What does it take for you to block a buyer?
Tetromibi
Posts: 947 ✭✭✭✭✭
I generally try to fight the urge to block buyers. I figure even if they're a bit of a pain and high-maintenance that sales are sales.
I make an exception for people that can't bother reading or looking at a listing before buying.
For example, if a bidder sends a message with 3 minutes left in an auction asking to cancel the transaction based on an issue that is clearly in the title and the description, I might not have much patience.
Sure, I can work quickly to cancel the buyer's bids. I also might work quickly and block that buyer.
How much patience do you have? What does it take for you to block a bidder? Do you give second chances, or are you quick with the ban-hammer? Go with your gut, or follow a specific set of rules when it comes to blocking?
Comments
98% of sales are seamless. Ebay is essentially a wholesale market.
The 2% that fit out of the seamless model generally get blocked. Returns particularly as two way shipping and lost 2.9 Paypal fee add up to a pretty hefty cost of doing business.
I'm quick with the ban hammer. If someone contacts me and wants to return something because I missed a spot or something, no problem. If someone claims they just changed their mind or SNAD's, then I block immediately. If they did it once, I figure, they'll do it again.
I had a guy recently who bought a $5 set of Canada stamps. It was listed under "Canada: Mint" on eBay. It was in my store under "World stamps" (U.S. stamps have their own category). The title of the listing was "Canada Scott# 268-282..." and he contacted me to complain they were Canadian stamps. He insisted on a return - at my expense - so I was out $5 in round trip shipping on a $5 set of stamps that WERE EXACTLY WHAT THE LISTING SAYS.
Sure, it was a mistake on his part. Maybe he wouldn't make the same mistake again. But, could I really take that chance? And, given the low $ amount, why didn't he just eat the $5 since I sent him what he bought and it was clearly his mistake.
Unwarranted returns when a listing has excellent pictures or 2nd thought cancellations !
I just had 1 that might be a battle with ebay. Lady buys a Set that requires priority shipping. Trying to make ebay happy I shipped it 2 hours after she bought it. 45 minutes after the Post Office received the shipment she sends a message asking to cancel the order. This is for a $40.00 item. Do the math...priority shipping both ways and non refundable paypal fees approach 1/2 the price of the sale. I'll let ya'll know if she forces a return and will be happy to PM her ebay ID if she does!
^^^ What he said. ^^^
Exactly. Not just on the Bay but in daily life... mind changers...
Also not a fan of prospective buyers whose questions hint at the idea they're considering sending the coin for grading and then offer XF/AU $ for a nice BU coin. Actually had an offer a while back from a buyer who explained that his offer was reduced to cover the cost of grading he anticipated incurring. Refreshing honesty, but no- I'm not paying to have the coin graded for you.
To compliment the points here. Most sellers feel forced by Ebay to offer Rodeo Drive type service. Generous 30 day returns and free two way shipping. Buyer takes advantage of it and the hammer falls.
What Ebay does not grasp as they maintain no inventory of their own and rely on third party sellers, is that while a high end clothing retailer may triple keystone their goods, coins and most other items sold on their site carry a very tight margin which easily evaporates from the premium level of service required.
great subject here.
about 2 weeks days ago I listed a fairly rare Canada 1870 NLCW 50 cent coin for CAN $ 1600.
On the end of the second day a bidder hit my price. 5 days to go....
good so far. he was the only bidder.
however, 4 hours before the auction ended he wanted to cancel his bid, saying he did not know that NGC had marked the coin as cleaned. The images, including the NGC slab were very sharp and clear and leave nothing to the imagination. He claimed the ,cleaned' was not in the title.
True, but it was big and easy visible in the rather detailed description!
So far I insist on payment. he has until friday to pay or I will file for an unpaid item.
I did some homework on this "fellow" and found out he is a Ontario / Canada dealer. as one source described him as a known person without a good reputation.
So far Feebay has not made any comment. It is clearly against their rules.
Blocking??? yes I did now. But jerks like him will have more than one account... and feebay tolerates that.
I rely on my fellow forumites for blocking references. I also block those that ask questions that indicate they could be an eventual problem buyer.
With this new paypal policy of not refunding fees to sellers, returns of high dollar coins come at a high cost.
ZeroHedge makes debut at White House press corps briefing
My years of experience selling on amazon. Any customer messages you before the actual purchase is more likely to be file a return.
On the dealer side we share quite a few ebay/a$$hole stories. We also share a massive blocked buyer/bidder list. Also a database of names and addresses for repeat offenders. At work we manage multiple ebay stores and receive questions weekly why they cannot buy something.
My biggest gripe is jerks who "rent" coins on ebay and shop it around for a profit. If they cant sell, they return, also trying to pin us with return shipping.
Ridiculous lowball buy offers result in an immediate cutoff.
Playing me for a chump and lying to me are high on the list. I've only issued about three well-deserved blocks over 20 years or so. Once blocked, forever blocked with me.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
Give me the slightest hint you'll be trouble and you're gone. Buyers have far too much power for me to accept questionable ones. Yes, I may lose a bid here or there, but I can lose so much more with a bad buyer getting a win. In short...
-Hassle me: blocked
-Return something with a bad reason (ie, blame me and make me pay, or say something that tells me you can't ever be satisfied): blocked
-Fail to pay: blocked
-Ask me a question that makes me look at your feedback left history and I don't like what I see: blocked
-Have a history of bid retractions: blocked
"What does it take for you to block a buyer?"
Not very much.....once blocked no second chances.
Amazon is even worse. Amazon will BLOCK THE SELLERS if they get too many returns. In the case of one friend of mine, he was blocked because his second sale resulted in a return due to damage in shipping. Amazon immediately put him on suspension because he had a limited track record.
Amazon really started the whole free shipping/free returns/concierge experience which forced every other retailer to play along. It's a fact of life but, as @Coinstartled says, margins are so low on coins that it is a problem for coins.
I'd also love to know how many buyers essentially use SNAD or free returns to speculate on PM price moves. I'm sure it's not a huge number. I'm also sure it must happen.
Another blocked story from just last week.
I sold a Pride of 2 Nations set to a UK buyer.
I ship it, mark it $99 on the customs form which is less than he paid but, I figure, approximate wholesale price.
He gets the coin and immediately emails me to complain that he had to pay 30 euros in customs charges.
I say, I'm sorry to hear that but that's between you and your homeland.
He complains that he only bought it from me because I didn't mention customs and other sellers did.
I explain that if you use eBay Global Shipping which I rarely do, eBay collects the customs duty up front. Since I was shipping 1st class, eBay doesn't bother so you have to pay it at your post office.
This goes back and forth for a while. I tell him to just return it if he's unhappy. At these point, I've already blocked him.
He says he likes the coin and returning it won't get his customs duty back. He just resents the unexpected $30 charge. Basically he wants some kind of accommodation.
I point out that he had to know there was a duty because of the other sellers. It wasn't logical for him to think that I had a magic duty-free way to ship to him. He also could have refused the duty and it would have been returned.
He tells me he's blocking me as a seller.
I am more than fine with that. LOL.
It is these stories....so many over the years... that make me extremely happy I do not sell coins...
Cheers, RickO
In order to prevent problems, I have blocked all eBay buyers ... my sales are lower than expected.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
The thing to remember is they are 1 out of 1000 (or less). 99.9% of buyers ask their questions, make their purchases and go on happily with their lives. That's why it is so easy for me to just block that fraction of a percent of people who just aren't worth the trouble. It is the same in all facets of life.
I have asked a very small number of sellers to block me so I don't accidentally bid on one of their items. It's been done after an excessively poor interaction where the seller either lied (or lied through omission) or tried a 'bait and switch.' Over the 22 years and many thousands of transactions on eBay, the 'bad ones' are fortunately quite rare.
Edited to add ... only one of the 'blocked sellers' was selling something numismatic
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Extortion attempts after delivery. Irks me to no end.
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
@jmlanzaf said,
eBay does not have that option, unfortunately. If it did I would use it to make sure I did not interact with a dishonest seller. Many people here have had dealings with a seller that was less than honest on a listing,
As a seller I always did my best to give as much information as possible on the condition of the item for sale. In over 2000 sales on eBay I can only remember two returns, both of those were big ticket items that I believe we're buyers regret, that's going to happen.
I was also surprised when I learned that a seller can't give a negative or a neutral to a buyer for any reason now, with that being the case why have a feedback section at all for buyers. I managed to make it for the past 18 years and never had a negative or a neutral so I must have done something right.
At one time there was a thread here that had an extensive list of blocked buyers that sellers would use and contribute to, seems like it was ten years ago so I doubt it would be useful today.
Time for a new list.
Fighting the Fight for 11 Years with the big "C" - Never Ever Give Up!
Member PCGS Open Forum board 2002 - 2006 (closed end of 2006) Current board since 2006 Successful trades with many members, over the past two decades, never a bad deal.
I think his blocking of me was more metaphorical than literal.
That's about the same rate as my returns. I get about 5 per year on about 4000 sales per year. Only once was it a "big ticket item" (about $800). The most annoying thing about the returns I do get is that they are almost always $10 coins where the round-trip postage isn't worth the value of the item.
Despite what our Startled Coin friend might say, there really are very few problems on eBay.
You might consider the method you use to screen sellers. I've never had one not show up in 20 years much less 30%. But I spend more time screening the sellers than the price
Drama, of any kind.
One strike. And I'm the ump.
Non payment with lack of communication.
Someone asked why sellers weren't allowed to give buyers negative feedback. This was allowed at one time however the bad sellers would withhold feedback until they got feedback from the sellers. If a seller gave them a well deserved negative they would then give the buyer what was called a "retaliatory neg". It got to the point where the feedback system became totally worthless. Buyers were afraid to give any feedback other than a positive out of fear of getting a retaliatory neg. One thing eBay can do to eliminate this problem is to hide the feedback from both the buyer and seller for a one week period after the sale. After this one week period, feedback could no longer be given and the feedback would then be revealed. This way both the seller and the buyer can leave negs without fear of retaliation.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
The feedback system wasn't broken. Buyers could always check out the feedback left by a seller. It was easy enough to avoid the ones who gave out retaliatory negs if that's the sort of thing you were afraid of.
Please correct me if I am wrong or understood ebays auction conditions not correctly.
Is it possible to start a civil action against a buyer if all feebay rules have been followed, but a buyer still does not comply and... Ebay rules on the buyers side? like a buyer does not pay or tries "extortion".
Probing high bids by placing "test bids" and then retracting them will get you blocked and reported if it has any effect on final sale price.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Unt> @YQQ said:
I totally don't agree. I ask questions before buying all the time. Then I buy it and I never return things unless it is an obvious misrepresentation; which I never had to do.
I really respect merchants who based on their experience state up front if they believe the coin has been cleaned. That BS about “if you chose to send it to a TPG..blah blah” is just that. I only deal with coin dealers who are straight up front...ie. “Hey mike I am giving you a good price on this b/c in my learned opinion I think this has been cleaned and would not pass muster at pcgs.”
Have I purchased even after that...key dates...yep.
100% positive transactions with SurfinxHI, bigole, 1madman, collectorcoins, proofmorgan, Luke Marshall, silver pop, golden egg, point five zero,coin22lover, alohagary, blaircountycoin,joebb21
You are correct, at least in Arizona. The Arizona courts have taken ebay breach of contract cases and ruled in favor of the person harmed.
https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/phoenix/2018/03/08/court-ruling-julie-rohr-must-pay-canceled-ebay-sale-10-carat-diamond-ring/408047002/
Ebay itself does not allow extortion. They will remove any feedback connected to an extortion attempt and suspend the buyer.
Ebay does not compel payment and the fact is that even a win in court will have a difficult time in collecting a debt across state or international lines.
Smoetimes fast shipping isn't always a good thing.
You will note that the poster did not say that a customer who messages you will be a problem or file a return. He simply stated that any customer that messages before the purchase is more likely to file a return. Which, in aggregate, matches my experience.
Personally, I find the type of question matter greatly. Most of what I sell is electronics and basic, fact based questions such as asking for a hardware revision number, or discounted shipping for multiple units, don't really raise any flags for me. Questions about the condition of the packaging, or asking about its suitability for a particular task, do raise flags that they are potentially picky and/or uncertain that this is the item they want. I don't believe I've ever blocked someone for asking questions, but I have used it as a basis for refusing to negotiate. If I think someone might be a pain to deal with, I'm not going to give them as good of a price.
I do the same, I ask questions before I buy.
At the risk of fury, not all the sellers are 'all that and a bag of chips'
Some are quite the ' toolbag', ya feel me?
POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
20+ years on ebay, 5000+ positives, no negatives (right now)
1) Making a really stupid low bid offer
2) Making a low or really iffy offer, and has a pattern of leaving negative feedback. Last person only left negative feedback, so why get stabbed.
3) Asking me to be dishonest
4) Asking a LOT and LOT and LOT of really off the mark questions (I know it is not going to end well for me)
5) Asking if I will ship a prepaid return label before they will buy the item.
6) Buying and not paying and no communication.
7) Trusted friends stating to RUN FOREST RUN from a certain buyer.
I've BEEN blocked for asking details about coins not in the post. I guess just simply checking for a mint mark is too much for some of yall.
lol
Minor Variety Trade dollar's with chop marks set:
More Than It's Chopped Up To Be
LOL. Depends on how you do it. I don't mind a reasonable question, but sometimes someone who asks spurious questions ALL IN CAPITAL LETTERS...sometimes you just have a feeling.
IS THAT AN S MINTMARK ?!?!?!?!
Minor Variety Trade dollar's with chop marks set:
More Than It's Chopped Up To Be
That's what I was thinking.
"Could you let me know if the mintmark on the coin is X or Y? Thanks!" gets you an answer, "I don't know why people list coins without complete information. What's the mintmark?" gets you blocked.
I'm always polite when communicating with dealers. Sometimes they have bad days. It happens. They just lost out on a non-return sale. I've never returned a single coin.
Minor Variety Trade dollar's with chop marks set:
More Than It's Chopped Up To Be
BLOCKED!
Hey, I'm not defending everyone. Lots of amateurs out there who don't understand business. You see it on this forum all the time. Just mention "cost of doing business" and watch some people yell about how "unfair" it is. And there are a lot of part-time dealers who are crusty and really don't care if they sell anything.
I didn't mean to say you're not, it was just a hypothetical example.
Buyers can pick who they buy from, sellers have much less choice in the matter. And with eBay's policies putting sellers at even more of a disadvantage, some will be willing to forfeit a potential sale just to be on the safe side.
I think you are in the minority.
I am amazed at the rude and semi-illiterate questions/comments/offers I receive.
Example: a day after paying, buyer sends message:
"wheres my coin"
lol
Or a buyer asking for multiple pictures/angles etc. of a $20 coin.
Or the best one ever:
I wish I would have saved the exact remarks.
Guy buys a slabbed toned RB Lincoln.
Cracks coin out of the slab, rubs ketchup all over the coin, says the toning is now gone and therefore I faked the toning and I am a crook.
Only on eBay folks.
Somewhat off topic, but in all the years I've been on eBay, I've never made a sale to someone for whom I have gone to the trouble of taking multiple additional pictures. I won't do it anymore, I just apologize and tell them that the picture in the listing is the best I can do.