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1854 with arrows quarter proof?

My mother found this in the Mississippi River in 1993. Can’t tell if it is a proof by the finish as my mother wiped it off when she pulled it out of the river. Then stored it in her jewelry box for a few years before giving it to me. I was told it could be a proof and want some opinions. What do you think?

Comments

  • jclovescoinsjclovescoins Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks fake to me. Definitely not proof

  • SeatedTonersSeatedToners Posts: 392 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 16, 2020 7:32PM

    The 1854 quarter with arrows at the date has a mintage of 10 coins in proof. The regular strike version has a mintage of
    12,380,000. So most likely its a regular strike coin and not a proof. Its really hard to tell just by looking at your pictures. Pretty neat that your mom found it in the river though. It looks like has a decent strike. The obverse stars are fully stuck and that tends to weak point on these as many of the coins in this series have "mushy" looking stars. The link below will take you to the PCGS Coin Facts page where you can see some detailed pictures of proof and regular strike coins for this date.

    https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/category/twenty-cents-quarters/liberty-seated-quarter/type-4-no-motto-arrows-date-1854-1855/713

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    Definitely not fake. I thought from pictures it looks like a regular strike. I was given different opinions at a show, some saying the rim looked to nice to be a regular strike. May never know for sure. Because it was given to me by my mother and the great story it will handed down to one o my children.

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,548 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 16, 2020 7:26PM

    @BestestDad said:
    Definitely not fake. I thought from pictures it looks like a regular strike. I was given different opinions at a show, some saying the rim looked too nice to be a regular strike. May never know for sure. Because it was given to me by my mother and the great story it will handed down to one of my children.

    Actually, you can know for sure if it is a proof or not by submitting it to our host for grading. Hopefully it will straight grade. Others on this forum can tell you much better than me if it will straight grade. At least you’ll have no doubt if it’s one of the very few proofs or not.

    Regardless, it’s a real nice coin, and one that you and your future generations can cherish. Make sure to write down as much of the story as possible (on acid free paper).

    Congratulations!

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    I had asked my mother to write the story of her finding it and storing it up until she gave it to me. Then I can add my story to it and so on.

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 17, 2020 4:22AM

    To be sure I would send it to our host for grading.

  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 24,370 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It isn't worth the cost of having it graded by a TPG. It is probably an XF details coin.

    All glory is fleeting.
  • NumisOxideNumisOxide Posts: 10,997 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 17, 2020 5:35AM

    Nice find by your mom. Would like to hear more details on how she she found it. :)

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    What a great family story to go with a nice coin....Would like to see your Mother's story when she writes it. Cheers, RickO

  • CoinosaurusCoinosaurus Posts: 9,630 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The thing that bothers me about this coin is that every element is absolutely hammered except for the stars. Very odd. I can't decide if proof, business strike, or fake.

  • Eldorado9Eldorado9 Posts: 2,326 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just for reference purposes, here is one of the Pogue examples:

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    Hopefully these are better tried different lighting.

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    It was cleaned/ wiped off when she pulled it out of the river. I believe it was found in 1993 after the huge flood. My mom journals just about everything and said she will look for her journal from 1993 and let me know the story.

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    We lived in Newport Minnesota at the time

  • mannie graymannie gray Posts: 7,259 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jclovescoins said:
    Looks fake to me. Definitely not proof

    I agree. My first thought was "fake."

  • ike126ike126 Posts: 802 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Cool story!! Definitely something to pass down generation 2 generation.

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    @mannie gray said:

    @jclovescoins said:
    Looks fake to me. Definitely not proof

    I agree. My first thought was "fake."

    I know how you must feel mannie, like who finds a silver quarter in a river or gets one back in change? Most of us that pay attention to their change have gotten back a silver coin. And I wish they still lived there because I would be knee deep in mud with a metal detector in hand.

  • jclovescoinsjclovescoins Posts: 1,914 ✭✭✭✭✭

    new pictures look real...but still not proof

  • mannie graymannie gray Posts: 7,259 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BestestDad said:

    @mannie gray said:

    @jclovescoins said:
    Looks fake to me. Definitely not proof

    I agree. My first thought was "fake."

    I know how you must feel mannie, like who finds a silver quarter in a river or gets one back in change? Most of us that pay attention to their change have gotten back a silver coin. And I wish they still lived there because I would be knee deep in mud with a metal detector in hand.

    I believe you found the coin, but something about the surfaces look off.
    It may just be the images....I realize the coin had to be cleaned and perhaps that's the problem.
    I could very well be wrong. ....would not be the first time!

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    @mannie gray said:

    @BestestDad said:

    @mannie gray said:

    @jclovescoins said:
    Looks fake to me. Definitely not proof

    I agree. My first thought was "fake."

    I know how you must feel mannie, like who finds a silver quarter in a river or gets one back in change? Most of us that pay attention to their change have gotten back a silver coin. And I wish they still lived there because I would be knee deep in mud with a metal detector in hand.

    I believe you found the coin, but something about the surfaces look off.
    It may just be the images....I realize the coin had to be cleaned and perhaps that's the problem.
    I could very well be wrong. ....would not be the first time!

    Manny, I want to apologize for being crabby this AM. Probably not a good thing to look at the forum so early. It’s why I don’t have Facebook sometimes I don’t think before I speak(type).

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    B)

  • DoubleEagle59DoubleEagle59 Posts: 8,323 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Sorry folks, I say a definite fake.

    Best to send it to PCGS.

  • mannie graymannie gray Posts: 7,259 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DoubleEagle59 said:
    Sorry folks, I say a definite fake.

    Best to send it to PCGS.

    That was my first take as well.
    Just looks "off."

  • AercusAercus Posts: 381 ✭✭✭✭

    My advice: enjoy it as an heirloom and enjoy the story.

    From the practical side: (imo) not genuine. Dentils on the lower obverse are not correct.

    Aercus Numismatics - Certified coins for sale

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    One would think if someone was going to make a fake they would have added the "HUGE" O.

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,617 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Based on the new pictures, to me, the coin looks like a cleaned business strike.> @BestestDad said:

    One would think if someone was going to make a fake they would have added the "HUGE" O.

    One would not necessarily think that. It would subject the coin to more/closer scrutiny. And there are countless copies made of much lower value coins than yours.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    Out if silver?

  • roadrunnerroadrunner Posts: 28,303 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Denticles aren't close to being square. Clearly losing sharpness as they move inwards. Not a proof.

    Barbarous Relic No More, LSCC -GoldSeek--shadow stats--SafeHaven--321gold
  • NumisOxideNumisOxide Posts: 10,997 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks genuine to me but environmental damaged surfaces.

  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,617 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @coinJP said:
    Looks genuine to me but environmental damaged surfaces.

    Same here, with cleaning added.

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • KindaNewishKindaNewish Posts: 827 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm going with fake on this one.

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,902 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I don't like the dots above the arrows at the date. There is also another one on the reverse by the inner wing. If you compare the hair curls to a genuine one the details don't seem correct. The arrow feathers seem off also.

    Looks a little fishy to me and I don't think it's cuz it was in a river. :/

  • joeykoinsjoeykoins Posts: 16,209 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Aercus said:
    My advice: enjoy it as an heirloom and enjoy the story.

    Yes, good advise. I too have classic coins that are damaged or just a problem coin/s. Although, mine aren't as classic as your coin is, my story, in which many people here are aware of, sounds similar to your's. My coins are not worth anything but bullion. But at the same time, my coins that my Dad had left us kids, are PRICELESS! Like advised above, just keep as an Heirloom from your Mother's interest in coins, and also, found in the Mighty Mississippi! Wow. Good Luck in whatever you decide my friend. ;)

    "Jesus died for you and for me, Thank you,Jesus"!!!

    --- If it should happen I die and leave this world and you want to remember me. Please only remember my opening Sig Line.
  • BestestDadBestestDad Posts: 100 ✭✭✭

    @joeykoins said:

    @Aercus said:
    My advice: enjoy it as an heirloom and enjoy the story.

    Yes, good advise. I too have classic coins that are damaged or just a problem coin/s. Although, mine aren't as classic as your coin is, my story, in which many people here are aware of, sounds similar to your's. My coins are not worth anything but bullion. But at the same time, my coins that my Dad had left us kids, are PRICELESS! Like advised above, just keep as an Heirloom from your Mother's interest in coins, and also, found in the Mighty Mississippi! Wow. Good Luck in whatever you decide my friend. ;)

    Thanks for the positive advice. I think I will have it sent in to be graded. By the way, love your quote at the bottom of your comment.

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