Newps that I dig from the early 1820's but still looking for info on them.
Realone
Posts: 18,519 ✭✭✭✭✭
The current info on these are sketchy, and any info on them is speculative and from sources that cannot be verified. But I believe someday more will be known about them. At this point they do appear to have been minted in the early 1800's due to the eagle's design. And there are similarities to a noted die sinker but it has not been proven to a shadow of a doubt as of yet. I am attempting to research these and see what develops.
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Comments
I have no problem with it being attributed to the 1820’s, but how do you prove it?
Each of those are really cool looking. Thanks for sharing.
Unless it can be positively identified and attributed to a specific individual or firm I really don't find it to be very interesting. The 1820's attribution may be correct but that alone does not spark much interest.
What does the notation on the slab, "R-E-NY-405", mean? Seems like a reference number from some published work, or catalog number(?)
Anything from Ford is just a turn off.
Ford had an AMAZING collection of exonumia, much of which came from Wayte Raymond and FCC Boyd estate.
I'm sure your comment was meant to allude to the fakes that he allegedly produced, but it came off in a strange way.
Many tokens and medals that are in the highest form of preservation came directly from the John J Ford Collection.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Yes, let’s ignore the fact that he was a major fraud because he had a nice exonumia collection.
I agree with @DCW . I too have several, if not a dozen from Ford. There have been
several collector/dealers with a less than stellar past. The coin, token, medal, what have you,
stands for itself.
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
I like that first one... and it well could be a 'business card' from a well known merchant. Nice design, but quietly understated identification....befitting one of stature. Cheers, RickO
And who is that?
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
What does the man's personality or ethics have to do with the caliber of his collection?
Should everything that he owned be put in the bargain bin, just because he was a mean person? He was a major dealer for decades, and by proxy had access to the very finest collections to add to his own.
You really think everything from Ford is a "turn off?"
Were you around for the mega sales of his estate?
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
I never said the coins weren't nice. Not at all, some are fantastic. You put words in my mouth (bargain bin!?)
But it's hard for me to ignore the damage he did to numismatics, which can be measured in volumes. Whenever I pick up a book that he "advised" on, I know that I can't necessarily trust anything in the book. It's sad really. Others were more directly impacted, losing big money on the fakes he was peddling. He used his position of authority to his advantage, fueled by greed.
If you can ignore all of that, great for you. But yes, it's all a turn off to me.
Nobody put words in your mouth, OD. @Realone posted a token that he was excited about from the John J Ford Collection and you curtly said the above quote. We are merely pointing out that it was a poor choice of words. Because ethics aside, his tokens were far and away the best of the best.
Personally, that's where it ends for me...the tokens sort of speak for themselves. Who cares if he was a greedy bastard? So was Redfield. Are his silver dollars less collectable?
I wouldn't want him to be my father in law, but I actively seek specimens from his collection
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Yeah, I hear ya DCW. Sorry if it was taken the wrong way. Someone here likes to play the victim and spins everything as a personal attack. I was lamenting and agree with you that the coins are nice. It sucks they are associated with him. I'll still go further than you, he wasn't just greedy, he was methodically deceiving and took advantage of many innocent people. Put yourselves in the shoes of the authors he advised, sneaking lies into their books to legitimize his fakes. That's just nasty for our hobby.
Ok, carry on the discussion about these neat coins. Don't mind me.
@Realone have you looked up New York merchants that advertised using the JE initials?
Not to be off topic
but in regard to the token in the first post. that eagle's head reminds me of the Feuchtwanger tokens, but that was probably a common portrayal.
It’s also interesting that the NGC Census only has 1 specimen in VG. The census doesn’t go as far back as the slabbing so I wonder how many of these have been slabbed.
I have personal reasons to hate John J. Pittman's guts, but I always enjoyed seeing his non-competitive exhibits at the ANA conventions. One had TWO 1877 Half Union patterns in copper (or bronze; whatever) so that you could see both sides, along with some other killer patterns. A different year he had several complete proof sets from the 1840's, including gold, in their original cases!