Thoughts on sports betting?
doubledragon
Posts: 23,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
in Sports Talk
For or against? Are you a gambling man, have you ever let it all ride on the ponies?
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Comments
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
I got no problems with it being legalized. As far as betting goes I think it’s an absolute BAD decision, especially betting NFL. The ways you can lose is mind boggling. If someone were to ask me what my picks were on a Sunday I would say flip a coin for every game and let that be what decides your picks
I like Poker, Craps, roulette and Slots. Hate the track although I did hit a Tri Super for $14,000 back in 1993. I actually posted a pic of the winning ticket here a while back.
Poker and the stock market are my preferred gambles these days, but I've been known to play the ponies or dogs on occasion. It's usually more a social thing either at the track or OTB with buddies having a few beers, rarely risking more than $20-30 in a day. I've never really done any sportsbook gambles, more March Madness brackets, Superbowl Squares, or the homer rivalry games bets among friends/coworkers.
Damn. That is insane! I would have passed out!
That one is good, but not as good as @thunderdan 's sig ...
I play poker and
😂😂😂😂 I wanted to use that one, but I knew he already had it, so I chose a different one. I figured everyone had seen thunderdans already.
Longtime gambler.
Old joke: came to Vegas in a $50,000 car, and went home on a $100,000 bus.
6 years ago Adam Silver said $400 Billion annually is bet offshore, illegally.
I have 2 offshore accounts. I've won 5 digits (before the decimal point, Bronco) and always been paid. May take awhile. Max they pay is $2,500 a month. However I would not be shocked if they refused to pay. I've read many horrific stories on gambling websites.
It is increasingly difficult to open an offshore account, many only want bitcoin. Today one of my sportsbooks is allowing a $100 free wager on the Lakers/Clippers tonight.
I pray California allows at home/mobile gambling. Indian casinos here are very wealthy and fighting it tooth and nail. They of course only want to allow sports wagering inside their casinos. Their group is currently winning here.
Dude the story is insane. I bought a 3 dog tri box For $24 and won but it paid like $50 and I was PISSED because it was only the first half of the bet. A Tri Super means you need to hit the trifecta and you get 1 chance bet at the Superfecta, if it was a straight Tri I would have made a few hundred so again I was mad and wouldn’t have bet it had I known since it’s absurdly hard to hit a Super with 1 straight bet. So I pick 4 numbers 7321 ( can’t remember exact numbers ) about a minute before the race on a hunch I switched it to 7312. Sure enough 7...3...PHOTO FINISH with the 2 & 1! I waited about 5 minutes stressing out BIG TIME thinking if it comes up my original 7321 I screwed myself! But luckily it came out 7312!! It’s so funny because the hardcore track guys knew I had won it. I was a hero for that day. They took the $3800 taxes out right there and cut me a check for something like $10.080. I MIGHT HAVE paid a guy a few hundred to collect used tickets and straighten out my taxes so I could get it all back come tax time, can’t remember though 😏
. They took the $3800 taxes out right there and cut me a check for something like $10.080. I MIGHT HAVE paid a guy a few hundred to collect used tickets and straighten out my taxes so I could get it all back come tax time, can’t remember though 😏
Way to go Perk. When you hit big next time, don't use losing tickets. IRS will check tickets, time stamped on ticket, location where ticket was issued, etc. and figure out they weren't yours. You're in the clear now.
Bettors get a "signer". They hang around the cashier (large bet) window, and will sign the w-2 in their name.
@perkdog , That is freakin unbelievable! I would have flipped out. The most I've ever won was 50 bucks on a scratchoff ticket, and I was happy for a week. I can't imagine winning that much. Un freakin believable!
Thanks bud! Yea I don’t even remember the exacts but I don’t even go to the track anymore. Just Poker and Casino now.
True story buddy 🍻
We need @stevek to do a dissertation on Sports Betting ☝️
I'm just waiting for the Michael Jordan and Pete Rose degenerate gambler comments. Those are always a tasty treat!
I'm still mesmerized every time I see it though and still haven't figured out which one won.
pete rose murdered MJ's dad!
ragging on MJ aint the same with out dandydime around to stick up for him
it aint always about you DD
@bronco2078 Hope I didn’t cross the TMI with my track story there bud 😂
it wasn't the TMI per se , it was the math problems , it takes to a dark place
Well the last math class I completed was Math 9 so I get it 👍👍
Been gambling since I was old enough to reach a card table. As long as it isn’t an obsession or addiction I have no problem. Every state has lottery (or most). Numbers have been around since the beginning of time. Romans gambled. Egyptians gambled. Second oldest profession.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
I've thought about playing the lottery, I couldn't imagine hitting the jackpot , that would be awesome. There's a convenient store about 100 yards from where I live, I walk up there a lot, so I might pick up some tickets next time I go. Or I could just send my dog up there for me, I already send him to the bank for me all the time.
The oldest profession should be legal everywhere as well 😏
I like to review the spreads in football, but I’m not much of a conventional gambler. The only time I buy lottery tickets is at Christmas time for stocking stuffers.
Of, I do buy coins that is a big gamble, which of late has been a poor bet.
As an aside, I can’t believe that the NFL has moved a franchise to Los Vegas. Many millions of dollars are wagered there every week. There are huge venues dedicated to that activity. Given the history of point shaving and other illegal activities, it’s hard to believe that this won’t be the start of a major scandal.
I forget when, it was well over ten years ago, there were some on here saying they were making good money betting on football games. So before the season began, we all agreed that their picks would be posted in one thread to see exactly how skilled they are. Just pick the games any which way they wanted and simply list the picks of course before game time. I forget who began the thread but he kept tabs of the results.
Well after around eight weeks, everybody except for one member was losing considerably, and the one member who was up a few bucks was the one who had boasted the least. In fact, i don't recall him boasting at all. The thread died out well before the season ended.
If anyone wishes to start another thread like this before the NFL/NCAA football season and show the world how good they are, that's fine with me. I would wish them good luck. I've never rooted against a gambler in my life and never will. I always root for them to win. I wish everybody could beat the bookies, but sadly in the long run, it is always the other way around.
The only possible exception i see to be able to make money at sports betting is thru arbitrage. Betting at two different gambling websites on the same game with their differing odds so that regardless of the game's outcome, including the bookie's juice, you would make money. That's basically how that guy James Holzhauer, the Jeopardy winner, said he was doing it.
Dissertation complete.
No offense intended, but that info is incorrect. In fact Perkdog could have gotten that $3,800 back in full at tax time, by having documented evidence of any gambling losses exceeding $3,800 for that same year such as losing casino markers, lottery tickets, gambling website transactions, horse racing tote tickets from any date in that same year, etc.
So it didn't need to be documentation from the same day at the track or even at the track at all to get the $3,800 back.
But Perkdog is independently wealthy and doesn't need the money. I've read where he owns several large mansions in Martha's Vineyard and parties with the Kennedys. They're so rich they use 52 Mantles as kindling to start fires in their fireplaces.
@stevek I can’t remember back in 1993 what the exact laws were regarding gambling losses being allowed to claim against winnings but I do believe the laws have changed. And since you did such a great job with your dissertation I will fly you out to my island home in Costa Rica to enjoy some fun with my harem of beautiful woman and give you a nice bag of Purple chips when we take my leer Jet to Monaco for some gambling fun. 😂😂😂
You're right and you're wrong.
It's a given Perk's LEGITIMATE gambling losses incurred during the year, can be deducted from gambling winnings. Operative word: Legitimate.
No where did I say it had to be the same day. Of course it's any losses within a calendar year!
You're incorrect as to the set of facts contained herein. Perk said, " _I MIGHT HAVE paid _a guy a few hundred to collect used tickets and straighten out my taxes so I could get it all back come tax time, can’t remember though 😏". Perk is indicating they WERE NOT his losing tickets. These tickets would've been tickets thrown away by many others, and not played by Perk. My point was the IRS can ferret out that Perk didn't make these wagers, and his deduction would not have been allowed.
When you stated "time stamped", i took it to mean the same day as the winning wager. Saying "date stamped" instead, i think would have been clearer to make your point.
I completely agree about being legitimate...that's why i stated "documented evidence", and you're right it had better be legitimate documented evidence.
Frankly, this withholding is one of the most regressive tax laws i've ever seen. I mean probably most gamblers don't know how to get the $3,800 back on their tax return, and windup gambling back the winnings anyway.
Gamblers have enough problems without the government interfering in a nice score once in a while. There oughta be a threshold of say 100k on tax free gambling winnings per year. I'm not an expert on international tax law, but i think many countries don't tax gambling winnings at all. Yea, go ahead and tax the whale, but cut the little guy a break for crying out loud.
I'm not sure if my heart can stand the excitement, but doggone it, for the honor of the CU forum, i'm willing to give it a try.
All i ask is that if i don't survive the adventure, please start a sports talk thread in memoriam titled "stevek has passed, but he died with a smile on his face"
😊
I follow your Incorrect assumption. Date and time are both on the ticket. What good would just the time be? Have you ever seen a horse racing pari-mutuel ticket? Also if he uses tickets from the same day that he picked up off the ground. IRS will determine these tickets Perk used as "losing" tickets aren't his, and disallow the offset, by determining teller window used, time of bet, horses bet, amount of wager, type of wager, etc. May even charge you with fraud.
I have always saved boxes of losing tickets for all the years I deducted gambling losses from winnings.
I actually think they use to require that you have programs from the day of your losing tickets. Can't do that now with online legal gambling.
I know the gambling loss deduction quite well.
When I was into it pretty heavy at the Mirage in Vegas, my game was blackjack. IF you can master card counting and can find good games (which have and continue to be more and more scarce), you can do pretty well. It all depends on your skills and bankroll. Play ONLY at a table that avoids those that play and most likely are tourists, play like amateurs and get crazy excited when they hit a blackjack with a red chip in the bet zone. Playing at a $50 table minimum, immediately eliminates all this noise and the unending witnessing of incredibly poor play. IF you can move up to the high roller pit, all the better, but that takes some very serious cash, skills and guts.
You have to have a very tough stomach when all your double downs, splits and 20s, get nuked by the dealer's 4-5 or 6 card 21, or enough to beat you. You can't play with emotional money, or play when you have issues on your mind. This is strictly a me against the house affair, it matters not what the other players say or do.
As for slots, I admit playing with the wife, just to enjoy some time together. Our favorite slot is the triple diamond $5 and $10 machine. If you hit $1.2k or more on ANY spin, your machine will lock and the attendant happily brings you your $$, along with the dreaded W2-G. Blackjack is a cash game, and the burden is on you to report your wins when you file, as is craps.
At least with blackjack, you have a decision to make and can (depending on your skillset), can do quite well. If there's one thing I learned in all my Vegas, Biloxi, Foxwoods, Mohegan Sun and a ton in between, you absolutely gotta know when to reach for your car keys and walk away!! Always, ALWAYS, ALWAYS play at a casino where you have the most favorable rules for the player. I can't tell you how many times I "surrendered" (look it up), and some players would look at me as though I'd just landed from out of this world. If you don't know the game, or don't care to put in the time and effort to excel, you shouldn't play blackjack. My skills have slowed over the years, as I don't play as often as I once did. I now play a very solid basic strategy game with 18 rules. Come what may, I am locked on those rules and act accordingly. I will also admit, that I do occasionally play at a $5 table, just for the entertainment of watching other players and how they act/react...kinda fun for about an hour. I bet modestly and will either break even, lose very little, or make a small profit. Tourists and junket crowds are the best. Watching them split 5s, 10s and doubling down with cards that have no chance, is really amazing stuff.
All other wages, dog track, horse racing, football, hi-li, whatever, are, IMO, good guesses combined with luck. Of course Texas Holdem is now the big deal...to me it's a psyche game, lots of bluffing and pressing your opponent with heavy bets that would nuke his stack if he lost. I enjoy playing it at the club, but the stakes are low and no harm can be done, I mostly go (or used to), for the camaraderie. We play an elimination thing, 2 games a night, about the most you could win for your $25 entry, is about $125.
I see you play the slots in New Mexico. When Cities of Gold Casino in Pojoaque opened the Red Hot Chile Pepper machines were phenomenal. Over 2 days on these progressive quarter machines, I took home just under $10K.
Al motivated me to post a couple pics. The chips are from the casinos I’ve gambled at over the years, the Vegas ones are from the mid ‘90’s and for Double D I got that winning ticket
If you are referring to me, I've never played a slot machine in New Mexico. Those chips are blackjack wins, after buy-in cost.
I played at the Sandia in Albuquerque and the Rio Puerco just outside of Albuquerque. The triple diamond jackpot was won at MGM Grand, killing time waiting to see Celine Dion at Caesar's. Nice win though...I'll bet that W2G took a bite, which is the sad part of playing slots. Cash game that blackjack and craps! Hint.
Nice collection Paul...I'll have to dig up my chips and post. BTW, with Foxwoods and MS so relatively nearby, blackjack might be for you!! VERY nice ticket...how sweet when you hold the winning paper!! BTW, I'm pretty certain both casinos offer "surrender", an advantage play...your buds will know. I NEVER allow anybody to back bet my bets...this is allowed at FW, and I don't like strangers reaching in for their win and confusing my win...BEWARE that.
I recall having to sign the W2G for poker tournament winnings, but never cash game, and they didn't do the withholding there. Foxwoods was just a great experience period, gorgeous scenery on the drive from Boston (via Providence to knock off RI on my states I've visited) and one of the better poker rooms I've been to.
@MCMLVTopps Al I do like Foxwoods, I get free rooms there, I’d say Mohegan Sun has better restaurants and stores but for $400 a night VS Free I will take Foxwoods. I never play Blackjack, just Slots, Craps and Roulette. Occasionally I will try let it ride or 3 card Poker but that’s it. I can’t handle the poker scene because everyone acts like a pro and talks too much about odds and all that garbage and I just can’t take it. Only home games for poker.
The casinos don’t build those billion dollar buildings, hotels and resorts on the backs of winners. In the long run no one wins besides the bookies and casinos.
If you watch any professional poker tournaments they always show you the players lifetime winnings. They don’t show you how much investment to win it. John Doe has won $7.8 million etc. His tournament entry fees amounted to $10.5 million.etc.
I’ve won many a wager in my years but after 40 years I can assure you I’m down more than I’m up. So as long as you understand it’s just entertainment money than it’s a fun pass time. When it gets to rent money it’s a problem.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Hey Paul...I also liked Foxwoods, especially the drive along the tree lined road and there it is. Very impressive place. Mohegan Sun was just a short visit, with it being so nearby, but when you cross that bridge and see it to the right, it too is very impressive.
Since your chip post, I gathered what I have. Probably represents about 1/3 of all the casinos I've been in. IF you ever go back to Vegas, just off the downtown area was once a joint called The Western...it was a break-in dealer joint, where you don't eat anything, or drink anything that isn't sealed. For grins my buddies and I played on a $5 table, when I bumped up to green, she hollered "checks play"...too funny. You should consider blackjack. Go to www.wizardofodds.com...there you will find a TON of info on every game...it also has a blackjack link that is superb. You can play a lot of games for free to sharpen your skills. BTW, Oxford, ME has a decent place, shouldn't be too bad of a drive for you, right up 95.
The card is almost exactly how I play blackjack...easy to learn. It isn't a guarantee, but does shave the odds in your favor. Look for identical rules, for instance...aces and eights you always split. There are only one of five things you do, stand, hit, split, doubledown...of when available, surrender. You CANNOT win flat betting. PM me if you want more detail. Those cards sell for about $2-$3 at the gift shop. OR, get more serious by counting cards...gets a little tedious and requires a dedication.
Enjoy!
Al
Well, not exactly The "long run" is a mythical place that nobody ever reaches, but it does make for a nice narrative. Thus, my early post about knowing when to reach for your car keys. I'd venture that a substantial, like 80%++ of casino income is derived from the thousands of slot machines that provide a pathetic payout, where people (and you've seen them), play for hours on end slamming benjies into the maw. They then get a "free night", or buff comp and think they're a winner.
Too much focuses on poker these days I know people who actually make a very comfortable living playing blackjack. They have a great act, don't overplay any casino and know when to stop pressing a hot shoe. I also have a close friend, who just couldn't stop when the streak was in hi blower, he just had the thrill of purple and yellow chips...he was careless and got 86d at the Beau Rivage, which, in turn toasted him at all MGM properties, world wide. This guy makes well over $200k per year, and his wife is a CEO, banging another $200k++...and try as I might to convince him to slow down, he wasn't having it...and he burned himself. He was even dumb enough to have a room where he was hammering them for over $10k per visit...this was done with a companion and using hand signals...I don't condone cheating, but, he is just one of many stories I know of. So smart, but so very, very stupid!!
Well, yes and no If you're playing with rent money, you are dumber than a bag of rocks. Those that play blackjack recreationally are generally very low profit winners, or losers, who grumble about the dealer, or the guy next to them who took the dealer's bust card. I never looked at my blackjack play as "entertainment money", I was always in it to win it. On many, many occasions, when I'd get up $1 or $2k, I colored up and called it a nice day. I mentioned the emotional part of blackjack above. And yes, I've seen players who were obviously very desperate to win, pretty sad and pathetic.
Years ago i did a rough won-loss tabulation of Phil Hellmuth's poker tournament record. It wasn't easy to do because of course i have no knowledge about the number of tournaments that he has entered. However he at the time was a prolific tournament player. So i calculated the approximate entry fees, travel expenses, etc, from over the years, and despite the fact that he is a top bracelet winner, i came up with the estimate that he was likely down around a half million to a million dollars over his career.
Now that doesn't mean that overall Hellmuth is a loser. Because the big money that is made in poker is not in the playing of the game, it's in selling the game to others such as owning or getting paid to promote poker websites, writing books on how to win at poker, and thru gambling website affiliate commission programs. Hellmuth of course is actively involved in all of that, and has most likely made a lot more than a million dollars from that over his career. So despite the net loss at playing the game, Hellmuth overall is a big winner off the game of poker.
To sum up with your good comments in mind, when it comes to gambling, the old saying is, "Eat your betting money but don't bet your eating money."
Paul - You mentioned Monaco. I actually visited that casino a few decades ago. I didn't travel all the way to Europe just to do that, but during a two week vacation touring a few countries, we did stop by there.
It was impressive but considering its reputation, it wasn't as glamorous as i thought it would be. Maybe because i only played some craps on the ground floor right inside the entrance way with the other gambling minions. Perhaps in other areas with the high rollers, it was more stylish.
Long story short, I was up and down then up, then i decided to quit after playing for around an hour. I finished up a five franc chip which i still have. It's the only casino that i ever walked out a long term winner - LOL
I have the chip buried in the house somewhere. If i can find it, i'll post a pic here.
Nice story @stevek I’ve never been but my grandfather used to go back in the 60’s I’m told. Oh yes I come from a long line of gamblers 😳. I’d love to see the chip sometime if you find it
I have a computer Blackjack game. I used the system on this card and consistently came out ahead, but only by a little.