"Almost all gold in 1933 was pre-33 gold. Most of that coin had to be considered illegal at the time or FDRs edict was meaningless."
=========================
Nope. You pretty much got all that mixed up.
The pre-1933 gold was perfectly legal if part of one's collection or in the amount of up to $100 face value if you were not a collector. Supposedly collectors couldn't have more than 5 of the same coin (duplicates). The big gold coin collectors of that period (Bass, Newman, James Stack, Pittman etc.) didn't turn any gold in, they bought even more.
Yes, FDR's March 1933 gold edict was basically meaningless. But, 98% of the common folk didn't know that. They were scared because of the "potential" fines and imprisonment. And many turn in their gold. In fact FDR's March 1933 gold edict was ILLEGAL. 100% ILLEGAL. That was because such edicts had to be signed by the Secretary of the Treasury.....William Woodin. This was brought out in a court case at that time. So in Sept/Oct 1933 FGR has Woodin re-issue and SIGN the gold order. But that still wasn't quite enough. And when written into law for the Jan 1934 Gold Reserve Act an exemption was allowed for pre-1933 gold coins of particular importance and rarity.......and generally at the time interpreted to mean ALL pre-1933 US gold coins.
No one was ever prosecuted for hanging on to their gold coins. There was one case where the owner of a bank safety deposit box with $3000-$5000 in gold coins took the govt to court to get his gold back after the bank confiscated it. That's when they all discovered the govt had an illegal edict in play. Following this court case they fixed the edict but still kept the guy's coins. It wasn't a collection either. Just a pile of gold.
You can read the particulars on this via Attorney (and coin collector) David Ganz's articles on the subject. Very well researched and easily available. I've reference them here numerous times if you care to look. Ganz was a long time member of the ANA Board of Governors.
Here's a prosecution in 1954 that was eventually overturned in 1962, not because the 1934 Act itself was invalid but because the court deemed that the economic emergency referenced in the 1934 Act had passed.
"Almost all gold in 1933 was pre-33 gold. Most of that coin had to be considered illegal at the time or FDRs edict was meaningless."
=========================
Nope. You pretty much got all that mixed up.
The pre-1933 gold was perfectly legal if part of one's collection or in the amount of up to $100 face value if you were not a collector. Supposedly collectors couldn't have more than 5 of the same coin (duplicates). The big gold coin collectors of that period (Bass, Newman, James Stack, Pittman etc.) didn't turn any gold in, they bought even more.
Yes, FDR's March 1933 gold edict was basically meaningless. But, 98% of the common folk didn't know that. They were scared because of the "potential" fines and imprisonment. And many turn in their gold. In fact FDR's March 1933 gold edict was ILLEGAL. 100% ILLEGAL. That was because such edicts had to be signed by the Secretary of the Treasury.....William Woodin. This was brought out in a court case at that time. So in Sept/Oct 1933 FGR has Woodin re-issue and SIGN the gold order. But that still wasn't quite enough. And when written into law for the Jan 1934 Gold Reserve Act an exemption was allowed for pre-1933 gold coins of particular importance and rarity.......and generally at the time interpreted to mean ALL pre-1933 US gold coins.
No one was ever prosecuted for hanging on to their gold coins. There was one case where the owner of a bank safety deposit box with $3000-$5000 in gold coins took the govt to court to get his gold back after the bank confiscated it. That's when they all discovered the govt had an illegal edict in play. Following this court case they fixed the edict but still kept the guy's coins. It wasn't a collection either. Just a pile of gold.
You can read the particulars on this via Attorney (and coin collector) David Ganz's articles on the subject. Very well researched and easily available. I've reference them here numerous times if you care to look. Ganz was a long time member of the ANA Board of Governors.
Slightly different issue, but the government claims it still has rights under the 1934 Act to manipulate the price of gold:
"Almost all gold in 1933 was pre-33 gold. Most of that coin had to be considered illegal at the time or FDRs edict was meaningless."
=========================
Nope. You pretty much got all that mixed up.
The pre-1933 gold was perfectly legal if part of one's collection or in the amount of up to $100 face value if you were not a collector. Supposedly collectors couldn't have more than 5 of the same coin (duplicates). The big gold coin collectors of that period (Bass, Newman, James Stack, Pittman etc.) didn't turn any gold in, they bought even more.
Yes, FDR's March 1933 gold edict was basically meaningless. But, 98% of the common folk didn't know that. They were scared because of the "potential" fines and imprisonment. And many turn in their gold. In fact FDR's March 1933 gold edict was ILLEGAL. 100% ILLEGAL. That was because such edicts had to be signed by the Secretary of the Treasury.....William Woodin. This was brought out in a court case at that time. So in Sept/Oct 1933 FGR has Woodin re-issue and SIGN the gold order. But that still wasn't quite enough. And when written into law for the Jan 1934 Gold Reserve Act an exemption was allowed for pre-1933 gold coins of particular importance and rarity.......and generally at the time interpreted to mean ALL pre-1933 US gold coins.
No one was ever prosecuted for hanging on to their gold coins. There was one case where the owner of a bank safety deposit box with $3000-$5000 in gold coins took the govt to court to get his gold back after the bank confiscated it. That's when they all discovered the govt had an illegal edict in play. Following this court case they fixed the edict but still kept the guy's coins. It wasn't a collection either. Just a pile of gold.
You can read the particulars on this via Attorney (and coin collector) David Ganz's articles on the subject. Very well researched and easily available. I've reference them here numerous times if you care to look. Ganz was a long time member of the ANA Board of Governors.
If you're putting anything of greater value than $800 in the US mail why not go registered insured, it is the cheapest and safest way to mail? Only exception would be those with third party insurance, and those willing to take the risk (self insured in the case of bullion).
As we have seen in the OP, you are wasting your money insuring bullion and not choosing registered mail.
Congrats. Often, if you go to great lengths to learn the game and the rules, you can, by enormous effort, and through layers of bureaucracy, occasionally, if you’re very lucky find someone who will see it the right way and lift a finger to help you. You gotta speak their language and make it easy for them though.
I used a connection from my engineering days to propose a design change to a dangerous intersection near my home. Construction just finished, roughly 5 years after I made the call. There’s nothing like an efficient government to meet the needs of the people.
Wonderful news and well deserved! Always good to hear when something like this works out the way it should.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Congrats! Way to stick with it. Had a similar insurance situation on a ‘65 Mustang that took letters and proof to show wasn’t a $2,000 car, once.
These wins are very gratifying.
Comments
https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/FSupp/212/584/2253392/
Here's a prosecution in 1954 that was eventually overturned in 1962, not because the 1934 Act itself was invalid but because the court deemed that the economic emergency referenced in the 1934 Act had passed.
Slightly different issue, but the government claims it still has rights under the 1934 Act to manipulate the price of gold:
https://forbes.com/sites/greatspeculations/2019/05/22/how-to-unrig-the-gold-market-according-to-gatas-chris-powell/#197d365e42a5://
https://casetext.com/case/united-states-v-levy://
If you're putting anything of greater value than $800 in the US mail why not go registered insured, it is the cheapest and safest way to mail? Only exception would be those with third party insurance, and those willing to take the risk (self insured in the case of bullion).
As we have seen in the OP, you are wasting your money insuring bullion and not choosing registered mail.
Capital investment depends on confidence. - Martin Armstrong
BUMP for update
https://imdb.com/name/nm1835107/
Congratulations! Good follow through!
Good job!
Thank you for posting the detailed update. Very informative.
Glad it worked out once you followed through with an appeal.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Congrats. Often, if you go to great lengths to learn the game and the rules, you can, by enormous effort, and through layers of bureaucracy, occasionally, if you’re very lucky find someone who will see it the right way and lift a finger to help you. You gotta speak their language and make it easy for them though.
I used a connection from my engineering days to propose a design change to a dangerous intersection near my home. Construction just finished, roughly 5 years after I made the call. There’s nothing like an efficient government to meet the needs of the people.
3 months fighting an insurance company over a policy you paid for, to guarantee that their service you paid for works.
at least you were made whole.
So the “snark” on this board also serves a useful purpose!
Nice to learn. 😋
Glad to learn you got made whole as well as to find out there were some holes in the analysis of the “snarkers” who motivated you to go forward.
Wonderful news and well deserved! Always good to hear when something like this works out the way it should.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Congrats! Way to stick with it. Had a similar insurance situation on a ‘65 Mustang that took letters and proof to show wasn’t a $2,000 car, once.
These wins are very gratifying.