I am counting the reverse proof since it is easy to discern. I am not counting proof vs. MS finishes because you could not easily tell a low grade proof from a DCam PL MS coin.
I would assumed the eagle would be a dead give away since the 2018's would still be quite contrasting from the field, even in lower 68s. And a high PL MS version of the the eagle would be all "shiny"with no contrast.
1921 P Morgan - No. Cannot determine date.
1921 S Morgan - No. Cannot determine date.
1921 D Morgan - Yes. Only D Morgan.
1921 Morgan dollars have a slightly different reverse design.
Thanks for posting this. I was not aware. I just looked at some Morgans I have and I'm not going to count it since the difference was not that easy to spot. initially. I can see it on close comparison though. Thanks again, even though not including these, I think this type of info really adds to the thread.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
With a mintage of only 500, I thought the 1907 Wire Edge was a pattern or an experimental striking rather than a regular issue. It does have a different appearance compared to the regular 1907 issue.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
I found some photos in MS grades and, you are correct, it is very clear. Do you know if it still shows clearly in lower grades? No one seems to post their VF examples.
"I'm not going to count it since the difference was not that easy to spot. initially."
Your thread, your rules.
Any TPG can tell a 1921 in P01 or worse & most collectors can also.
You asked for coins that can be identified by reverse alone and the 1921's can.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
With a mintage of only 500, I thought the 1907 Wire Edge was a pattern or an experimental striking rather than a regular issue. It does have a different appearance compared to the regular 1907 issue.
You are very possibly correct. But, Red Book seems to list it as a regular issue. I'm not sure what criteria old R.S. used to determine this, but I'm going to go with his call and not try to think too hard on it.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
I found some photos in MS grades and, you are correct, it is very clear. Do you know if it still shows clearly in lower grades? No one seems to post their VF examples.
Below is a VF30, with VF being the lowest grade on the PCGS pop report.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
With a mintage of only 500, I thought the 1907 Wire Edge was a pattern or an experimental striking rather than a regular issue. It does have a different appearance compared to the regular 1907 issue.
You are very possibly correct. But, Red Book seems to list it as a regular issue. I'm not sure what criteria old R.S. used to determine this, but I'm going to go with his call and not try to think too hard on it.
The Red Book also treats the 1856 Flying Eagle cent as a regular issue and it's definitely a pattern.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
I found some photos in MS grades and, you are correct, it is very clear. Do you know if it still shows clearly in lower grades? No one seems to post their VF examples.
Below is a VF30, with VF being the lowest grade on the PCGS pop report.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
If you are trying to compile information for future reference wouldn't you want that information to be correct?
I and many others here can see the difference in the hub without magnification and in fact at a quick glance.
Here is your chance to pull your 1921 and another Morgan out and do a little research.
Edited to add:
In an attempt to be constructive I took the time to image both reverses. Check the arrow feathers. Check the gap between the A and the wing tip. There are other differences too if you look.
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
Like you said - My thread, my rules.
With respect to just the breast feathers, what about 1878’s?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@Sweetpie said:
1877 Indian Cent.
(Lower right leg of the "N" in ONE are weakly struck).
Interesting list btw.
Thanks. I'm going to say No on this one for now and call it a die marker. I think it could be moved to the Honorable Mention category since as I recall it is pretty easy to eyeball. I'm just not sure if there are other weak "N" coins in the series. Maybe someone expert on Indian Cents can comment?
The coin I am suggesting may or may not fit given the framework provided... The 1971-s Ike type I proof. It is the only Proof Ike with that reverse. It may not fit only because the intent behind the mintage has not been established to the satisfaction of many. Some might suggest an error others might suggest it was the original design that was replaced after a few were struck while others don't notice the difference.
It exists... Seems it should be included.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
1872 half dime mintmark above wreath?
1875 dime mintmark above wreath?
Two off the top of my head, but correct me if I'm wrong (wouldn't be a first for me )
Fun thread
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
Like you said - My thread, my rules.
With respect to just the breast feathers, what about 1878’s?
1879 CC/CC Morgan Dollar. CC was recut to different size and underlying was not completely removed. Most refer to it as the capped die.
Oooops, sorry, does not make the grade per your parameters. So, the 1880 small cc's and reverse tail feathers of 79 wouldn't make the grade either. Certainly can identify by reverse alone. But, hey, it's your game!
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
Like you said - My thread, my rules.
You wrote "If the obverse was worn smooth and the reverse was clear could you identify it and slab the coin as a................"
Sorry I misunderstood you.
The comment above makes it sound like a TPG would be involved and yes they could tell the difference.
I stand by my comment that some clarification as to exactly what you are asking would help.
Do you want to know coins that can be easily identified by a beginning collector, an advanced collector or a TPG?
@ifthevamzarockin said:
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
Like you said - My thread, my rules.
With respect to just the breast feathers, what about 1878’s?
The only problem with using breast feathers is they may be worn (off) on a given coin. I don't know if the present discussion pertains only to MS or AU coins, but my impression was it does not.
Comments
I would assumed the eagle would be a dead give away since the 2018's would still be quite contrasting from the field, even in lower 68s. And a high PL MS version of the the eagle would be all "shiny"with no contrast.
Sorry, dont hv any MS PL to compare to.
Pretty sure some 1872's have that characteristic.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Honorable Mention. Technically, yes, but I think it is hard to discern for a Yes. Much harder than the HR $20 I think.
1908 D No Motto $10 Indian - Yes. No motto and MM location nails it down to one possibility.
No changes, just poor reverse dies sent to Charlotte.
Take a moment to look at a picture of a 1907 Wire Edge and a regular 1907 and let me know if you still feel the same way.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Thanks for posting this. I was not aware. I just looked at some Morgans I have and I'm not going to count it since the difference was not that easy to spot. initially. I can see it on close comparison though. Thanks again, even though not including these, I think this type of info really adds to the thread.
With a mintage of only 500, I thought the 1907 Wire Edge was a pattern or an experimental striking rather than a regular issue. It does have a different appearance compared to the regular 1907 issue.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I found some photos in MS grades and, you are correct, it is very clear. Do you know if it still shows clearly in lower grades? No one seems to post their VF examples.
"I'm not going to count it since the difference was not that easy to spot. initially."
Your thread, your rules.
Any TPG can tell a 1921 in P01 or worse & most collectors can also.
You asked for coins that can be identified by reverse alone and the 1921's can.
You are very possibly correct. But, Red Book seems to list it as a regular issue. I'm not sure what criteria old R.S. used to determine this, but I'm going to go with his call and not try to think too hard on it.
Maybe you should change the thread title to....
Which US coins I can identify by looking at the reverse alone?
Below is a VF30, with VF being the lowest grade on the PCGS pop report.
https://coins.ha.com/itm/indian-eagles/eagles/1907-10-wire-rim-vf30-ngc/a/1219-5406.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
The Red Book also treats the 1856 Flying Eagle cent as a regular issue and it's definitely a pattern.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Ok. Looks pretty clear to me.
1907 Wire Rim $10 Indian. Yes.
1907D $5.00
There's also a 1906-D $5.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Sorry, dude. Without magnification and/or comparison to a non-1921 I don't see it. I can see the thinner head and neck and the eagle's left wing tip when side by side with another, but on it's own it looks like the reverse of any other Morgan. Still a No - excluded as die markers.
If you have a constructive point to make you are welcome to, but don't be insulting.
Like you said - My thread, my rules.
No. Could be a 1906 D $5 Liberty.
OK. I'm going to be AFK for awhile. Please continue on. I will try to return and post a summary of what we have this evening.
Not trying to be insulting.
If you are trying to compile information for future reference wouldn't you want that information to be correct?
I and many others here can see the difference in the hub without magnification and in fact at a quick glance.
Here is your chance to pull your 1921 and another Morgan out and do a little research.
Edited to add:
In an attempt to be constructive I took the time to image both reverses.
Check the arrow feathers.
Check the gap between the A and the wing tip.
There are other differences too if you look.
.
End Systemic Elitism - It Takes All Of Us
1853O A/R 25c and 50c as well as P.
.
End Systemic Elitism - It Takes All Of Us
WOW! 21's are very easy to tell apart from other Morgans from the reverse. Take a look at the Breast Feathers!
Here are two from the $20 Lib series:
1879-O $20
1861-S $20 Paquet
1922 no D 1 cent
*
1808 $2.50
1892 type 1 reverse quarters, all three mints.
With respect to just the breast feathers, what about 1878’s?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
1848 CAL.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
1796 25 cent, small eagle reverse.
*
There is also the 1871 and 1872 shallow N.
The coin I am suggesting may or may not fit given the framework provided... The 1971-s Ike type I proof. It is the only Proof Ike with that reverse. It may not fit only because the intent behind the mintage has not been established to the satisfaction of many. Some might suggest an error others might suggest it was the original design that was replaced after a few were struck while others don't notice the difference.
It exists... Seems it should be included.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Dexter 1804 $1.00. Well, kind of a stretch.
While not a die marker, it’s a “D” marker.😉
But on a serious note, that’s an alteration and just one example, not the entire issue, so clearly a no-go.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
1872 half dime mintmark above wreath?
)
1875 dime mintmark above wreath?
Two off the top of my head, but correct me if I'm wrong (wouldn't be a first for me
Fun thread
cannot tell mints on those nickels
The only problem is there is a 79 reverse of 78.
1879 CC/CC Morgan Dollar. CC was recut to different size and underlying was not completely removed. Most refer to it as the capped die.
Oooops, sorry, does not make the grade per your parameters. So, the 1880 small cc's and reverse tail feathers of 79 wouldn't make the grade either. Certainly can identify by reverse alone. But, hey, it's your game!
bob
You wrote
"If the obverse was worn smooth and the reverse was clear could you identify it and slab the coin as a................"
Sorry I misunderstood you.
The comment above makes it sound like a TPG would be involved and yes they could tell the difference.
I stand by my comment that some clarification as to exactly what you are asking would help.
Do you want to know coins that can be easily identified by a beginning collector, an advanced collector or a TPG?
78CC Morgan
78 8TF Morgan also.
The 1880 CC also could have the 78 reverse.
Dang it, good catch. Forgot about that one.
+1
1870-S silver dollar
1870-S $3
1796 quarter
The only problem with using breast feathers is they may be worn (off) on a given coin. I don't know if the present discussion pertains only to MS or AU coins, but my impression was it does not.
1854-D $3
1854-O $3