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Should I buy gold or silver?

Hey guys, I’ve been a coin collector for years but lately I’ve been considering buying precious metals due to potential political instability & for the sense of security.

However I’m having trouble deciding on if I should buy gold or silver?

With gold I can store significant amounts of wealth in small spaces but with silver I’d need a lot of 1kg bars to store the same wealth and then the security issues regarding that.

But on the other hand Gold seems to be way overpriced right now compared to silver considering about a century ago the ratio of silver to gold was 20:1 but right now it’s close to 75:1.

I know everyone will have different opinions and there is no definitive answer but I’m just curious what you think and why you think it.

Thanks!

Comments

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 3,045 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Stick with gold, the gutter metal will only disappoint you. Many things have changed over the last century. Better chance of 200:1 happening before 20:1 IMO.

  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 41,791 ✭✭✭✭✭

    How much gold or silver will differing opinions buy ? If you guessed “none”, you’d be right. Forget the GSR it was 119 to 1 just a few months ago. But if you don’t have any..... you may be shoulding on yourself for a long time. That leads to regret.

  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 20,694 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Choose a ratio and buy both. Then, try to stick to that ratio as you continue to accumulate. Re-assess your target ratio every few years, but not very frequently.

    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 39,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Diversify.

  • TPGSTPGS Posts: 73 ✭✭✭

    I want trade my $1,000 bag of silver for gold @TwoSides2aCoin
    Is this a dumb move?
    I read you have some AGE in stock.

  • Gam3rBlakeGam3rBlake Posts: 162 ✭✭✭

    @blitzdude said:
    Stick with gold, the gutter metal will only disappoint you. Many things have changed over the last century. Better chance of 200:1 happening before 20:1 IMO.

    But isn’t it true that silver is used up and gone while gold is recycled and thus most of the gold ever mined is still in use in some form?

  • blitzdudeblitzdude Posts: 3,045 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Gam3rBlake said:

    @blitzdude said:
    Stick with gold, the gutter metal will only disappoint you. Many things have changed over the last century. Better chance of 200:1 happening before 20:1 IMO.

    But isn’t it true that silver is used up and gone while gold is recycled and thus most of the gold ever mined is still in use in some form?

    Silver is so common that hardly anyone even mines it. The vast majority is a byproduct of copper mining and there's piles of it everywhere. That should tell you a thing or two about demand.

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 24,874 ✭✭✭✭✭

    gold and silver are both plentiful

    there is no shortage of either.

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • GoldenageGoldenage Posts: 147 ✭✭✭

    Gold. Takes up less room, and you save a few bucks over time with shipping. I know that’s laughable, but true.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭

    a Green Deal will boost silver. Solar power needs silver.

    Consider buying PM ETFs, much more liquid.

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  • rickoricko Posts: 77,889 ✭✭✭✭✭

    All things in moderation.... get both.... in U.S. coin form... bars of metal will be more difficult to move. Cheers, RickO

  • Gam3rBlakeGam3rBlake Posts: 162 ✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 8:11AM

    @derryb said:
    a Green Deal will boost silver. Solar power needs silver.

    Consider buying PM ETFs, much more liquid.

    That would only work if I was investing for a profit. I’m not trying to make a profit. I want my precious metals to be a store of wealth that I can grab and take with me at a minute’s notice.

    Like in WW2 when some Jews needed to get out of Nazi Germany and did so by paying for transportation with gold.

    For me it would be ideal if I never needed to use or sell my gold. It’s just meant to be like insurance for me in an emergency.

    I’m not a prepper or anything but I do have about 30 days food & water, medication, batteries, gasoline, etc,. & precious metals would be a part of that. I would want to eat the food I have stored either but if it was starvation or that I’d be glad to have it around.

    My guess is if I offered someone a handful of 1 oz American Gold Eagles they would gladly provide me with transportation, medicine, food, etc.,

  • Gam3rBlakeGam3rBlake Posts: 162 ✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 8:15AM

    @ricko said:
    All things in moderation.... get both.... in U.S. coin form... bars of metal will be more difficult to move. Cheers, RickO

    Yeah I was thinking of sticking with American Gold & Silver Eagles. Right now I have 2x 1oz American Gold Eagles but I’m thinking of getting some smaller denominations too. It just sucks that the premium on smaller ones (like the 1/4th & 1/10th oz) is so much higher. But if I was buying like a gallon of gas or a day’s worth of food I wouldn’t want to pay with a full 1 troy ounce of gold. It would be like going to Taco Bell and throwing down a $100 bill for a soft taco. It’s too much. So I think a couple American Silver Eagles or a 1/10th oz Gold Eagle would be the best.

    Do you know if APMEX prices are fair? I saw a 20x American Silver Eagle tube for $650 but it seems pretty expensive to me.

  • Jinx86Jinx86 Posts: 3,613 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Generic 999 gold/silver is just fine for barter. Leave the Gold/silver Eagles alone. Even better go for US 90% if bartering is what you intend to use it for. US 90% premiums are lower than any other product on my retail sheet at the moment and with the tightest spread.

  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 8:55AM

    @Gam3rBlake said:

    @derryb said:

    Consider buying PM ETFs, much more liquid.

    That would only work if I was investing for a profit. I’m not trying to make a profit. I want my precious metals to be a store of wealth that I can grab and take with me at a minute’s notice.

    PM ETFs work the same as physical metal in protecting as a store of wealth. Most PM ETF prices reflect the metals' underlying price movements. It's just an easier way to take advantage of the benefits of PMs. Your percentage of gain (or loss) with the ETF would be about the same as with the actual metal. Less headaches buying and selling and no shipping costs.

    GLD and SLV ETFs actually hold the physical metal. Others are simple derivatives based on futures or spot prices.

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  • softparadesoftparade Posts: 9,033 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @blitzdude said:
    Stick with gold, the gutter metal will only disappoint you. Many things have changed over the last century. Better chance of 200:1 happening before 20:1 IMO.

    OUCH

    ISO 1978 Topps Baseball in NM-MT High Grade Raw
    3, 60, 100, 103, 263, 302, 347, 376, 416, 466, 481, 487, 509, 534, 540, 554, 579, 580, 622, 642, 673, 724


  • Gam3rBlakeGam3rBlake Posts: 162 ✭✭✭

    @Jinx86 said:
    Generic 999 gold/silver is just fine for barter. Leave the Gold/silver Eagles alone. Even better go for US 90% if bartering is what you intend to use it for. US 90% premiums are lower than any other product on my retail sheet at the moment and with the tightest spread.

    I don’t think the 90% silver is IRA eligible like the AGE. Plus that would be a pain to have a huge sack of coins.

  • bronco2078bronco2078 Posts: 9,035 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Gam3rBlake said:

    @Jinx86 said:
    Generic 999 gold/silver is just fine for barter. Leave the Gold/silver Eagles alone. Even better go for US 90% if bartering is what you intend to use it for. US 90% premiums are lower than any other product on my retail sheet at the moment and with the tightest spread.

    I don’t think the 90% silver is IRA eligible like the AGE. Plus that would be a pain to have a huge sack of coins.

    Physical PM IRA is about the dumbest idea imaginable don't even consider it :s

  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 4:00PM

    If you want PMs in an IRA, use ETFs in an online self managed brokerage IRA account. You can move in and out of them (and stocks) all day long as long as you don't withdraw the funds early. Roth IRA is even better; no tax on the gains.

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  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 24,874 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Gam3rBlake said:

    @Jinx86 said:
    Generic 999 gold/silver is just fine for barter. Leave the Gold/silver Eagles alone. Even better go for US 90% if bartering is what you intend to use it for. US 90% premiums are lower than any other product on my retail sheet at the moment and with the tightest spread.

    I don’t think the 90% silver is IRA eligible like the AGE. Plus that would be a pain to have a huge sack of coins.

    that's the rub with any silver. it weighs a lot more per dollar value than gold. you've noted the silver weight and storage issues already.

    but if you choose silver I would definitely consider 90% (also: not 40% not 35%)

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 41,791 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TPGS said:
    I want trade my $1,000 bag of silver for gold @TwoSides2aCoin
    Is this a dumb move?
    I read you have some AGE in stock.

    I think your silver is a good hold. I would find an equitable trade to suit you.

  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 41,791 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I set up a few clients in precious metal IRAs. It's clean and simple and like all IRAs it's in someone else's vault. Safe and sound and like any future earning: taxable. Lots of views and angles and information. Proceed with caution and a sense of urgency. Prices fluctuate.

  • ashelandasheland Posts: 16,750 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm partial to silver, but both always works. >:)

  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 4:11PM

    @TwoSides2aCoin said:
    I set up a few clients in precious metal IRAs. It's clean and simple and like all IRAs it's in someone else's vault. Safe and sound and like any future earning: taxable. Lots of views and angles and information. Proceed with caution and a sense of urgency. Prices fluctuate.

    And, how's all the fees, including storage? Can the account holder get out of the hard PMs at any time?

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  • djmdjm Posts: 1,091 ✭✭✭✭

    How did the people who had precious metal IRAs at Tulving make out?

  • bronco2078bronco2078 Posts: 9,035 ✭✭✭✭✭

    like the nucleo folks at bullion direct I think :s

  • SimpleCollectorSimpleCollector Posts: 330 ✭✭✭✭

    If your sub 40 years old, then putting money into the stock market or real estate is my advice for building wealth. If older or if you have wealth , then it’s a personal choice. While many like silver due to the lower cost, i think you quickly realize that any significant amounts start to take up a lot of storage space, so people then move into gold. For me, my preference was 10 ounce silver bars, or generic slabbed pre 1933 gold coins.

  • Gam3rBlakeGam3rBlake Posts: 162 ✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 7:22PM

    @SimpleCollector said:
    If your sub 40 years old, then putting money into the stock market or real estate is my advice for building wealth. If older or if you have wealth , then it’s a personal choice. While many like silver due to the lower cost, i think you quickly realize that any significant amounts start to take up a lot of storage space, so people then move into gold. For me, my preference was 10 ounce silver bars, or generic slabbed pre 1933 gold coins.

    I actually do have most of my assets in the stock market but I read that professional financial advisors recommend 5-10% of a portfolio be invested in precious metals.

    I agree stocks provide better returns (I’m up 30% in 2 years!) but my PMs are more of a security thing than a profit making investment.

    Like if something causes the stock market to crash or we have a severe case of hyperinflation - Gold will hold it’s value.

    Either way though, as I said, my best case scenario would be to have my PMs stored safely away and never having to use or sell them, i would prefer financial stability (since most of my money is in stocks not PMs) but I wanted to have some sort of back up insurance plan.

    Gold & Silver have been used as stores of value for thousands of years and I don’t see that changing anytime soon.

    This is about all the gold I have anyway 😆. (~2.48 troy oz)

  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @djm said:
    How did the people who had precious metal IRAs at Tulving make out?

    Tulving did not hold IRA accounts, they sold the metal to the IRA account holder and sent it to the IRA custodian (financial institution) on behalf of the buyer. They were just the middle man. Not to say some IRA buyers didn't get burned if Tulving failed to deliver to the custodian.

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  • derrybderryb Posts: 30,376 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 11, 2020 7:27PM

    @SimpleCollector said:
    If your sub 40 years old, then putting money into the stock market or real estate is my advice for building wealth. If older or if you have wealth , then it’s a personal choice.

    IRAs are for:
    -People who, for whatever reason, can't save for their retirement. IRA disciplines them to save for retirement (can't have easy access to the funds when they want a new car).
    -People who have a great income vs. their living expenses.
    -Employees who get matching contributions from their employer.
    -People who want their retirement savings gains to be tax free (Roth IRA). They pay taxes on what goes into the Roth. Regular IRA is funded with tax free money that gets taxed upon retirement and withdrawal.

    Those who want a PM IRA would be better served buying gold and putting it in a secure place. Nobody stands between them and their gold (counter party risk) and they can liquidate without penalty before retirement. They also have far less expenses by avoiding the IRA.

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  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 41,791 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @derryb said:

    @TwoSides2aCoin said:
    I set up a few clients in precious metal IRAs. It's clean and simple and like all IRAs it's in someone else's vault. Safe and sound and like any future earning: taxable. Lots of views and angles and information. Proceed with caution and a sense of urgency. Prices fluctuate.

    And, how's all the fees, including storage? Can the account holder get out of the hard PMs at any time?

    $175 per year. They can start taking out at 59. Like any IRA or 401k, there are fees and charges for early withdrawal. I've purchased from others who cashed out Gold IRAs.

  • jmski52jmski52 Posts: 20,694 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 21, 2020 7:49AM

    I actually do have most of my assets in the stock market but I read that professional financial advisors recommend 5-10% of a portfolio be invested in precious metals.

    I agree stocks provide better returns (I’m up 30% in 2 years!) but my PMs are more of a security thing than a profit making investment.

    Like if something causes the stock market to crash or we have a severe case of hyperinflation - Gold will hold it’s value.

    Either way though, as I said, my best case scenario would be to have my PMs stored safely away and never having to use or sell them, i would prefer financial stability (since most of my money is in stocks not PMs) but I wanted to have some sort of back up insurance plan.

    Keep in mind that we are now living in a "controlled economy" in which the central bank is supporting higher stock market levels, while (probably) suppressing the price of precious metals. At some point, the attitudes of the general public will change in terms of valuation, when it becomes obvious that stock prices can't be held up without actual increases in production and productivity - the opposite of what we are seeing now.

    All of the money creation going on now dilutes the value of all outstanding dollars and increases the price of all dollar-denominated assets - including stocks and precious metals. The last time around, almost all QE was a free donation to the banking system to bail out the banks who completely mishandled their real estate tranches in a real estate bubble. This time around, the free money bailout is aimed at every entity (public, private, corporate, individual) that "needs the money". The whole system is being abused across the board and expectations & dependencies are being reinforced by all this free money.

    That being the case, understand that in about every case where the central bank or government has pumped excess liquidity into the system in such massive amounts, inflation inevitably runs out of control - causing stocks to rise. In every such case, gold has outperformed stocks during rampant inflation. Usually this happens when gov.com loses control of the pricing mechanisms and then tries to implement wage & price controls by edict.

    The kicker here is that gov.com is more and more desperate to run a controlled economy and to pump up the stock market (and people's IRA & retirement accounts) during a time of economic contraction. The whole scheme is like an auto frame that's been bent in an accident and different parts of the car don't work very well. The car is unsafe to drive - the steering is off, the accelerator is stuck and the brakeline has a serious leak, but they keep stomping on the accelerator.

    That's why you diversify into precious metals.

    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
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