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Ebay Managed Payments
jwitten
Posts: 5,077 ✭✭✭✭✭
Sorry if this has been discussed. I tried searching and did not find much. I had heard rumors about the new ebay payment system, but got a call from ebay today saying I had to switch over to managed payments by the 15th (two days away!) or I could not sell anymore. Said they were not allowing paypal anymore. I asked her a few questions, saying I had heard a rumor about no coin sales, and she did not know. Well, I found the link on ebay saying coin sales are not allowed under this new system. What the heck?! Does anyone know if there is a work around? Or are my ebay days done?
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/managed-payments-restricted-items-policy?id=5009
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!!!
There have been some other threads on this subject, but no one really knows what they really mean. So you were actually told you would no longer be able to sell if you did not switch over? Do you have an ebay store? Do you just sell coins, or do you sell other things also? Just curious... I have not gotten any such notice that I am aware of....
I only sell coins. I have a small store subscription (not sure the actual name.. basic maybe?) Yes, I was told I had to switch by July 15th. I also see where all sellers will eventually have to switch to the new system. After doing a bit more research, I found a few sellers of coins that made the switch early, and have not been able to list coins since then. The fees are also going up (of course), but I guess that doesn't matter if I cannot sell coins. I found the thread where this was previously discussed, but PCGS shut it down because they called ebay and were assured coin sells would continue. Well, ebay has now said everyone will eventually be moved to managed sales, and their own link says coin sales are not allowed. Yikes.
https://pages.ebay.com/seller-center/service-and-payments/managed-payments-on-ebay.html#m22_tb_a1__5
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/managed-payments-restricted-items-policy?id=5009
after perusing the info again, it sounds like ebay is being gutted based on the list of items not permitted under the new system. (there is a little blurb about some things being added in the future but i'm not holding my breath)
so it seems it is time to look for other venues to buy/sell ANY numismatic item. any item numismatically related will be removed in any category after a future specified date.
Start around 9:40
Hopefully they don't screw around with us too much.
Early American Copper, Bust and Seated.
CoinWorld had an article on this a month or so ago. eBay said they would keep doing coin sales but didn’t offer details. It was clear it wouldn’t be through managed payments. So probably just another FUBAR on eBay’s communication front.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
Well, I guess I'll see in a couple days if they really force me to use managed payments or not. I can't see them forcing coin sellers to use it if they are not able to list in the coin category yet. They really should have worked out all the kinks before rolling the new system out.
Maybe you can give an update on Wed. Do you have any current auctions that they will close out?
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
No, I did not have anything listed as of this morning. I went ahead and added two buy it nows coins to see what would happen. One person I saw commenting on this speculated that if you had coins listed, they would not force you to go to the new system yet, so that was what I was hoping for.
I did not hear anything from eBay yet. I guess I don’t need to switch.
fwiw, i did read from the links above that those that "chose" to switch now would make it easier on them later. i'll have to dig some more on that one because it is coming to ALL sellers on this venue. better or worse, time will tell.
Link?
Well, I see they slipped the following message on my seller dashboard; though I have not gotten an ultimatum notice yet, probably not too far off:
"eBay is now managing payments
By the end of 2020, eBay will manage payments for most sellers. Get your business ready early and register now. We’ll notify you before activating your account for managed payments, starting in late July 2020.late July 2020.
Managed payments provides sellers one place to sell and get paid on eBay and buyers more ways to pay."
Yippee.
There is an interesting thread in the Cards category regarding this... concerns about having to provide bank statements to sign up, and the possibility of having your bank funds frozen in certain cases.
And also some valid concerns regarding more potential frauds (with the seller taking the hit). Think I might be taking a vacation from ebay for awhile.
so will I !!! unfortunately..... all flights where I want to go to are not going.....
You mean linking to a bank account le you did for Paypal? How is it different? If you have a dedicated account for this, I don't see an issue. It's just a sweep account.
To add insult to injury....if you sign up for managed payments you get a bunch of free listings starting next month.....in certain categories. Non store and starter stores do get extra listings in all categories....and of course...coins are not one of the categories that qualify for the free listings for larger store subscribers.
I think I'm going to call ebay some time today and vent! Every change they have made over the last few years has been negative to me.
The biggest was when they changed the terms of stores. I used to get 2500 listings per month with each additional listing costing 5 cents for $100 per month.
Now I can either pay $60 per month for 1000 listings with each additional listing costing 10 cents or $200 per month for 10,000 listings which I would never use.
Do the math...I was in no mans land as I usually have 3000-3500 items I can keep listed per month. So what ebay did was jack my costs up $140 per month if I wanted to keep every thing listed which I did not! They also raised final value fees a bit and lowered the Top Seller discount and eventually made it not worth fooling with(free returns...doesn't take many to wipe out that measly discount)
The past few months with all these free listings my sales are up 300-400%. Ebay thinks they are profiting off listing fees...which they are if people will pay for them. There real revenue comes from final value fees. My ebay fees have been north of $1,000 per month since they allowed me to list all the inventory I wanted with out paying listing fees. Before they were a third or less than that. I'm a man of principle and have always felt you should pay a listing fee or a commission, but not both.
I will say this....there are a few sellers that do abuse these free listings(50,000) per month. I allow my listings to run the 30 days. Another seller I know is just spamming! He is hell bent on using those 50,000 listings and is ending and relisting his 1400 or so listings every 2 days! I actually think it is hurting his sales.
Ebay with all their wisdom should be able to see the light and offer the listings to sellers who are productive and do not abuse unlimited free listings.
If this turns into a productive discussion I might even send ebay a link to it if someone else doesn't beat me to it!
Off my Soapbox!
I got that notification to switch on the 15th as well. But I also herd that you cant list coins and bullion, so i put a call into ebay , no return call from them in 3 days. So Ill just keep listing the way I do until i get shut down, Then Ill have to find another venue?? I guess ebay doesnt cat about the 45k in revenue I give them year after year, and I am only a marginal size seller.
From: Managed payments restricted items policy
https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/selling-policies/managed-payments-restricted-items-policy?id=5009
We are working to expand the types of items allowed by sellers in managed payments, and ensure we are compliant to support them in the future.
FWIW...
It does say most so I assume we will be able to continue as usual...just won't get the perks those that do enroll.
I am off Feebay with selling coins and go somewhere else!
Perhaps no difference... perhaps not. I did not link to a checking account, but used a credit card account to allow more protection. Yes, I realize I can set up a separate 'feeder' checking account for ebay, but I'm close to the point of saying why bother? Ebay keeps coming up with more policies that keep making things more difficult for the seller; at some point some will stand back and say.... enough.
I will probably take a wait and see stance, and see how it works and affects others. I'm concerned about fraud protection (and of course as of now does not look like we can even post coins any longer, though it may change in the future. But it doesn't help the sellers hit with it now).
Justin tells me there is nothing I should be concerned about. If I understood him correctly, the coin category(ies) should be added later this year or by the end of next year. Seller protection could actually improve with this change and fees (as compared to PayPal) might actually be slightly lower. So, either this is the case or he is simply trying to keep his old man calm. Time will tell.
Wondercoin
They have been negotiating for close to a year on this. I think the only way coins will be allowed under managed payments is if they are able to work out a deal with paypal...which I'm pretty sure they haven't yet. If they don't I think things will continue as they are now and will continue to be able to accept paypal.
What suxs for me is I'm also selling my shell collection which will fall under managed payments. The only solution I can see at this point is to stop selling my shells or open another store for my shells.
Interesting to note that now there will be a higher fee for the sales tax
https://pages.ebay.com/seller-center/service-and-payments/simpler-fees.html
"The new final value fee is calculated on the total amount of the sale, inclusive of tax, shipping or handling, and any other applicable fees. The old final value fee was calculated on the total amount of the sale, excluding tax. "
The new final value fee for non-store accounts will be a bundled number of 12.35% for most categories (less or more on certain ones).
So under the old way your $100 sale with sales tax of $5 (if the sales tax was 5%) would be as follows
~10% of $100 to ebay = $10
~2.9% of $105 (plus $0.30) to paypal = $3.05 + .30 = $3.35
...total fee $13.35
Now it is:
~12.35% plus $0.30 of the $105 = $12.97 + $.30 = $13.27 ...you save $0.08
Now if the sales tax is 10%...
Old way: (.10 x 100)+(.029 x 110)+.30 = $13.49
New way (.1235 x 110)+.30 = $13.89 ....you pay $0.40 more
Also interesting to note that your funds won't be available right away:
"Seller payouts are consistently initiated to their bank account within 2 business days of an order confirmation, regardless of how a buyer paid. Sellers can schedule their payout at a frequency they choose (daily as funds are available, or weekly)."
https://pages.ebay.com/seller-center/service-and-payments/managed-payments-on-ebay.html
This is one of the things that makes eBay so frustrating. If you're a big enough seller, you've got someone you can talk to there but for all us little fish, calling customer service about this would be a total waste of time. Obviously, someone at eBay understands the situation- the least they could do would be to have an information page available on their website that explained what they were doing regarding managed payments and what we, as sellers, might expect to see happening as things progress.
Wow, fees on sales tax now. GC looking more attractive all the time...
That's if you have a personal account not a business account. I had to link a bank account to PayPal years ago after I hit the limits that required I have a business account.
There already are PayPal fees on sales tax.
The eBay payment processing fees are actually lower but they (may) be throwing in the FVF. Total cost may then depend on the price point.
I'd also point out that the example shown is for non-stores. The rate for stores is lower than the non-store rate.
Actually, there documentation is a little confusing. It looks like there is no longer a fee discount for having a store in the documentation I'm looking at. If so, I'm getting out of the coin business and going strictly stamps!
From the post which prompted mine:
"The new final value fee is calculated on the total amount of the sale, inclusive of tax, shipping or handling, and any other applicable fees. The old final value fee was calculated on the total amount of the sale, excluding tax. "
EDIT: You edited your post to say "PayPal fees" instead of "fees" while I was responding. If one sells through GC, PayPal fees are not passed on directly to the seller, so that's moot as an argument here.
I will be selling coins on eBay for the next 20 years or more for sure.
Thank you, eBay for such a wonderful platform.
https://ebay.com/sch/ctf_error_coins/m.html?item=231931417174&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2562
Sorry, your awfully quick. I edited it 30 seconds after I posted it.
I wasn't arguing for or against GC. Although GC would be a disaster for $50 items as the total fees are more like 25%. I'm not sure that this change in fee structure at eBay (relative to eBay) is that significant. For a lot of items, it might well be cheaper.
For a $50 coin, GC fees would be 15% + $3 = $10.50 == 21%. Now factor in that you don't have to do any descriptions, photography, answering of messages, dealing with potential scammers, etc., and that you can package a bunch of $50 coins into a single shipment instead of mailing them to customers individually, and the value proposition isn't necessarily that bad even at that price point.
Oh yeah, and you won't have to pay ANY fees on sales tax...
It doesn't matter what the fees are on, it matters what they add up to. 21% MUCH GREATER. And do the math on a $25 coin you are over 25%.
I can charge the customers to ship the coins, so there is no advantage there.
Dude, all I said is that with eBay now adding sales tax to the amount on which fees are charged, it becomes relatively less attractive vs. a venue that isn't increasing fees. It's not necessarily even about the minor extra charge, it's about the principle of the thing. There is no way to justify charging a fee on a pass-through (sales tax) other than greed.
Depending on the price point of the coin and a number of other factors, eBay may still be the best option among the available selling venues.
I have to start a new thread on this. I just talked to eBay. I don't want to hijack this thread.
I think there is something folks are missing. It could end up being a good thing. The fee mentioned above is the total fee including the payment processing...which is cheaper than it is now if ebay doesn't raise the final value fees. The other positive is for the time being(as it was told to me) is you get all your fees back on a return. I still don't like the fact that ebay is chasing the Amazonian platform.
Yes the 12.35% is the total fee (for most categories without a store). It is lower than the 10% ebay plus 2.9% from paypal. However, for larger transactions with sales tax, you will pay more since they charge the entire 12.35% of the sales tax amount compared to just 2.9% currently.
You seem to be forgetting you would be paying paypal fees on the sales tax! Look at it this way....The FVF is 10% and the payment processing fee is 2.35% as opposed to 2.9% + 30 cents! Yes you pay Paypal fees on sales tax.
I'm not. If you look at my example, it factors in the paypal fees on sales tax. Before the sales tax was only subject to the 2.9% paypal fees (the 10% ebay fees did not apply to sales tax). Now the sales tax is subject to the entire 12.35%.
So under the old way your $100 sale with sales tax of $5 (if the sales tax was 5%) would be as follows
~10% of $100 to ebay = $10
~2.9% of $105 (plus $0.30) to paypal = $3.05 + .30 = $3.35
...total fee $13.35
Now it is:
~12.35% plus $0.30 of the $105 = $12.97 + $.30 = $13.27 ...you save $0.08
Now if the sales tax is 10%...
Old way: (.10 x 100)+(.029 x 110)+.30 = $13.49
New way (.1235 x 110)+.30 = $13.89 ....you pay $0.40 more
All I know is that over time, the percentage that eBay rakes will much more likely be going up than down. I also know that the chances of reversing the fee on sales tax is roughly zero. So, you can spin it any way you like, but net net it will end up costing sellers.
Hmmm...looks like you may be right. It is going to be interesting to see if this is the beginning of the death roll for ebay when it comes to coins.
Fingers crossed someone will step up and take the coin biz away from them. If the right group bought usacoinbook.com tweaked it and promoted it I could see it being a success!
You can say the same about GC or Heritage.
No, since neither of those firms charge fees on sales tax, you can't.
I'm referring to your 1st sentence.
Again, it's the total fee, not how it breaks down.
If eBay decides to throw away the coin business they're currently getting, I'd bet somebody else will step up to the plate. When they bailed on guns, that online business ended up elsewhere. It might be messy for a while, but it'll get sorted out somehow. People are too used to being able to buy coins on eBay to want to go back to just buying at shows and the local coin shop.
You can sell on webstore.com it is totally free and you can take checks and money orders if you are so inclined.
You can list coins for sale lots of places. Over the years, I've tried at least a dozen, and being able to list coins for sale /= selling coins. The overwhelming majority of buyers are on eBay, however, and will not leave unless eBay kicks the coin sellers out.