Full Bands, Full Head, Full Steps, etc....Is this a registry phenomenon?
MidLifeCrisis
Posts: 10,503 ✭✭✭✭✭
@coinsarefun posted a thread about a very nice Mercury Dime and whether or not it was full bands. That got me thinking...
Why do we have such designations now? Are they a result of the registry?
"Nice coin, but it's not full bands." Ugh. People form a negative opinion of an otherwise great coin because one tiny feature is not fully struck.
I'm guilty of it too. I've thought to myself "Nope, it doesn't have FB (or FS or FBL or FH or whatever) on the label" and I pass by it without even a second look. What's wrong with me?
I know this is not a new topic. I'm just wondering how it got started...and why.
2
Comments
I think the registry has encouraged more collecting of the strike designations but many of them existed, some informally, before the registry became a thing. While some authors, QDB comes to mind, emphasize strike as a preeminent quality it is but one part of the equation for others.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
One reason.
$$$$$$$$
Long before registry sets and their sponsors, all of those superlatives were used to denote
a superior strike. As with gradeflation, they have suffered as well.
So these strike designations were in use before the registry sets. Thanks.
I just don't remember them when I collected in the late 70s and early 80s. That's probably because a) I'm old and my memory isn't what it used to be, and/or b) I didn't pay attention to them then because I couldn't afford high grade coins that would have such designations anyway.
I've seen the "full head" designation for Standing Liberty quarters in a "Numismatic Scrapbook" magazine from July 1945 so that particular qualifier has been around at least since then. The rest are from more recent times.
As you have found out all those terms were in use to some degree before TPG's and registries. I think it would be fair to say that their importance (and prices) for the high grade examples have grown because of the registries.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
It reflects the registry thing. There is nothing with filling the hole with a nice non fb gem bu dime.
To each his own... To me, the most important criteria is the overall eye appeal (to my eye). "FB" and similar designations are desirable, of course. But because the market values such designation with higher prices, within a given price range I have found a better looking coin if it doesn't have the premium pricing of "FB" than those that are "FB."
My strategy is about collecting what I intend to keep, not investing in what I plan to sell.
Full step nickels definitely predated the registry, I was collecting them raw in the early 1990s and there were at least two dealers specializing in them. My first PCGS submission in 2002 was the best coins from my personal FS set.
Sean Reynolds
"Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
The designations reflect degrees of perfection.... Most have been around long before registry sets. Collectors often want the best coin (not always, but mostly). These designations were derived to reflect quality in areas that often were not well struck or quickly worn.... Perfection can be expensive. Cheers, RickO
the "Full Steps" designation pre-dates the Set Registry by almost 30 years.
It was before my time, but my impression is that FBL is from the same era as FS, anybody know if that's accurate?
I believe it comes from our bad human traits. We always want to up the next person. So these designations exist. And it's not just bands or steps. It comes with PL, "+", and stickers. Nose hairs can't be far behind.
WS
Many of Those designations were in place long before registry , but, I believe the registry lead to price explosion over the years in some of the series where the little designation makes a huge difference.
I understand it as an attempt to make rare coins in otherwise very common series.
When there are tens of thousands of mint state coins for a date, you need to do something to boost the rarity level,
When there are tens of thousands of mint state coins for a date, you need to do something to boost the rarity level.
I guess the same could be said for Morgan Dollars and VAM, Capped Bust Half-Dollars and Overton, etc.
what it really comes down to is collectors who are focused on a specific series and understand that series better than the average collector. they note strike nuances and simply make mention of it. like-minded collectors then tend to group together and the interest level grows. I would guess that there is some sort of strike area for pretty much any US coin series.
perhaps the blame should be placed on the TPG's who seem to be at the heart of the problem you have with these designations.
I happened to be watching Antiques Roadshow and one of the experts remarked (about a non coin item) that when something was mass produced and is now relatively common, "Condition is Everything" This I think is a manifestation of that principle.
If you are buying for your collection, not such a problem, but if you are buying to resell very important and always have been since I can remember.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
The 1926-D phenomenon has been well known for a long time.
The problem with "survival of the fittest" is that it sounds totally awesome - so long as it is someone else's survival that is at stake
Usually, if a coin has Full Bands, Full Head, Full Torch designation it has a better overall strike, in my opinion. If you want a well struck coin and have the funds to utilize to make the purchase, then why not pay the premium, regardless of whether you are placing it in a registry or not.
There is nothing more beautiful than a truly well struck Buffalo Nickel in a 66 or 67 holder. My opinion.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
Nope.
Generally true but I've seen SLQs with sharp, full heads that are missing detail in a third of the shield. I would not pay a full head premium for for a coin that didn't have a completely detailed shield, drapery, and breast and wing detail on the eagle. A much more meaningful qualifier would be simply "full strike." Of course a true full strike is unknown for many dates within the series, so a full head set is the only possibility. And, as Jim says, a well struck or better yet a full strike on a Buffalo nickel, such as the extraordinary 1923-S shown below is a sight to behold. When I did my extensive strike study of over 100,000 coins over a period of 12 years for the series there were 29 dates, or a little over 38%, out of a set of 64 regular issues and 12 major varieties, 76 total, that were not seen with a full strike
That is a beauty, Ron. Yours, I hope?
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.
Oh no, not mine. I wish it was. It almost looks like some kind of specimen strike as the 1923-S very often suffers from severe strike and die wear issues, especially on the reverse.