What is the best way to sell generic gold.
Coinobsessed
Posts: 52 ✭✭✭
I have ms64 NGC and Pcgs Saint Gaudens. Looking for best way to sell them. Any suggestions would be helpful. The spread between the buy and sell prices at wholesalers is over $200.
0
Answers
local coin shop?
you could try our Buy Sell Trade forum, but as a newbie you will likely be asked to ship before payment.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
I agree. If you are fortunate to be in an area with access to multiple LCSs, use Yelp or Google and identify the best rated options. Call several and ask for a quote to purchase from you today. If you are talking more than 2 coins then you may have trouble getting cash in full. Based on responses, including payment methods, devise a plan. I am not sure that after fees you would make more selling privately.
Let’s just say i have a significant number of them.
don't sell them in significant quantity to the same place at the same time. You will be expected to give a volume discount. Stretch it out.
With current high premiums you should be able to sell on ebay and still do better than spot. Opening an ebay store will get you from 10% to approx. 6% fees.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
The one caveat for eBay is understand that you can get hit with a charge back once you sell the item. Which is more likely if the price of spot goes down.
I believe a false chargeback amounts to fraud. They are not used for "I changed my mind." They are used for unauthorized credit card use.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Where did you get them? That's a good place to start.
PayPal comes with buyer protection. They lean towards protecting the buyer. The buyer just has to claim the item received was not as described. That can also override the buyer having to pay for return shipping, potentially getting a full refund as well including those shipping costs. Just something to take into consideration.
The OP can research what the coins sell for on eBay, factor in what auctions offered free shipping and which did not. PayPal fees plus selling fees are still going to be over 10% total. Bids will take shipping into factor. Also, a new seller listing piles of slabbed coins could be deemed suspicious. If the seller can sell the coins locally for $200 or less below the expected eBay values. cash in hand immediately may be the best option.
Local coin shop for fast cash. As mentioned above, don't sell large quantities at once.
Also, if you sell $10k+ at any one shop, at one time or in a short period of time, there is reporting that will be done to meet legal requirements.
If you have multiple shops, find out how far apart they are in pricing and go from there (maybe sell 5 at a couple different shops?) Some shops may be able to move them faster, as they have people waiting for gold, and they may offer a little more than a shop that doesn't sell as many of what you are supplying.
For, probably, a slightly better price, try selling on the BST. Be prepared to have some quick pics available and post in the thread and also for people to want to have some comfort safety as you are knew/unknown here and that is a substantial amount of funds. Could be shipping first. Could be using a pay service, with a fee, that would give some comfort.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Sell on the BST, get references from your buyers and ship first, then sit back and relax.
You shouldnt have an accumulation without already having an exit strategy.
A well detailed and already tested strategy
Bronco2078 thx. What kind of comment is that. You don’t know anything about me or my plans. It is easy to sell to Heritage, Rarcoa, I am looking to see if there is a way to get better than bid while bid/asks are wide.
What we think is "better" tends to come with risks that subjectively are riskier for some more than others.
Gold showed some weakness, your buyers are more bearish now than they were yesterday.
@Coinobsessed
"Bronco2078 thx. What kind of comment is that. You don’t know anything about me or my plans. It is easy to sell to Heritage, Rarcoa, I am looking to see if there is a way to get better than bid while bid/asks are wide."
YOU came here asking for "Any suggestions." Now you are arguing with folks trying to help you. @bronco2078 is absolutely correct! It you have a "significant number of them," then you should of had an exit strategy.
There's a wealth of information here and people willing to give it.. If you don't agree, thank them and move on!
Masscrew, I don’t find if helpful for someone to say you should of had a plan. Who said I didn’t have a plan. Due to unusual circumstances in the market i am trying to find what are the best options now. Other people are giving suggestions. I don’t need you to tell me to move on, why don’t you move on.
Any suggestions would be helpful. The spread between the buy and sell prices at wholesalers is over $200.
In this market, that spread doesn't surprise me.
local coin shop?
worth a shot
you could try our Buy Sell Trade forum
worth a shot
Where did you get them? That's a good place to start.
probably the best place to start
I am looking to see if there is a way to get better than bid while bid/asks are wide.
wouldn't that depend on the quantity, and the market?
@bronco2078 is absolutely correct! It you have a "significant number of them," then you should of had an exit strategy.
you may have missed when he said, "You don’t know anything about me or my plans." Therefore, he may well have had an exit strategy, and we both know that any given buyer's market position and/or buying policies can certainly vary over time and with changes in the market's direction - hence, his inquiry.
And even if he had NO exit strategy, I would question how important an exit strategy really is. My exit strategy is to sell gradually, over time - but that might be exactly the wrong thing to do. Who really knows what market conditions are going to be from the time when you first get in, to the time you get out.
And you might have changed your mind by that time anyway, for any number of personal reasons.
I knew it would happen.
@Coinobsessed And we were supposed to know you had an exit strategy... how? You asked for suggestions and you're getting them. Just because you don't like the answers is irrelevant!
You're absolutely right, we don't know anything about you. At the time, you had a post count of like 8..
Too me, you come off as confrontational right out of the gate! Great way to start... you'll move on WAY before I do.
Exactly! We don't know you and you are not a member of the Circle of Trust here. We've had scammers come to the BST in the past. They would sell expensive coins and then disappear after being paid for them without ever shipping them. Unless you are willing to ship them first to a buyer here who is well established forum member, most forum members here won't be interested in sending that much money to a total stranger.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
this happens all the time though. Lots of people get good at buying but along the way you need to sell to see what getting out is like , it can be a real eye opener
Great Collections is an option, with fees you will do better than eBay and not have to stress about the payment issues. The only problem there is the delay factor. IIRC my last things I sold there took about a month to get listed, and I will be waiting a month to get paid. Price was okay but better than I could have expected after the fees on eBay. Plus they had to delay a couple auctions due to the lockdown.
As a complete unknown entity (and I say this as a rare visiter to the PM forum...not sure if I'd be in the 'circle of trust' here) I would expect you to ship first. Too many scammers around. Not an offensive statement aimed at you, but no one knows you here.
Sounds like the OP is just trying to grab an extra $100 per coin from the spreads.
I think the OP really needs to ask himself many more questions of his own intentions, motives, strategy, time horizon, risk objectives, liquidity needs, ect.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
You've been here since 2003 and have almost 5000 posts so I'd consider you as a member of the Circle of Trust.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
You've been here since 2003 and have almost 5000 posts so I'd consider you as a member of the Circle of Trust.
And Stork has made many good posts in the past.
I knew it would happen.
If you are looking to move the gold fast, then I would recommend local shops. If you can liquidate over time, then GC would be an excellent way to go...Cheers, RickO
Yes, one issue with GC or any auction is that the price can drop back down before they get listed. Heritage is different as they sell directly as well as in auction. I have no local coin shops, only pawn shops that pay less than spot.
New member has some coins to sell and he came herE looking for suggestions. And we welcome him with a bit of hostility.
Welcome to the forum. There are some good suggestions in response to your question. Where you got them is no more our business than where APMEX gets their slabbed coins. Your exit strategy is your concern only. Good luck, hope you find a buyer and you both are happy with the transaction.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Thanks for the comments. I could have given some more background in the question. I am a sophisticated collector who has been collecting for decades. I have a significant collection of rare coins. Many of the national dealers know me and will send coins for me to look at. I understand that if people don’t know me they will want shipment or some type of protection. I don’t post very often, as dealers have told me not to. I had posted more before but changed user names, due to having to register again. I retired so I have more time now. I do not have to sell or need the money. Usually spreads are fairly narrow at the major wholesalers. This is an unusual time where spreads have widened to approximately $175. One can still sell at wholesale. One can go to a show and have a dealer sell for you and try and get over the bid. Not many shows now. One can sell through eBay, but fees eat up the narrowing of the spread. One can go to GC, but again fees eat up the gain. In addition, if one is trying to time the market, conditions can change. I am contacting some dealers to see if they have any clients.
Again thx to those trying to help. I may come off as confrontational, but I don’t think it is helpful for people to say you should have had a plan. This could really turn off those who are new to coins. I also don’t find it helpful for some to ask me to sell to them at melt. How many read my post exposing a coin doctor? All is I did was get attacked. I just had lunch with a former coin doctor, whose partner is still active. Again thx for those willing to help.
There's no hostility here that I can see. We just wanted him to be aware that selling his coins here on the BST may be difficult since he is a new and unproven member here unless he is willing to ship first prior to being paid. Do you disagree that this is the case?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I meant how to actually unload not why or when.
Since most of my gold is 20 francs sovereigns or gold pesos , I can do a search on completed sales et voila
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Swiss-Gold-Coin-20-Francs-Helvetia-AU-1935b-/264681289061?hash=item3da03bf565:g:qm8AAOSwJjtefn6D&nma=true&si=%2BthC1BOMeb%2BxVUX%2BLLJri7CwyKY%3D&orig_cvip=true&nordt=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
do the math by backing out my fees
click sell similar and have an ebay listing live in minutes that will sell in an hour
because I deal with a lot of local guys face to face if I call one up and say I have this what are you paying ? They will tell me over the phone they won't need to look at the coin because of what it is
Now sure I have stuff that is less liquid but i stopped buying such things about a year ago and am gradually unwinding via ebay and my little antique store booth at whatever pace they go they wont be replaced.
When I say less liquid I mean all the crazy things you wind up with from buying whole collections. I have lots of circulated wheat pennies v nickles random BU morgans in slabs goofy mint and proof sets of all types. All that stuff is flowing out now because it takes forever to sell. I didn't overpay for it in dollar terms but I didn't really account for how dead some of it is and I want no more of it. I wont buy whole collections any more even heavily discounting the widgets.
Any silver or gold in my core stack will be sellable in minutes , the other stuff may never move in a way that pleases me but its declining because even if it sells slowly its never getting added to again.
I have stuff that is less liquid but i stopped buying such things about a year ago
I had a little sit-down conversation with myself such that I will only buy non-bullion that fits into an actual collection, and most of that is bullion anyhow. So, I get some gratification even if I pay a small premium such as with the bullion Queens Beasts or even a 5 oz puck. As time goes by, some of those collections will be sold, probably as straight bullion - but I don't expect to be hurt too bad with bullion-related collections anyway.
Any silver or gold in my core stack will be sellable in minutes , the other stuff may never move in a way that pleases me but its declining because even if it sells slowly its never getting added to again.
Yup, I figure that I do have plenty of miscellaneous stuff that might sell slowly, but it's almost like free money.
Almost.
I knew it would happen.
I'm finding out that its not free money. I had a huge pile of G and VG v nickles , like 50 rolls of them from one guy and I basically paid 5 dollars a roll which is a quarter each and they supposedly should be worth a buck each but thats a lot of theory and not practice.
At the antique store I moved 30 rolls at $25 a roll but it took a year. That represented a $20 profit per roll but it was about as much fun as a root canal.
Stuff like that doesn't really move on ebay either. I mean it does but shipping is way up fees are up and scammers are up so its an electronic root canal at best
I have too many weird things like that. Somehow I wound up with 2 rolls of copper nickle indian head cents .
I have world mint and proof sets bought at melt years ago even though some of the franklin mint coins are doing well now its another root canal.
I've got a full set of ASE proofs whose value is more theoretical than actual. When you have a full set of proof ASE's you are never going to be happy with what you are offered by anyone if you think they have a much higher value. There is a series ruined by the US mint I have had it for 4 years or so I felt I should keep it going one coin per year but it stopped being added to in 2018. I'm not wasting my own money on S and W mint marked identical proofs every year now its over. The mint killed that stone dead. They cost too much and they added pointless issues , they went full Canada
What is a filled album of state quarters including the silver proofs worth? The melt value of the silver proofs plus 30 minutes at the car wash. Literally no one same wants a silver proof state quarter , in fact they are the least valued form of 90% junk.
I could go on but until you try to sell the thing you own all your future plans are pipe dreams. Actively sell all the time so you don't keep buying some crap 10 years beyond the point no one wants it.
If you have slabbed gold sell one and see just what that slab is worth or not worth , no spreadsheet is ever going to tell you.
If you really believe in the GSR and think you are going to move from silver to gold or vice versa via trading then try it tomorrow and sniff out whether its practical and what the hidden costs in dollars and time are now before its something you have to do in a hurry and it explodes in your face somehow
To OP: It Depends on the value you place on your time/effort and how much risk you're willing to take.
If you're wealthy, are willing to work, wait, and worry for a couple thousand extra dollars?
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
@Coinobsessed thanks for the more informational post. It sounds to me like you actually have more insight and resources than the majority of us have here.
You are probably capable of sharing exit strategies that make sense. I feel that if anything, you are second guessing yourself too much.
Selling ones collection, or investment, is an emotional situation regardless of ones history. Trust your intuition and well developed instincts.
Unless you are ill and feel it is best to liquidate your estate ahead of schedule, not trusting your heirs, remember: This is a business decision. Put your exit strategy in perspective, short term, mid term, long term ( as appropriate). Document it and follow it as a plan of action.
I just can't believe any reputable dealer would tell someone not to post much here.
Sounds paranoid, at best, by the dealer(s). At worst, sounds like they don't want information known about 'something'......
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
When logic goes out the door, it’s an indicator of… defensiveness, at least?
Come on dude, calm down. @bronco2078 had some good advice for you, whoever you are. And if it’s the newbies you’re worried about, then his advice is that much better. Anybody scrolling back through old threads thinking about stacking will be encouraged to develop/test their exit strategy as they go forward.
My exit strategy is to at some point sell. Where/how I choose to sell then will depend on the avenues available and expenses at that time. Making that decision now is a waste of time. Things change.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
you sell constantly though its not the same
but it is. I just have to make that decision on a continuous basis. Even then, things change.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
You are moving product all the time you dont need to rehearse , it will be automatic
Rehearsal would be of no good to OP. When he's ready to sell he checks for the best way, such as asking the forum for opinions. The best way a year ago is not necessarily the best way today.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
so your advice is to never practice or plan?
My advice? When you're ready to sell find the safest method that provides the most profit. OP should not be faulted for not having an exit plan. We all have an exit plan: sell for the most profit.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Totally different for you , you sell actively . you have repeat buyers . You post constantly on the bst if you needed to sell out you have customers all lined up that you have already dealt with.
you dont want the op to lay any groundwork for exiting his stack ? He should just fall asleep then wing it when its time !
It's not different for me. Selling constantly only means planning constantly. I don't have customers lined up, I have to work for them and earn their business just like any other seller.
I get it, you say he needs an "advance" plan, I say he needs a current plan. Time to stop beating this horse. It died eight posts ago.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
"Can't remember the last time I had a repeat customer"
would look great on a billboard
I thought I would give an update. The wholesale bid/ask spread has fallen in half. Therefore I have started to implement my original plan of wholesaling coins. There are ways to even narrow the spread, but as some have suggested there are issues: timing, time , expense. Thx for the advice.
Maryland just expanded their stay at home policy. Like NY, I think coin dealers here may not be able to be open here for the foreseeable future. I am sure you can identify dealers across the country that will happily bid on your holdings. You are in a better position when supply is below demand.
Wholesaler in Chicago is open. Post office also.
APMEX buys slabbed generic gold. Spreads not too bad
You're dealing with the wrong wholesalers. Try Heritage, Rarcoa, and other large players. Heritage has been routinely going out posting "buy" prices for $20's. Just yesterday they were looking for up to 50 MS65 Saints at $1965 each....that's only $100 off their sell price......a 4.8% spread. For MS64 Saints the spread would likely be a similar $100. Their sell price yesterday for 64's was $2005. Pick up the phone and call one of them. Tell them how many pieces you have. Spot free or "spotted" is critical. CAC coins bring more whether spotted or not. Once you seal a deal with one of these larger players your price is locked in as long as the coins are out within a stated period...typically 24 hrs via REG Mail or an insured FedEx account. Sometimes these guys might authorize shipping to them on their own account for a large enough deal.
I've been watching these spreads for a while now. Don't recall $200 premiums or a 10% spread. Typically, the only times spreads from "real" wholesalers like Heritage get over 4-6% is when the market crashes and they are full up with inventory. Then, you might see them up at the 7.5% range....or they just might cease buying altogether. I wouldn't even consider auctions, Ebay, or other similar venues where the consignment structure is in the 10-15% range. That's nuts for generic gold, especially slabbed gold....where 5% is typical. I've worked with some smaller PNG gold wholesalers in my region who work on 3-4%....and I can net about the same as if I shipped to a large wholesaler...and save on the aggravation. I suspect that $100 of your $200 wholesale premiums are just so that these middleman-wholesalers can ship to the big dogs and pocket $50-100/coin.