Question / Dilemma for the community

bidask

I have 8 reales cap & rays in a PCGS holder that was labeled incorrectly with the identifying assayer.

I bought the coin not looking closely at the assayer initials .

The coin was purchased by me from a notable auction house about 17 months ago . They also missed the assayer mistake as well in that the coin was offered incorrectly by the them based on what was on the PCGS label.

In going over my collection today looking errors in identifying varieties I found this error today .

Question: Should I contact the auction house and ask for my money back. Or should I contact PCGS with proof of what I paid for this coin in hopes they will refund me .

Or is it his situation to bad for me for not noticing earlier?

The difference in price for the mistaken assayer labeled coin and the actual coin itself could be today around 400-800 depending ....

JohnnyCache

It has been a while, however, I would try the auction house, after all they do have it documented with regards to what exactly they were selling it as. I think it's a harder sell with PCGS. I don't have any experience, even remotely, with this kind of situation but that would be my instinct on how to pursue it.

pruebas

I think you’re kinda out of luck with the auction house because it’s been so long. But since you’re such a good customer, they MAY take it back because of their error.

And PCGS will reholder it gratis as a mechanical error if you keep it.

Since the market has improved, is it still worth trying to return it instead of just reselling it?

bidask

@pruebas said:
I think you’re kinda out of luck with the auction house because it’s been so long. But since you’re such a good customer, they MAY take it back because of their error.

And PCGS will reholder it gratis as a mechanical error if you keep it.

Since the market has improved, is it still worth trying to return it instead of just reselling it?

I paid a good deal over .... it’s a AZ not a AV like what’s on the holder so reselling I would definitely lose out

pruebas

@bidask said:

@pruebas said:
I think you’re kinda out of luck with the auction house because it’s been so long. But since you’re such a good customer, they MAY take it back because of their error.

And PCGS will reholder it gratis as a mechanical error if you keep it.

Since the market has improved, is it still worth trying to return it instead of just reselling it?

I paid a good deal over .... it’s a AZ not a AV like what’s on the holder so reselling I would definitely lose out

Then try your luck persuading the auction house for a return or at least a monetary credit. You are a good customer!

1960NYGiants

Call PCGS early in the a.m. They should compensate you for their error - though they may call a "mechanical error".

I think the auction company has no obligation to take it back because of the time lapse.

Good luck.

neildrobertson

PCGS specifically calls this sort of thing out as not being covered by their guarantee. They will label it correctly for free, but that's it.

bidask

Hard to believe this was a “mechanical error”

TwoKopeiki

@bidask said:
Hard to believe this was a “mechanical error”

They'll call it that. I would try the auction house first.

Boosibri

I roll my eyes at the “mechanical error” term, as if there is a piece of equipment that mistakenly printed the label and swapped it into the holder after the QA step in the process.

Just say that we are not responsible for errors which appear on the label which are plainly visible to anyone viewing the coin in hand.

amwldcoin

They absolutely will not. Been there and done that!

@1960NYGiants said:
Call PCGS early in the a.m. They should compensate you for their error - though they may call a "mechanical error".

I think the auction company has no obligation to take it back because of the time lapse.

Good luck.

coinkat

Looks to be an attractive coin. I would be interested to see the submission form... which may or may not be possible. I am not offering that as an excuse but it might contain a clue as to how the coin was misattributed.

I would contact our host for an explanation

ajaan

@neildrobertson said:
PCGS specifically calls this sort of thing out as not being covered by their guarantee. They will label it correctly for free, but that's it.

But will they pay for shipping both ways?

ncsuwolf74

When it's been favorable to me (such as the coin is labeled as a standard date and it's really a rarer overdate) and I paid a better price for it at auction because of this, I sent them in as a mechanical error. They corrected the labels for free and return shipping included. I didn't offer anyone extra money etc....not trying to rip anyone off but that's how the coin was sold. So I think the TPG will correct their label, but you will not get any compensation for it from them. Your best bet will be to contact the auction house and I'm not sure they are going to do anything either.

MasonG

I prepared a submission of 100 or so 8 reales one time. Four of them returned with the wrong date, mint or assayer on the label. They fixed the labels, they didn't pay for shipping.

neildrobertson

@ajaan said:

@neildrobertson said:
PCGS specifically calls this sort of thing out as not being covered by their guarantee. They will label it correctly for free, but that's it.

But will they pay for shipping both ways?

Yes. I've sent in a couple of mechanical errors, and they've paid for shipping both ways.

TwoKopeiki

@neildrobertson said:

@ajaan said:

@neildrobertson said:
PCGS specifically calls this sort of thing out as not being covered by their guarantee. They will label it correctly for free, but that's it.

But will they pay for shipping both ways?

Yes. I've sent in a couple of mechanical errors, and they've paid for shipping both ways.

Odd, when I've submitted mistakes to be corrected, they paid for the return cost, but not the shipping to them.

1960NYGiants

I've had several mechanical error returns. PCGS sent me Fedex return labels each time and paid to send the corrected holders back to me. Note: the return was coordinated with PCGS Customer Service each time, i.e. I contacted them via email with photos of the error, they confirmed the errors, and authorized the return.

TwoKopeiki

@1960NYGiants said:
I've had several mechanical error returns. PCGS sent me Fedex return labels each time and paid to send the corrected holders back to me. Note: the return was coordinated with PCGS Customer Service each time, i.e. I contacted them via email with photos of the error, they confirmed the errors, and authorized the return.

pruebas

I just send any mechanical errors with other planned grading submissions, either at a show or lately, by mail. No need for a separate shipment.

MrEureka

On the one hand, I don’t think it’s unreasonable for PCGS to hold consumers responsible for exercising a minimal amount of due diligence before buying a coin. In other words, check the attribution before writing the check.

On the other hand, I wonder how often mechanical errors are made on the grade, and how many of those mistakes are ever corrected.

jgenn

There is a department that does the data entry from your submission form into the TPG processing pipeline. Clearly, nobody in this department is an expert at authenticating coins and plenty of evidence suggests that whatever the QA department does, it does not include checking the label for errors.

YQQ

I had never heard the term "mechanical errors" .
what is it? it PMD? MD?

thefinn

I think the term is, “Buy the coin, not the holder.”

Boosibri

@thefinn said:
I think the term is, “Buy the coin, not the misattributed holder, unless the error benefits you.”

MrEureka

@YQQ said:
I had never heard the term "mechanical errors" .
what is it? it PMD? MD?

It's a data entry error at the TPG. Of course, sometimes it's impossible to tell the difference between a data entry error and some other kind of mistake.

Stork

I've seen more than one incorrect date for Japanese coins. I've dropped off to both TPG for correction or included in submissions, and they were returned to me for free. Same with a few mistaken varieties.

I once had an interest in some of the aluminum piedforts of the French Territories. I had one in a PCGS slab and assumed the piedfort was correct but distortion from the slab made this less than perfectly obvious (the one time those dang prongs are helpful!). I consigned it to an eBay seller who eventually got back to me to tell me the buyer confirmed it was the regular essai, not the piedfort. Refund given, coin sent back to PCGS. IIRC PCGS gave some grading credits vs. an actual settlement. It was reasonable.

In any case, I would try the auction house first...they should stand behind their sales and 17 months isn't really that long ago. I mean, they have pictures and cert numbers! If their write up was incorrect that's on them to correctly identify what they are selling IMO, sell the coin, not the label. I'd try PCGS next.

bidask

I called Stephen Album Rare Coin Auctions and PCGS back on May 6. The rep at PCGS took copious notes on the cert number and my dilemma ....said he was going to speak with a supervisor and get right back to me. I asked hi, to do so one way or another. Never heard back.

Meanwhile Mike Barry at Stephen Album coins stepped up and offered to return money paid and shipping costs! Great guy and upstanding firm !!

Boosibri

I’m just surprised you actually got through to someone in PCGS customer service

tcollects

@bidask said:
I called Stephen Album Rare Coin Auctions and PCGS back on May 6. The rep at PCGS took copious notes on the cert number and my dilemma ....said he was going to speak with a supervisor and get right back to me. I asked hi, to do so one way or another. Never heard back.

Meanwhile Mike Barry at Stephen Album coins stepped up and offered to return money paid and shipping costs! Great guy and upstanding firm !!

Wow, that's way above and beyond. Smart customer service decision, though I would have assumed you'd be sol because how much time passed. I've always been happy with them - my wins from their auction about a month ago arrived 2 days after I paid and the coins looked better than imaged - but hearing this makes me inclined to bid an extra increment next time and otherwise do more business with them.

Stork

@bidask said:
I called Stephen Album Rare Coin Auctions and PCGS back on May 6. The rep at PCGS took copious notes on the cert number and my dilemma ....said he was going to speak with a supervisor and get right back to me. I asked hi, to do so one way or another. Never heard back.

Meanwhile Mike Barry at Stephen Album coins stepped up and offered to return money paid and shipping costs! Great guy and upstanding firm !!

Yep, an outstanding company! Not a surprise at all that he/they handled it that way.

WinLoseWin

@tcollects said:

@bidask said:
I called Stephen Album Rare Coin Auctions and PCGS back on May 6. The rep at PCGS took copious notes on the cert number and my dilemma ....said he was going to speak with a supervisor and get right back to me. I asked hi, to do so one way or another. Never heard back.

Meanwhile Mike Barry at Stephen Album coins stepped up and offered to return money paid and shipping costs! Great guy and upstanding firm !!

Wow, that's way above and beyond. Smart customer service decision, though I would have assumed you'd be sol because how much time passed. I've always been happy with them - my wins from their auction about a month ago arrived 2 days after I paid and the coins looked better than imaged - but hearing this makes me inclined to bid an extra increment next time and otherwise do more business with them.

That is smart and might be cost effective in the long run as evidenced by your comments, even with the short term loss to the company.

Scripted advertising can't compare to actually creating visible customer service results like what took place in this case by Stephen Album Rare Coin Auctions.