@DIMEMAN said:
It's hard for me to believe that coins only account for 2% of Ebay sales.
I'd believe it. I think 99.99% of eBay sales is just random crap. Either way, I would think whatever percentage coins & bullion are, the category HAS to be a giant money maker.
Why? If it is 1.8% of sales - which it is - why does it have to account for even 2% of gross profit? There's nothing in coins that is more profitable than other categories. In fact, final value fees are HIGHER in OTHER categories.
And of that 1.8% of sales, how much of that is bullion from Apmex who pays only a couple percent in final value fees.
You folks need to stop thinking like coin people and start thinking like retailers.
I'm not thinking as a coin person here. I am thinking as a MONEY person here.
Well than, as a money person, let's assume for fun that 70% of the 1.8% of sales is from bullion sellers like apmex who pay only about 2%. Let's assume everyone else pays the 6.15%. That means that eBay only gets 3.24% of the $1.4 billion. That means that the gross receipts from the coin & stamp category is $45.5 million
Total eBay receipts in 2019 were $10.72 billion
That would make coins 0.42% of eBay receipts. LESS THAN HALF A PERCENT.
To preserve that half of a percent, eBay would presumably need to create a completely different payment system.
It does not necessarily pay to do that.
Of course, it is far more likely that eBay negotiates something with Adyen to allow them to use that system. But, as any true business person knows, not all business is worth having.
Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
@giorgio11 said:
A very murky thread, among others. I don't know what Managed Payments are, and don't know what Adyen is, either. I've gotten used to PayPal, and I'm just one not very high-tech guy trying to make a living. (My tech support is mostly me. Gulp.)
And after 4 pages there's no comment by Ebay to clear this up?
The second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
So, it stands to reason that some items allowed on ebay that are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments will have to be paid for using a different method. Most likely direct acceptance of credit cards by the seller. I would look for the fuller rollout of the "managed payment system" to be an effort by ebay to rid itself of paypal.
Coffebean provided a link. Ebay did not post a reply.
Like I said, the second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
@DIMEMAN said:
It's hard for me to believe that coins only account for 2% of Ebay sales.
I'd believe it. I think 99.99% of eBay sales is just random crap. Either way, I would think whatever percentage coins & bullion are, the category HAS to be a giant money maker.
Why? If it is 1.8% of sales - which it is - why does it have to account for even 2% of gross profit? There's nothing in coins that is more profitable than other categories. In fact, final value fees are HIGHER in OTHER categories.
And of that 1.8% of sales, how much of that is bullion from Apmex who pays only a couple percent in final value fees.
You folks need to stop thinking like coin people and start thinking like retailers.
I'm not thinking as a coin person here. I am thinking as a MONEY person here.
Well than, as a money person, let's assume for fun that 70% of the 1.8% of sales is from bullion sellers like apmex who pay only about 2%. Let's assume everyone else pays the 6.15%. That means that eBay only gets 3.24% of the $1.4 billion. That means that the gross receipts from the coin & stamp category is $45.5 million
Total eBay receipts in 2019 were $10.72 billion
That would make coins 0.42% of eBay receipts. LESS THAN HALF A PERCENT.
To preserve that half of a percent, eBay would presumably need to create a completely different payment system.
It does not necessarily pay to do that.
Of course, it is far more likely that eBay negotiates something with Adyen to allow them to use that system. But, as any true business person knows, not all business is worth having.
Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
@keets said: Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
Which actually is in line with my not so spurious assumption... 😗
@keets said: Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
Which actually is in line with my not so spurious assumption... 😗
Is there an actual ebay archieves which could shed light on these numbers OR are we all just guessing?
It really doesn't matter to me, but I personally hate to see Ebay drop coins.
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
@Zoins said:
Basically, they want to make mainline items more like Amazon. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up doing fulfillment later as well.
Interesting. As an Ebay stockholder I wouldn't mind seeing Ebay expand into adding some of those Amazon profits as well.
FWIW, Amazon's growing fleet of its own Amazon Prime brand jets is one of the few bright spots for the aviation industry at present.
This is a multi-year goal of theirs. Coins don't tend to fare well on Amazon either, so while these changes may hurt coin dealers, they may help Ebay overall.
@Zoins said:
Basically, they want to make mainline items more like Amazon. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up doing fulfillment later as well.
Interesting. As an Ebay stockholder I wouldn't mind seeing Ebay expand into adding some of those Amazon profits as well.
FWIW, Amazon's growing fleet of its own Amazon Prime brand jets is one of the few bright spots for the aviation industry at present.
This is a multi-year goal of theirs. Coins don't tend to fare well on Amazon either, so while theses changes may hurt coin dealers, they may help Ebay overall.
Amazon wants a MINIMUM of 20% of all sales...and that doesn't count the payment processing. It would be hard to sell most coins there as they don't tend to have 30% margins.
@keets said: Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
Which actually is in line with my not so spurious assumption... 😗
Is there an actual ebay archieves which could shed light on these numbers OR are we all just guessing?
It really doesn't matter to me, but I personally hate to see Ebay drop coins.
You're not going to like my answer:
You can find numbers for the bigger categories. The tiny ones like coins don't tend to get broken out. I can't even find numbers for coins and stamps separately much less bullion and collector coins.
There is a data service that might have that info, but I didn't want to pay the $40 to get the data just to "win" the argument. [Does anyone ever "win" an argument around here? LOL]
@bigjpst said:
But eBay does not need to create a new payment processor for coin sales. Just keep using the one that has been working for years.
That effectively is a "new" or at least an "additional" processor once they migrate to managed payments and need to keep a separate processor for coins. [If that were to happen.]
@Zoins said:
Basically, they want to make mainline items more like Amazon. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up doing fulfillment later as well.
Interesting. As an Ebay stockholder I wouldn't mind seeing Ebay expand into adding some of those Amazon profits as well.
FWIW, Amazon's growing fleet of its own Amazon Prime brand jets is one of the few bright spots for the aviation industry at present.
This is a multi-year goal of theirs. Coins don't tend to fare well on Amazon either, so while theses changes may hurt coin dealers, they may help Ebay overall.
Amazon wants a MINIMUM of 20% of all sales...and that doesn't count the payment processing. It would be hard to sell most coins there as they don't tend to have 30% margins.
@Zoins said:
Basically, they want to make mainline items more like Amazon. I wouldn't be surprised if they end up doing fulfillment later as well.
Interesting. As an Ebay stockholder I wouldn't mind seeing Ebay expand into adding some of those Amazon profits as well.
FWIW, Amazon's growing fleet of its own Amazon Prime brand jets is one of the few bright spots for the aviation industry at present.
This is a multi-year goal of theirs. Coins don't tend to fare well on Amazon either, so while theses changes may hurt coin dealers, they may help Ebay overall.
Amazon wants a MINIMUM of 20% of all sales...and that doesn't count the payment processing. It would be hard to sell most coins there as they don't tend to have 30% margins.
What's a good margin for coin dealers for an eBay alternative? I assume it needs to be less than what GC is charging?
It's hard to make a direct comparison:
GC is 10+% for items over $1000 and 15+% for items under $1000. This assumes you are using ACH payments, otherwise add 3% to both. eBay is about 10% if using PayPal. If you could use ACH, it would be about 3% less.
If you wanted to compete with eBay, you'd need to be in the 10% range and offer all the same protections. It is tough to do. Even Amazon doesn't try to compete on price with eBay.
@Boosibri said:
I cannot logically see a public company walking away from 2+% of revenue unless it comes with an outsized expansion in profits or at least profitability.
Think of the money lost in buyer protection programs through fraud. Think about the costs of running a collections team to recoup money owed to you. My perception is that they prefer larger sellers and will be following Amazon's model.
@abcde12345 said:
eBay coin sales (excluding bullion) is approximately 1.8% of total sales yet account for 18% of all escalated eBay complaints. One source states coin sales are "break even at best" for the business.
@Boosibri said:
I cannot logically see a public company walking away from 2+% of revenue unless it comes with an outsized expansion in profits or at least profitability.
Think of the money lost in buyer protection programs through fraud. Think about the costs of running a collections team to recoup money owed to you. My perception is that they prefer larger sellers and will be following Amazon's model.
No way. While there may favor big sellers their entire business model is about providing anyone the opportunity to enter into a global marketplace. They will not try and out Amazon Amazon. That is nonsense.
@abcde12345 said:
eBay coin sales (excluding bullion) is approximately 1.8% of total sales yet account for 18% of all escalated eBay complaints. One source states coin sales are "break even at best" for the business.
and your reliable source for this data?
The Onion. Why, is there a problem?
none whatsoever since many other posts to this thread seem to find belief there.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
@keets said: Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
Which actually is in line with my not so spurious assumption... 😗
Is there an actual ebay archieves which could shed light on these numbers OR are we all just guessing?
It really doesn't matter to me, but I personally hate to see Ebay drop coins.
You're not going to like my answer:
You can find numbers for the bigger categories. The tiny ones like coins don't tend to get broken out. I can't even find numbers for coins and stamps separately much less bullion and collector coins.
There is a data service that might have that info, but I didn't want to pay the $40 to get the data just to "win" the argument. [Does anyone ever "win" an argument around here? LOL]
I wasn't trying to win anything. It wasn't even intended as an argument. I just stated "it was hard to believe". When I say that I am not saying that you are wrong. Does that make since.
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
@JBK said:
This news/rumor is ludicrous but it is believable because Ebay has done ludicrous things in the past.
There is more to lose than a couple % points in business. Is someone builds another platform where the prohibited items can be sold, there is no stopping them from selling other things that would cut into ebay's business.
Coffebean provided a link. Ebay did not post a reply.
Like I said, the second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
ROFL. Exactly---Like I said. The "Ebay Community" is not Ebay. It is Ebay users. The link was posted by a member not Ebay. Never look for Ebay to post there. When I replied to your comment I didn't recognize your pic change. I would have never replied knowing your Ebay obsession , and the endless back and forth bickering that always results
Coffebean provided a link. Ebay did not post a reply.
Like I said, the second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
ROFL. Exactly---Like I said. The "Ebay Community" is not Ebay. It is Ebay users. The link was posted by a member not Ebay. Never look for Ebay to post there. When I replied to your comment I didn't recognize your pic change. I would have never replied knowing your Ebay obsession , and the endless back and forth bickering that always results
Actually, there are at least 2 posts in there that are from eBay.
Coffebean provided a link. Ebay did not post a reply.
Like I said, the second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
ROFL. Exactly---Like I said. The "Ebay Community" is not Ebay. It is Ebay users. The link was posted by a member not Ebay. Never look for Ebay to post there. When I replied to your comment I didn't recognize your pic change. I would have never replied knowing your Ebay obsession , and the endless back and forth bickering that always results
The link posted by a blog member is to an ebay page. While someone not from ebay posted the link, they posted an ebay link. It's called an ebay link because it links to an ebay page. I never said ebay posted to the blog. What I correctly did say was the blog contained an ebay link that shed light on the OP's question. The back and forth on this is because of the hardness of your head and your desire to be right even when you are wrong.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
I don't think any " true " coin collector would miss e-bay. The place has turned into a zoo for junk, fakes and items that belong at a flea market.
Sure there are some legitimate 1st class dealers who still sell there, but whatever they have for sale is also available from them on their own websites usually at a lower cost.
Bob
Past transactions with: Lordmarcovan, WTCG, YogiBerraFan, Phoenin21, LindeDad, Coll3ctor, blue594, robkoll, Mike Dixon, BloodMan, Flakthat and others.
@BobSav said:
I don't think any " true " coin collector would miss e-bay. The place has turned into a zoo for junk, fakes and items that belong at a flea market.
Sure there are some legitimate 1st class dealers who still sell there, but whatever they have for sale is also available from them on their own websites usually at a lower cost.
Bob
I am now going to have to re-evaluate as I consider myself a true collector yet also fancy browsing eBay at times.
@BobSav said:
I don't think any " true " coin collector would miss e-bay. The place has turned into a zoo for junk, fakes and items that belong at a flea market.
Sure there are some legitimate 1st class dealers who still sell there, but whatever they have for sale is also available from them on their own websites usually at a lower cost.
Bob
I rely on ebay to sell a lot of my duplicates and buy a lot of my material. After you've been on ebay a while you learn to sift through the junk. The truth is that most material out in the world is junk and eBay reflects that. A good dealer will sift out the junk for you, and that is essentially one of their services that you pay for.
Ebay has long filled an important role in the $20 and under market. There are tons of items that are under $20 that I couldn't get good money for from a dealer because their time just isn't worth flipping low value items at modest margins. If I'm willing to put in the effort I can get my money out of my coins on eBay.
If ebay goes away (somewhere down the line), there will be an opportunity for something else to replace it. I've bought 500-1000 things on ebay and only returned 2 items. If I hadn't been able to return those items, it would have been okay. A replacement service doesn't need to offer the protections ebay does to still be successful. The impetus can be on the seller itself. I personally would always take returns on anything I sell regardless of what ebay says because my integrity and reputation are more valuable to me than the $10 whatsit I sold. I buy from coin shows under the assumption I might never see that dealer again after I leave the room.
I spend a couple hours a day doing my canned searches on Ebay. There is gold in them thar hills for those with enough time and patience to sift through the junk. Close to half of my Trade dollar collection has been built from Ebay purchases, mostly raw, and 90% have ultimately straight graded. I've also picked four 1918/7 Buffs, three 1918/7 SLQs and one 1916/16 Buff, plus two 1961 Proof DDR Franklins over the past 5 years or so to name a few. I would be greatly saddened if Ebay prohibits coin selling. It's been a rewarding and profitable hobby. My collection has been built almost entirely off the profits of Ebay flips, buys and sells...
@jmlanzaf said:
Do you think they only browse while in incognito mode?
I would expect so. Everyone knows there's nothing but junk and counterfeits on eBay and if you get caught looking there, you are forced to surrender your Serious Collector card and your membership in the society is revoked.
@jmlanzaf said:
Do you think they only browse while in incognito mode?
I would expect so. Everyone knows there's nothing but junk and counterfeits on eBay and if you get caught looking there, you are forced to surrender your Serious Collector card and your membership in the society is revoked.
eBay has now surpassed CAC as the worst topic for a thread....and that's even after @coinstartled was banned.
@BobSav said:
I don't think any " true " coin collector would miss e-bay. The place has turned into a zoo for junk, fakes and items that belong at a flea market.
Sure there are some legitimate 1st class dealers who still sell there, but whatever they have for sale is also available from them on their own websites usually at a lower cost.
Bob
@abcde12345 said:
I am now going to have to re-evaluate as I consider myself a true collector yet also fancy browsing eBay at times.
Don't worry- you'll be fine browsing eBay. Dumping on eBay is mostly "virtue signalling" for coin collectors.
Do you think they only browse while in incognito mode?
I had to train myself to do that so that I wouldn't get constant reminders from eBay that fakes that people link to from here are still available for sale.
@amwldcoin said:
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
"I have to LOL at this"
Mention of the value of your inventory, relative to the (unknown) net worth of someone you don’t even know proves nothing - except perhaps, that you have bad manners.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I guess his troll like response is fine by you...eh??> @MFeld said:
@amwldcoin said:
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
"I have to LOL at this"
Mention of the value of your inventory, relative to the (unknown) net worth of someone you don’t even know proves nothing - except perhaps, that you have bad manners.
@amwldcoin said:
I guess his troll like response is fine by you...eh??> @MFeld said:
@amwldcoin said:
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
"I have to LOL at this"
Mention of the value of your inventory, relative to the (unknown) net worth of someone you don’t even know proves nothing - except perhaps, that you have bad manners.
Actually, it isn’t. But if you’re going to try to counter it, why not do so with facts (such as you did , mentioning yiur years in business) but without stooping to that level? Obviously, it’s your choice.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@amwldcoin said:
I guess his troll like response is fine by you...eh??> @MFeld said:
@amwldcoin said:
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
@amwldcoin said:
I have to LOL at this! No one is forcing you to buy coins on ebay. The funny part is...I stopped selling on ebay around 2000 because I could get a lot more for my coins at coin shows. Fast forward to 5 or 6 years ago and I started selling on ebay again to much more confident buyers. Ebay has done a pretty good job of making it a safe venue to trade for buyers...not as much so for sellers. The short story is...my ebay sales are now double to triple what my coin show sales are or were before the pandemic and my only source of sales and exposure for my off ebay customers to see my inventory.
@Azurescens said:
I hope ebay stops selling coins. I don't know about you guys but it's gotten really bad on the buyer end of things. Sure deals but so many more scammers, glamour shots, weasely sellers etc.
I'm okay spending +10% at GC or any other website. I'd pay more simply to change brands of online coin venues just to feel better about buying coins. It shouldn't be stressful. I shouldn't have to worry if this is the one time the seller goes off the deep end and scams me for 6k or whatever.
I'm already buying from people who (apparently) advertise here and had no idea. So leaving ebay is already saving me money and leads to better coins.
At this point may as well shoot an email and find no fee payment and everybody but ebay wins. I'd like to see coin forums become bustling economies. I know it's a lot to ask and I don't have any solutions myself. But ebay has been bad for some time, search engine optimization is terrible, filters are terrible, the reporting system is terrible, notifications are terrible, eBay bucks got gimped. It's all a joke. I'm almost embarrassed our hobby existing there in such a capacity. Every other hobby still has healthy niche markets outside of eBay.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
"I have to LOL at this"
Mention of the value of your inventory, relative to the (unknown) net worth of someone you don’t even know proves nothing - except perhaps, that you have bad manners.
Actually, it isn’t. But if you’re going to try to counter it, why not do so with facts (such as you did , mentioning yiur years in business) but without stooping to that level? Obviously, it’s your choice.
Comments
I bet not by dollar value
Like I said, the second post in the ebay community blog provides an ebay link that says this: "Certain items are not allowed to be listed by sellers participating in managed payments, even though those items may be allowed on eBay."
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
There's a lot of counterfeit coins sold on eBay.> @DIMEMAN said:
In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
Where in the World do you get the idea that 70% of coin sales is Bullion! Probably 95/5 in favor of coins.
nice..........................call into question a somewhat spurious assumption with one even more ridiculous. absent anything hard and true, I think someone who is actually hip deep in the business might be better suited to make an assumption:
--- In dollars sold in 2018/2019, my gut feeling is that the Coin & Category is:
80-85% bullion (includes gold eagles, bullion etc.)
15-20% coins
Ian.
Which actually is in line with my not so spurious assumption... 😗
Is there an actual ebay archieves which could shed light on these numbers OR are we all just guessing?
It really doesn't matter to me, but I personally hate to see Ebay drop coins.
Interesting. As an Ebay stockholder I wouldn't mind seeing Ebay expand into adding some of those Amazon profits as well.
FWIW, Amazon's growing fleet of its own Amazon Prime brand jets is one of the few bright spots for the aviation industry at present.
So you couldn't cut it before, and settled by crawling back?
It must be why you have such a highly trafficked site and online presence and mean something to the discussion at hand.
You're clearly not the kind of successful seller I'm talking about when I say someone will pick up where ebay left off.
"I have to LOL at this"
This is a multi-year goal of theirs. Coins don't tend to fare well on Amazon either, so while these changes may hurt coin dealers, they may help Ebay overall.
Jumping pages helps end threads.
Amazon wants a MINIMUM of 20% of all sales...and that doesn't count the payment processing. It would be hard to sell most coins there as they don't tend to have 30% margins.
Cue @ErrorsOnCoins
You're not going to like my answer:
You can find numbers for the bigger categories. The tiny ones like coins don't tend to get broken out. I can't even find numbers for coins and stamps separately much less bullion and collector coins.
There is a data service that might have that info, but I didn't want to pay the $40 to get the data just to "win" the argument. [Does anyone ever "win" an argument around here? LOL]
That effectively is a "new" or at least an "additional" processor once they migrate to managed payments and need to keep a separate processor for coins. [If that were to happen.]
What's a good margin for coin dealers for an eBay alternative? I assume it needs to be less than what GC is charging?
It's hard to make a direct comparison:
GC is 10+% for items over $1000 and 15+% for items under $1000. This assumes you are using ACH payments, otherwise add 3% to both. eBay is about 10% if using PayPal. If you could use ACH, it would be about 3% less.
If you wanted to compete with eBay, you'd need to be in the 10% range and offer all the same protections. It is tough to do. Even Amazon doesn't try to compete on price with eBay.
I found this. Kind of interesting, while trying to do a little research. This is the cost of payment processing with Adyen:
https://adyen.com/pricing?navItem=northamerica
Think of the money lost in buyer protection programs through fraud. Think about the costs of running a collections team to recoup money owed to you. My perception is that they prefer larger sellers and will be following Amazon's model.
The Onion. Why, is there a problem?
No way. While there may favor big sellers their entire business model is about providing anyone the opportunity to enter into a global marketplace. They will not try and out Amazon Amazon. That is nonsense.
Latin American Collection
none whatsoever since many other posts to this thread seem to find belief there.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
I wasn't trying to win anything. It wasn't even intended as an argument. I just stated "it was hard to believe". When I say that I am not saying that you are wrong. Does that make since.
Is there an actual ebay archieves which could shed light on these numbers OR are we all just guessing?
you guys are all just guessing, and the fact that one guess might be close is nothing to brag about. it's still just a guess!!
WTF are you talking about? I've been a dealer for over 25 years...20 of those full time! I'm still here with an inventory that would probably pale your net worth!
Edit to add...Are you a Troll????
Already exists its called Webstore.com
ROFL. Exactly---Like I said. The "Ebay Community" is not Ebay. It is Ebay users. The link was posted by a member not Ebay. Never look for Ebay to post there. When I replied to your comment I didn't recognize your pic change. I would have never replied knowing your Ebay obsession , and the endless back and forth bickering that always results
Actually, there are at least 2 posts in there that are from eBay.
The link posted by a blog member is to an ebay page. While someone not from ebay posted the link, they posted an ebay link. It's called an ebay link because it links to an ebay page. I never said ebay posted to the blog. What I correctly did say was the blog contained an ebay link that shed light on the OP's question. The back and forth on this is because of the hardness of your head and your desire to be right even when you are wrong.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
Where is the beating of a dead horse gif, seems about time for that.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
For times when fact cannot be beat into a thick skull.
"How many times can a man turn his head and pretend he just doesn’t see?” - Bob Dylan
It took me about 10 seconds to look that up but I'm not telling until this thread goes 10 pages.
My Saint Set
Haven't heard of eBay moving away from coin sales but wouldn't be surprised since half of what's sold there is counterfeit.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
I don't think any " true " coin collector would miss e-bay. The place has turned into a zoo for junk, fakes and items that belong at a flea market.
Sure there are some legitimate 1st class dealers who still sell there, but whatever they have for sale is also available from them on their own websites usually at a lower cost.
Bob
Lordmarcovan, WTCG, YogiBerraFan, Phoenin21, LindeDad, Coll3ctor, blue594, robkoll, Mike Dixon, BloodMan, Flakthat and others.
I am now going to have to re-evaluate as I consider myself a true collector yet also fancy browsing eBay at times.
I heard somewhere that eBay was moving to China so it would be closer to the product sources.
But don't tell a soul.
I heard eBay hired coinstartled to run things
Don't be sad. There's still Etsy and Alibaba. I do so like the magic Morgan dollar.
I rely on ebay to sell a lot of my duplicates and buy a lot of my material. After you've been on ebay a while you learn to sift through the junk. The truth is that most material out in the world is junk and eBay reflects that. A good dealer will sift out the junk for you, and that is essentially one of their services that you pay for.
Ebay has long filled an important role in the $20 and under market. There are tons of items that are under $20 that I couldn't get good money for from a dealer because their time just isn't worth flipping low value items at modest margins. If I'm willing to put in the effort I can get my money out of my coins on eBay.
If ebay goes away (somewhere down the line), there will be an opportunity for something else to replace it. I've bought 500-1000 things on ebay and only returned 2 items. If I hadn't been able to return those items, it would have been okay. A replacement service doesn't need to offer the protections ebay does to still be successful. The impetus can be on the seller itself. I personally would always take returns on anything I sell regardless of what ebay says because my integrity and reputation are more valuable to me than the $10 whatsit I sold. I buy from coin shows under the assumption I might never see that dealer again after I leave the room.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
Don't worry- you'll be fine browsing eBay. Dumping on eBay is mostly "virtue signalling" for coin collectors.
I spend a couple hours a day doing my canned searches on Ebay. There is gold in them thar hills for those with enough time and patience to sift through the junk. Close to half of my Trade dollar collection has been built from Ebay purchases, mostly raw, and 90% have ultimately straight graded. I've also picked four 1918/7 Buffs, three 1918/7 SLQs and one 1916/16 Buff, plus two 1961 Proof DDR Franklins over the past 5 years or so to name a few. I would be greatly saddened if Ebay prohibits coin selling. It's been a rewarding and profitable hobby. My collection has been built almost entirely off the profits of Ebay flips, buys and sells...
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
Do a search for "coins" and there are over one million listings. It would not make sense to just say "Nah!"
Do you think they only browse while in incognito mode?
I would expect so. Everyone knows there's nothing but junk and counterfeits on eBay and if you get caught looking there, you are forced to surrender your Serious Collector card and your membership in the society is revoked.
eBay has now surpassed CAC as the worst topic for a thread....and that's even after @coinstartled was banned.
https://ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=m570.l1313&_nkw=%2420+Saint+66+PCGS&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_osacat=0&_odkw=1909-S+VDB+PCGS
I had to train myself to do that so that I wouldn't get constant reminders from eBay that fakes that people link to from here are still available for sale.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Mention of the value of your inventory, relative to the (unknown) net worth of someone you don’t even know proves nothing - except perhaps, that you have bad manners.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Set up a pi-hole device and you won’t have to worry about incognito mode.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
I guess his troll like response is fine by you...eh??> @MFeld said:
Actually, it isn’t. But if you’re going to try to counter it, why not do so with facts (such as you did , mentioning yiur years in business) but without stooping to that level? Obviously, it’s your choice.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
That was my troll response!