PayPal Policy Updates

WAYNEAS

for those PP users who have not yet been notified
Here is a link to the changes going into effect in July
https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/ua/upcoming-policies-full?locale.x=en_US

ms70

"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

WAYNEAS

@ms70 said:
"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

IMO this will have a serious affect on both sellers and buyers alike
and with eBay's speculative changes in regards to PayPal usages on its site, it might be time to find a new method of payment

derryb

"We are excluding items intended for resale, including single item transactions or transactions that include multiple items, from reimbursement eligibility under our Purchase Protection Program."

derryb

@ms70 said:
"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

HA! one more reason to hold silver. wonder if this includes gold watches and gold jewelry?

I've always used PP for these claims as a seller. Anyone know if ebay provides such seller protection?

jt88

Wow, Wonder how this will affect gold bar selling?

MasonG

@derryb said:
"We are excluding items intended for resale, including single item transactions or transactions that include multiple items, from reimbursement eligibility under our Purchase Protection Program."

I wonder how they expect to be able to distinguish between purchases intended for resale and not intended for resale.

derryb

@jt88 said:
Wow, Wonder how this will affect gold bar selling?

as an ebay gold seller i will be ceasing operations with ebay. Seller protection is the only thing that made their fees acceptable. BST and GC should see an increase in listings.

jt88

I have couple gold bar on eBay. I just ended them. Will not list those on eBay any more

BStrauss3

You don't seem to realize that eBay and PayPal are separate companies at this point... Why throw the fleaBay baby out with the PayPal bathwater - don't accept PayPal.

jt88

Well, eBay will not allow money order, check, money transfer etc. if you don’t accept PayPal then you have to take credit card. For high price item PayPal is the only option. The outcome is pretty much the same even if you take credit card. Once the buyer file as not authorized use of the card you are on your own to flight that. If you lose you may not get your item back. Why take the risk.

jmlanzaf

@MasonG said:

@derryb said:
"We are excluding items intended for resale, including single item transactions or transactions that include multiple items, from reimbursement eligibility under our Purchase Protection Program."

I wonder how they expect to be able to distinguish between purchases intended for resale and not intended for resale.

Resale certificate?

Might be trying to cut down on tax cheats

jmlanzaf

@derryb said:

@jt88 said:
Wow, Wonder how this will affect gold bar selling?

as an ebay gold seller i will be ceasing operations with ebay. Seller protection is the only thing that made their fees acceptable. BST and GC should see an increase in listings.

Ebay isn't paypal. Does Ayden have the same exemption?

wondercoin

*** Question for the guys who view this PayPal update as significant regarding the gold, etc....

A colleague tells me this is really insignificant in the scheme of things ...

“Look, when it comes down to it Seller Protection is a complete and utter smokescreen. When push comes to shove, neither eBay nor PayPal will have your back, as a buyer saying nothing was in the box has them automatically win regardless of what item it is, and a buyer reversing a transaction with their credit card supersedes anything eBay or PayPal can do.

When it comes down to it, there just has to be an understanding that there will be "costs of doing business" as all businesses face [and] keeping a constantly running blocked bidders list and doing a little research before shipping goes a long way. But, in summation, Seller Protection is a joke and you can't really put a lot of stake in it.”

Is my colleague correct, or is he missing something here? What has been your experience, especially on the (2) scenarios/ actions by the buyer that he identified?

Wondercoin

WAYNEAS

Imo eBay and PayPal are disavowing any purchase of a gold item
there must be so much fraud that it is costing them big bucks to protect
Imo again eBay and PayPal are one
We need a new way to pay for a transaction
maybe we need a new coin auction site
I favor at this time Great Collections with no sales tax to me and their acceptance of payment
eBay lists more coins that I could update my sets with but I can wait for them to appear on GC

derryb

@wondercoin said:
*** Question for the guys who view this PayPal update as significant regarding the gold, etc....

A colleague tells me this is really insignificant in the scheme of things ...

“Look, when it comes down to it Seller Protection is a complete and utter smokescreen. When push comes to shove, neither eBay nor PayPal will have your back, as a buyer saying nothing was in the box has them automatically win regardless of what item it is, and a buyer reversing a transaction with their credit card supersedes anything eBay or PayPal can do.

When it comes down to it, there just has to be an understanding that there will be "costs of doing business" as all businesses face [and] keeping a constantly running blocked bidders list and doing a little research before shipping goes a long way. But, in summation, Seller Protection is a joke and you can't really put a lot of stake in it.”

Is my colleague correct, or is he missing something here? What has been your experience, especially on the (2) scenarios/ actions by the buyer that he identified?

Wondercoin

The update concerning gold is significant to me, 90% of my dollar volume is graded gold coins. It will alter my decision to use PP and likely ebay.

In two decades of filing PP claims as both a seller and a buyer PP has always had my back on claims that total well over $20K. If you are have demonstrated honesty as an ebayer and you play by the rules PP will normally have your back. In recent years they have backed off their 100% protection on CC chargebacks. They will however fight your case with the CC company but if the CC company sides with your buyer you are not protected in most cases.

I had a buyer claim nothing was in the box and PP had my back. They likely reimbursed him and ate the loss.

wondercoin

“It will alter my decision to use PP and likely ebay.”

Derryb... is there any realistic way to still use eBay, but allow the buyers to pay maybe $100 via PayPal and the rest via a non credit card method in light of PayPal excluding these coins? Just thinking out loud.

Wondercoin

jt88

"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

I think this only means gold bar not gold coin. Or gold necklace etc

jkrk

@jt88 said:
"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

I think this only means gold bar not gold coin. Or gold necklace etc

Makes sense to me.

I don't know about anyone else but PP charges me nearly 3% for a transaction. I out of 33 transactions needs to be a problem (total loss) before PP loses a dime (Excluding infrastructure costs, etc). Does anyone think the problems are nearly that large?

Jimnight

Crazy!!

jmlanzaf

@wondercoin said:
*** Question for the guys who view this PayPal update as significant regarding the gold, etc....

A colleague tells me this is really insignificant in the scheme of things ...

“Look, when it comes down to it Seller Protection is a complete and utter smokescreen. When push comes to shove, neither eBay nor PayPal will have your back, as a buyer saying nothing was in the box has them automatically win regardless of what item it is, and a buyer reversing a transaction with their credit card supersedes anything eBay or PayPal can do.

When it comes down to it, there just has to be an understanding that there will be "costs of doing business" as all businesses face [and] keeping a constantly running blocked bidders list and doing a little research before shipping goes a long way. But, in summation, Seller Protection is a joke and you can't really put a lot of stake in it.”

Is my colleague correct, or is he missing something here? What has been your experience, especially on the (2) scenarios/ actions by the buyer that he identified?

Wondercoin

Your friend is, I believe, partly correct. eBay or PayPal will not interfere with the credit card companies investigation and determination. That is true. BUT, eBay or PayPal can, and often will, reimburse you if you have followed their rules regardless of what the credit card company does. Sometimes, disagreements end up with both buyer and seller getting paid.

jmlanzaf

@jkrk said:

@jt88 said:
"We are adding payments made in respect of gold (in physical form or in exchange-traded form) to the list of ineligible items and transactions under our Seller Protection Policy."

I think this only means gold bar not gold coin. Or gold necklace etc

Makes sense to me.

I don't know about anyone else but PP charges me nearly 3% for a transaction. I out of 33 transactions needs to be a problem (total loss) before PP loses a dime (Excluding infrastructure costs, etc). Does anyone think the problems are nearly that large?

The 3% isn't just for insurance. The 3% has to include the costs of running the entire company from rent to salaries to equipment to advertising to insurance.

jmlanzaf

@wondercoin said:
“It will alter my decision to use PP and likely ebay.”

Derryb... is there any realistic way to still use eBay, but allow the buyers to pay maybe $100 via PayPal and the rest via a non credit card method in light of PayPal excluding these coins? Just thinking out loud.

Wondercoin

I don't think so. eBay doesn't allow for partial payments.

blitzdude

God bless eBay and God bless Paypal. The greatest coin store and bank on planet earth. I continue to use both, more than ever.

jmlanzaf

@blitzdude said:
God bless eBay and God bless Paypal. The greatest coin store and bank on planet earth. I continue to use both, more than ever.

well, we now know @ErrorsOnCoins alt...

WAYNEAS

@blitzdude said:
God bless eBay and God bless Paypal. The greatest coin store and bank on planet earth. I continue to use both, more than ever.

do you sell gold

logger7

Ebay asked for my state sales and use tax certificate/number so I wouldn't be charged on numismatic items here in Roger Sherman's state (CT), if you remember Sherman was largely responsible for putting the "gold clause" in the Constitution. I scanned and sent them a copy and then they said something about needing a "license" so I wouldn't be charged state sales tax, which isn't due anyway in CT.

I spoke with the state department of revenue expert today who said that is something ebay needs to refund me, though I had filed for a refund with them.

I wonder exactly which gold coins paypal will no longer be covering, just bullion coins? Though they can try to do a lot of things in their financial interest as they have gotten a lot more demanding and greedy over the last few years, what people will put up with and what the states may push back on is another matter. Any form of fraud is a violations of contracts, so they can't be privy to or an accomplice of fraud without risking being sued.

LanceNewmanOCC

not sure if this is a change or if i have simply been overlooking it for a while but i saw the option to transfer funds instantly for a 1% fee via paypal but i had to reconfirm card and/or bank but my bank doesn't allow that option directly, even for a business account. grrr - may have to call about that.

i get the impression the paypal card is not needed.

LanceNewmanOCC

@jmlanzaf said:
I don't think so. eBay doesn't allow for partial payments.

there may be a way. if you only have say 10% of a purchase amount in the paypal account and you are able to choose that as an option, it still gives other options to pay, so you may be able to "force" the software's parameters by getting creative or perhaps the simply allow it.

i for sure do this either when purchasing or paying fees. when you look at the statement is says $xx. paypal balance and $xx bank/card or whatever other option you have.

edited to add, there may be a few variables. type of paypal account, level of verification, types of cards/banks etc.

its the same thing with browsers and ebay accounts. not all of ours are 100% similar.

topstuf

PayPal must be tired of their "float."

TwoSides2aCoin

As a seller , PP protected me a few times. Looks like they won't, anymore. Crash and burn.

derryb

I'm wid blitzboy, they both are better than sliced bread

derryb

@LanceNewmanOCC said:

@jmlanzaf said:
I don't think so. eBay doesn't allow for partial payments.

there may be a way. if you only have say 10% of a purchase amount in the paypal account and you are able to choose that as an option, it still gives other options to pay, so you may be able to "force" the software's parameters by getting creative or perhaps the simply allow it.

i for sure do this either when purchasing or paying fees. when you look at the statement is says $xx. paypal balance and $xx bank/card or whatever other option you have.

edited to add, there may be a few variables. type of paypal account, level of verification, types of cards/banks etc.

its the same thing with browsers and ebay accounts. not all of ours are 100% similar.

no matter how one pays (PP balance, CC or bank account) a payment through paypal falls under their agreement and under their restriction on protection.