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1877 Indian Head Cent

COINS MAKE CENTSCOINS MAKE CENTS Posts: 1,836 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited December 28, 2020 8:49AM in U.S. Coin Forum

So I know a true fine for Indians needs to have all letters in liberty visible. I have been looking at Indians in holders already that grade vg and fine especially 1877 and have seen they have different looks as far as amount of liberty showing and feather detail. I swear I've seen some vg coins that have no liberty showing at all.

So in your opinion what does this 1877 grade? And if different what do you think it would holder as?

I believe this coin is a vg8 with maybe a chance at a vg10


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Comments

  • kevinstangkevinstang Posts: 1,518 ✭✭✭

    I'd say a shot at F-12- the feather detail is strong and tops of all letters in "Liberty" visible.

  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,514 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited December 28, 2020 9:17AM

    Probably a present-day Fine 12, that likely would not get an Eagle Eye sticker on it.

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  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm with the above. Having a clear Liberty on a 77 Indian in F is a long gone thing of the past!

  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,588 ✭✭✭✭✭

    10-12, and you may want to send it to our host.

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 28,557 ✭✭✭✭✭

    ill go with a 12 as well

  • MoldnutMoldnut Posts: 3,106 ✭✭✭✭

    You have to ask yourself, would I pay F12 money for it? I sure wouldn't, and I bet a dealer wouldn't either. VG10 max.

    Derek

    EAC 6024
  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,588 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Moldnut said:
    You have to ask yourself, would I pay F12 money for it? I sure wouldn't, and I bet a dealer wouldn't either. VG10 max.

    He is a dealer.

  • COINS MAKE CENTSCOINS MAKE CENTS Posts: 1,836 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Moldnut said:
    You have to ask yourself, would I pay F12 money for it? I sure wouldn't, and I bet a dealer wouldn't either. VG10 max.

    I never said I thought it was a fine. Looking at the true Ana grading standards it's just a vg but if you look at today's grading and look at sold listing for coins in the same grade they are being slabbed as fines and are selling as fines also

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  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,514 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just because a dealer wouldn't pay Fine money for it, doesn't make it a VG.
    I would never use an argument about how a dealer grades a raw coin he's offered for sale.
    I'm guessing the vast majority will err on the low side.

    It's certainly stronger than some of those already slabbed Fine, and like the OP just stated, they are selling at auction.
    https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1877-1c-bn/2127/4723683205151975340

    Now, we get into Rick Snow's concerns about gradeflation, and the affect on prices. What is an old school Rick Snow Fine worth, versus these coins getting into Fine holders now? Probably considerably more, but the price guides can't reflect that.

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  • COINS MAKE CENTSCOINS MAKE CENTS Posts: 1,836 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Walkerguy21D said:
    Just because a dealer wouldn't pay Fine money for it, doesn't make it a VG.
    I would never use an argument about how a dealer grades a raw coin he's offered for sale.
    I'm guessing the vast majority will err on the low side.

    It's certainly stronger than some of those already slabbed Fine, and like the OP just stated, they are selling at auction.
    https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1877-1c-bn/2127/4723683205151975340

    Now, we get into Rick Snow's concerns about gradeflation, and the affect on prices. What is an old school Rick Snow Fine worth, versus these coins getting into Fine holders now? Probably considerably more, but the price guides can't reflect that.

    I'm surprised the 77 in your link straight graded. It looks like there is corrosion or pitting on alot of the obverse and verdigris on the reverse at 7 oclock? Maybe it's just the way the picture is taken?

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  • LRCTomLRCTom Posts: 857 ✭✭✭

    If VG-11 was an accepted grade, that's what I'd be calling it.

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  • goldengolden Posts: 9,788 ✭✭✭✭✭

    10 max.

  • COINS MAKE CENTSCOINS MAKE CENTS Posts: 1,836 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @LRCTom said:
    If VG-11 was an accepted grade, that's what I'd be calling it.

    I could think of alot of coins I've seen over the years this grade would fit

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  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    just a lovely 77.

    i've dreamed of having a roll of these just like this.

    don't know what it is bout those 77s?

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  • robkoolrobkool Posts: 5,934 ✭✭✭✭✭

    VG10...

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  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 8,169 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think this piece is what was meant by VG10... there's definitely more meat on it than an 8, but I wouldn't pay F12 money for it... but, that's just me.

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  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 24,423 ✭✭✭✭✭

    VG10. There is too much wear on "LIBERTY" to justify a F12.

    All glory is fleeting.
  • DRUNNERDRUNNER Posts: 3,870 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My F-15. Notice the wear on "Liberty" as well as the two digs in the left field.
    Some electronic issues here, so harder for me to post pics . .. but hopefully this will get through.

    No comments.

    Drunner

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would grade the coin in the OP as a 10.... I just cannot see the detail in Liberty needed for a 12... and yes, it could be the picture...Cheers, RickO

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I like it at 12.

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