts: 1,847 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 2:20PM

    The grader was right handed...120° rotated to the right.
    Clockwise should be the direction or orientation of the ascending numbers.

  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Does it really matter?

  • joeykoinsjoeykoins Posts: 17,348 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Magician coin?
    :*

    "Jesus died for you and for me, Thank you,Jesus"!!!

    --- If it should happen I die and leave this world and you want to remember me. Please only remember my opening Sig Line.
  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @amwldcoin it matters in terms of value. Rotated rev coins with 90 degrees or more rotation are more desirable and thus more value. Also I think certification companies need to have the correct label inside the holder.

    @joeykoins it is real

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 22,355 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @gumby1234 said:
    The coin is rotated 120 degrees as @airplanenut and @Steven59 say. Here is the holder. I need to know if they are required to reslab this at their expense because they mislabeled it.

    Can you show a photo of the entire reverse side of the slab?

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • HydrantHydrant Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 3:26PM

    I would have to hold it in hand and have a protractor to give the correct answer......Otherwise, it's just a guess.

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 35,046 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 3:27PM

    yeah... I'm lookin fer whole slab shot too

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 9,877 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Hydrant said:
    I would have to hold it in hand and have a protractor to give the correct answer......Otherwise, it's just a guess.

    Then I'm guessing don't use the same protractor NGC used! :#

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,720 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A die can rotate in either direction. This coin is rotated about 60 degrees in the CCW direction so the label is correct. What if it were rotated 5 degrees in the CCW direction? Should the label say 355 degree rotation?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 35,046 ✭✭✭✭✭

    120 CW

    now, you bought it knowing it's not 60. "must" it have 120 CW on the label?

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,720 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MsMorrisine said:
    120 CW

    now, you bought it knowing it's not 60. "must" it have 120 CW on the label?

    I think you meant 300 degrees CW which is the same as 60 degrees CCW. There are 360 degrees in a circle.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall No this 71D it is rotated 120 degrees clockwise. If a coin were rotated 5 degrees CCW thats what it should say. After 180 degrees CW it would be a CCW rotation of up to 179 degrees.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 22, 2021 3:54PM

    @MsMorrisine I know it is 120 degrees, but others (see above) do not realize it.

    Edit* Even when they are looking at it in the photos.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • joeykoinsjoeykoins Posts: 17,348 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Awesome Kennedy, dude! B)

    "Jesus died for you and for me, Thank you,Jesus"!!!

    --- If it should happen I die and leave this world and you want to remember me. Please only remember my opening Sig Line.
  • USSID17USSID17 Posts: 1,264 ✭✭✭✭✭

    .....or obverse rotated. B)>:)o:) LoL!!

    Great coin!

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @USSID17 Thanks. They use the term rotated reverse because they generally don't know which die was rotated. When the obv is facing normal the reverse appears rotated, so that's how they do it.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 22,355 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @gumby1234 said:
    @MsMorrisine I know it is 120 degrees, but others (see above) do not realize it.

    Edit* Even when they are looking at it in the photos.

    With all due respect, showing multiple photos with the slab not oriented up makes this more difficult. Yes, it's 120 degrees off because when the reverse of the slab is upright, the eagle's head should face down. Show the slab oriented properly and it's pretty obvious. NGC would probably correct it for free, but I doubt they'd cover shipping. They might reholder it at a show for no charge at all. That said, since this is pretty obvious (it's not one kind of error being called something else) I'm not sure I'd bother. Anyone seeing the coin in the slab can see the entirety of the error.

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • Steven59Steven59 Posts: 9,877 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @PerryHall said:
    A die can rotate in either direction. This coin is rotated about 60 degrees in the CCW direction so the label is correct. What if it were rotated 5 degrees in the CCW direction? Should the label say 355 degree rotation?

    Coins reverses are counted starting normal orientation which would be zero at the top. Even if you go by the tail feathers being at the bottom (180) like normal then it is still rotated up 120 degrees - (From 180 to 60 on the protractor which is a total of 120) Maybe the NGC grader got confused too?

    "When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @airplanenut its hard to get the holder in the pics with my digital microscope. The first pics are oriented correctly you just can't see the holder. Top pic with label up and second pic flipped top to bottom. Sorry for any confusion.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • messydeskmessydesk Posts: 20,228 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm coming up with 117° CW rotation, assuming the obverse appears unrotated in the slab. Take it to a show and have them fix it. I suppose you could ask for "Medal turn with 63° CCW rotated reverse."

  • ShaunBC5ShaunBC5 Posts: 1,771 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Maybe they meant to say that each one was rotated 60 in opposite directions, and we’re just acting like one side is 120 :wink:

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,630 ✭✭✭✭✭

    55 degrees CCW

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • airplanenutairplanenut Posts: 22,355 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @gumby1234 said:
    @airplanenut its hard to get the holder in the pics with my digital microscope. The first pics are oriented correctly you just can't see the holder. Top pic with label up and second pic flipped top to bottom. Sorry for any confusion.

    I understand that… I’m just trying to point out why others may be getting confused. This is the kind of coin where a full slab shot of both sides (with the top of the slab up for both sides) really helps show exactly what happened.

    JK Coin Photography - eBay Consignments | High Quality Photos | LOW Prices | 20% of Consignment Proceeds Go to Pancreatic Cancer Research
  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 29,070 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'll stick with i like the coin

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @airplanenut maybe this is where phone photos would be better. I will try taking photos slab top up both sides when I get home.

    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • 1630Boston1630Boston Posts: 14,111 ✭✭✭✭✭

    2.1 radians :)

    Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko

    Bad transactions with : nobody to date

  • gumby1234gumby1234 Posts: 5,663 ✭✭✭✭✭


    Successful BST with ad4400, Kccoin, lablover, pointfivezero, koynekwest, jwitten, coin22lover, HalfDimeDude, erwindoc, jyzskowsi, COINS MAKE CENTS, AlanSki, BryceM

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,720 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 23, 2021 9:27AM

    Now that we can finally see the entire slab, I agree with 120 degrees clockwise.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Well, those pictures make the issue clear.....Nice error coin.... Good luck with the label. Cheers, RickO

  • silverpopsilverpop Posts: 6,721 ✭✭✭✭✭

    B) error coin

    graded silver coins (NEED TO SELL ASAP)
    link below
    https://photos.app.goo.gl/7bPCP787VCZCCKb67

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file