Coin Shop Experience
OkieNumismatic
Posts: 33 ✭✭✭
Today I had to go out of town for work (about 2 hours) and stopped at a coin shop after work. I found a 1881-S, 1822-S, 1883-S, 1884-S and 1885-S Morgan Silver Dollar set I thought about getting until they told me they wanted $1,300 for it. Did not think much of it other than they were hoping for an uneducated person to sell them to.
Started talking with them and told them I brought some coins with me and the first they picked up was my 1909-S VDB...one of the guys asked what VDB was and then after I told him who's initials they were, he asked what the importance of him was and what made the coin special. Even after explaining it to him, I could tell he was still not catching on which led me, a 27 year old, to spend a couple of hours teaching a 60 year old coin shop owner the importance of certain coins. It was an experience unlike any other I have had in a coin shop. I did end up purchasing a 1964 Kennedy PCGS PR64 Accented Hair from them just because I liked it and do not have a proof coin or a Kennedy in my collection. Sorry for the poor picture as I was in my vehicle.
All that said, this is why I will typically stick with purchasing from forum members, or dealers such as David Lawrence who are heavily involved in the numismatic community. I have never found a coin shop in which i liked.
Collector of Lincoln Cents (Wheat Reverse) and Winged Liberty Head Dimes (Mercury Dimes)
Comments
I find that amazing
I thought he was joking at first...
Collector of Lincoln Cents (Wheat Reverse) and Winged Liberty Head Dimes (Mercury Dimes)
I think he was quizzing you to see how much he could hose you.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
He probably does not see many 27 year olds in his shop so it would not surprise me. Unfortunately for him, I am not an uniformed buyer.
Collector of Lincoln Cents (Wheat Reverse) and Winged Liberty Head Dimes (Mercury Dimes)
The other explanation is that he was yanking your chain, to see how much you knew about your coins. B&M dealers will sometimes try to lowball a walk-in if they think that the owner doesn't know what he/she has. A decade ago, I was in a small B&M where I live and asked the owner if he would make me an offer on a few of my coins. He pulled out a Redbook that was several years old, and I was astonished. He said Redbooks were the best information available. I noticed a binder, that said 'Recent CDNs' on the spine, on a shelf behind his counter and then walked out.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
"I found a 1881-S, 1822-S, 1883-S, 1884-S and 1885-S Morgan Silver Dollar set"
So were these raw coins?
All of them were PCGS MS65 with one of them being NGC MS65.
Collector of Lincoln Cents (Wheat Reverse) and Winged Liberty Head Dimes (Mercury Dimes)
He had an 84-s in 65? at 1300 you would have stole that coin!
83 s and 85-s too,
My guess is Op got the MM wrong,
probably an 1881-s, 1882-s, 1883-o, 1884-o & 1885 either P or o
Wait you passed on an 1883-S in P65 (+ others) at $1300?? You know that coin alone is like a $4-$5K coin right?
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
My apologies! I got the dates wrong. They were:
1878-S, 1879-S, 1880-S, 1881-S and 1882-S.
Collector of Lincoln Cents (Wheat Reverse) and Winged Liberty Head Dimes (Mercury Dimes)
BIG difference.
Well that changed my comment of "Sold" to "Pass".
Excellent transaction with: ffcoins, Proofmorgan, fivecents, MorganMan94
Oh, yea!
Nobody that owns (or even works at) a coin shop is ignorant about an 09 S-VDB. This went on for a couple of hours? Really?
They were playing with you.
thats an interesting experience. if the owners are truly clueless, maybe you can make some good buys there
Live and learn.
Somehow I find it very difficult to believe a coin shop owner, irrespective of age, would not know about a 1909-S VDB cent. It's one of THE iconic US coins that even the newest coin collectors know about. I think one of your legs may now be a bit longer.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Delete.
Hmmmmmm....any 10-year old coin collector would know about the 1909-S VDB. I know I did!
Dave
Right. I had to delete my previous post. It's exasperating.
He was testing you to see how much you know about coins. You should have played along with him and told him that you had no idea what VDB meant so you could hear his low ball offer for the coin. He sounds like the typical slimy B&M coin dealer that gives the good dealers a bad name.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
If you had to explain what VDB was, I would have run outta there.
BHNC #203
Maybe the 60 year old has dementia? Its possible you know.
While it's possible it's far more likely the dealer was testing someone selling a coin so he would know if he could get away with a low ball offer and get a rip. A dealer will size up a new customer before conducting a financial transaction.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
That is a 'twilight zone' experience....leaning towards the dealer trying to pull a fast one on you....I cannot comprehend how an individual can have a coin business and not know about the '09S VDB....Wish we could send another forum member into that shop and see what happens...scam artist...Cheers, RickO
This sort of experience is why hobby novices need to quickly figure out who the 'good' dealers are. Stay away from 95% of the dealers (and at least that percentage of the available coins).
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Advanced hustle?
Feigning ignorance for hours to make a sale seems like real stupidity.
Dealing in Canadian and American coins and historical medals.
Maybe the owner was tied up in the back room and the robber was hoping to get your S-VDB.
Wow ... are you kidding me??? Some would go that far??
Coin shop experiences can vary. The main goal of shop is buying / selling bullion, buying slabbed coins right so can wholesale at shows, collection estate appraisal, and strong margin on raw collector coins, plus retail of nice material say around CPG. Whatever keeps doors open as fixed overhead high. Time is money, wasting time on non profitable customers is not.
Surely I'm not the only one who has seen a dealer amuse himself (and especially his cronies) this way. I'll bet he had a wager with himself as to how long he could get you to explain Numismatics 101. Dealers do get bored, and if there were no other customers for two hours, this one might get VERY bored.
I can guess why this dealer has so few customers.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
In this situation I would either walk out of the shop quickly or would possibly try to figure out a way to play along with the dealer and give back to him the same treatment he is giving me.
Perhaps show the dealer a very valuable coin, say it was inherited from your father in law, pretend you do not know its value, negotiate a possible sale of the coin with the dealer, haggle for an hour or more, waffle back and forth, tell him you are interested in selling at his offered price, tell him you think you should discuss the possible sale with your wife first, tell him you will call him the next day, leave the shop, call him back the next day and tell him your wife found a collector who agreed to buy the coin for full retail which is X times higher than the dealer's offer price.
Better yet, tell him another dealer offer you $10 more so you sold it to him.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Why play games with dealers? Do you play games with other business people lol? They would show somebody door trying mess w them in 10 seconda
Hell yeah he was just acting dumb to see what you knew about the 1909-S VDB and other coins that you had. Heck, my wife could care less about my coin collection, coins I buy or even talk about coins but she even knows about the 1909-S VDB Cent! He thought he seen easy money walk into his store is all he was thinking.
I'm not sure I can think of any scenario where it makes sense for a dealer to feign ignorance. Any actual collector will think they have no clue, or trying to rip them and not come back, any new collector will think they are no help and also not come back.
You did say "one of the guys" so maybe he was not the proprietor of the shop but just a hired hand and was actually learning from an educated collector.
Collector, occasional seller
When I was living in Utah years ago, I walked into a shop and wanted to buy a slabbed silver Ike in MS67. I did not own any slabbed coins at that time, but had a very good idea of the values of various types of coins then. The owner quoted me a price of $225, which was so preposterous that I reflexively laughed. "OK, OK, OK," he said. " At least let me get my money out of it. So call it $75." I paid him (since this is about what I thought it was worth then), took the coin and left. And I never went back.
Years later, I had moved to Arizona, and walked into the shop of a dealer whom I knew well. I was making room in one of my safety deposit boxes, and took that coin and a few other slabbed to coins to sell. He looked at that Ike, then at me, and said something like "what the #$%^ are you doing with this piece of %^&*?" He did buy it, and another collector no doubt later bought it. Ain't the recycling business in the world of numismatics wonderful?
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Sadly my experience with brick and mortar coin shops has largely been similar. Giant markups on cheap stuff and offers that are insulting. I bet this dealer probably was trying to lowball and when it didn’t work they couldn’t find a way to easily get out of the conversation.
TurtleCat Gold Dollars
Don't bogart that joint my friend. That story certainly changed shape during the inquiries by all. Peace Roy
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They were trying for easy money. Sound like BS artists, unethical and not good for the hobby.
The dealers I know are great guys and will cut a real deal anytime with me. God bless!
Did you bring coins with to sell? If so, the quiz could have been to see if you stole them.
Unless the seller was really seedy looking I would first assume he inherited the coins if he didn't know anything about them.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I am changing my perception of the Hobby, it is looking like one of the few endeavors where participants try to tear each other apart this badly. greed......................
Are you new to the hobby? It's always been this way. In the late 1970's, I went to a coin shop in downtown Baltimore to sell a Saint Gaudens double eagle. The dealer told me it was a fake (it wasn't) and he then proceeded to try to buy it from me for less than melt. LOL. I refused to sell it to him and told him I didn't want to stick him a fake coin. I then left and never went back. At the time, double eagles were worth a premium over melt value.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Keets,
There is an element of truth in what you wrote. Unfortunately, there is a dark undercurrent in the business end of the hobby that a number of dealers have acknowledged in discussions with me. I was told by old dealers that it was that way even when they were young, in the 1940's and 1950's.
Think about why the PNG was formed--not to protect collectors or advocate for grading standards or better coin designs. The main reason was to protect dealers from other dealers who didn't pay their bills. Why did TPGs take off? They didn't exist when I was young. Back then, altered coins were everywhere and many dealers were engaging in a game of buying at grade X (intentionally devaluing a seller's coins) and selling at grade X+1. Slabs largely put an end to this.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Once I started buying at shows never really went back to shops. Then online came....
A shop is what it is I would usually have a fav one or one where I knew the owner from shows do biz with them.
Get to know dealers at shows sample a few shops find what works for you.