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Anything wrong with this slabbed buffalo nickel ??
BUFFNIXX
Posts: 2,701 ✭✭✭✭✭
Take a good look at this slabbed 1916 DoubleD die buffalo nickel, do you see anything wrong here??
Collector of Buffalo Nickels and other 20th century United States Coinage
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
1
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Acid treated, a condition just a little more serious than a cleaning.
@koynekwest....What are the indications of acid treatment that are visible on this coin? Cheers, RickO
Other than the overall appearance the date is much sharper than would be the case on a coin graded fine. Just the overall "look" of the coin gives it away immediately.
Rims or absence of, mushy appearance. Why would someone do this to the entire coin though?
The PUP (Pick up points) on a genuine 1916 DDO Buff are more than just the date. Actually, the coin could be authenticated dateless, and worn almost flat.
Someone just wanted the date to show.
Pete
Easy. Think about it. Would you rather have a coin with uniform color and surface OR one with a uniform color and surface EXCEPT for a big blob area of a different color that sticks out from ten feet away?
I should have pointed out that Koynequest showed this picture to me and at first it did not hit me as acid treated.
but upon a second look it sure jumped out as acid etched (or wretched as some call them.) A cleaned fine should be worth around $4000 but this should be worth less than a grand with the complete acid batch to give it details grade of fine, which really should be at least very fine -- see the full horn. Someone may take a “bath" on this coin next time sold if they do not recognize what has been done to the coin. Remember that this coin probably had no trace of the date prior to its being
treated.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
It's the baking soda and brillo pad that bugs me more than the acid. But that's just me.
it seems like it was left in the cleaner for to long to me. hmmm
how did they miss the restored date?
BHNC #203
Details holder. Deal killer for me.
An offbeat, but nonetheless very good example of ‘buy the coin, not the holder ‘.
Yes indeed!
Obvious acid date. I've got some really good looking acid date Buffs but the date area only was treated, not the whole coin. Treating a whole coin with Ferric Chloride and then cleaning it is doing it all wrong. Gotta wonder how this one got by NGC.
A possibility exists, however, that the original coin as graded by NGC was switched.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein
Pretty decent full date though.
WELL WELL GUESS WHAT, IT WENT FOR A FEW CENTS OVER $2,161.
OVER TWO GRAND FOR AN ACID WRETCHED 16 DOUBLE DIE!
So this just has to be a record take for an acid dated 16 doubled die.
You have to thank the grading service for this biggie bonus to the seller.
Wonder if the winning (b)idiot will pick this up when (s)he gets the coin in hand.
Still puzzles me how this so-called batch of experts missed it.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
I don't think the guarantee applies either which means this really is a burial.
What makes us so sure the experts 'missed it'?
Perhaps the finalizer thought the cleaning was the worse problem.
Would all the PUPs be obvious without the acid treatment?
If they would not be visible then perhaps it was seen as a necessary evil.
I have been told that TPDs will usually only list the problem they consider the worst on the label
Agree. The cleaning looks extremely harsh and it's that coin's biggest problem. Since the 1916/16 is a DDO, there's doubling elsewhere on this coin that identifies it even without the date. The most prominent is doubling of the small feather which is visible on even low grade dateless examples.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
The issue with "Details" graded coins at all grading services, is that they typically only put one designation as to why it graded with details. Sometimes you see two designations.
They usually go by the worst designation if it meets two or more. So, if it's cleaned and has graffiti, the label would say "Graffiti" without referencing the cleaning.
For NGC coins, I'm not sure I've seen "Acid Treated" on their details coins - I don't think it's a term they use. Has anyone seen any?
Owner/Founder GreatCollections
GreatCollections Coin Auctions - Certified Coin Auctions Every Week - Rare Coins & Coin Values
NGC body bags acid treated coins. Obviously, NGC screwed-up on this coin as it has clearly been acid treated.
This coin should have been call acid created by the graders as the fact that it was cleaned is irrelevant.
They just missed it by a mile. And every time it changes hands and the new owner misses the error it will cost him.
Wonder if some one tried to get their money back from ngc if they would stand a chance.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
No.
"The grade guarantee does not apply to NGC Details-graded Coins, which are guaranteed to be genuine only."
https://www.ngccoin.com/coin-grading/ngc-guarantee/
I disagree. Movement or loss of metal beats cleaning every time in my book.
News flash: This **this so-called batch of experts ** who work at TPGS rarely miss problems. UNFORTUNATELY, IMHO, they are weenies when it comes to actually stating the degree of the problem EXCEPT when it comes to whizzing. That's possibly because of "the-bottom-line" and destroying any remaining value the coin may have.
Usually they put "cleaned" on virtually any coin with an altered surface from obvious continuous hairlines all the way up to polished! In this case acid etched = "cleaned." I believe in educating the collector so they learn the difference but when I put "buffed" or "polished" in my screen for the "details" adjective, 95% of the time the coin is labeled as "cleaned."
You guys are going to need to educate yourself. BTW, "harshly cleaned" is the most over-used description that does not apply most of the time when used by the batch of Ex-Pert collectors!
cleaned is cleaned no matter what, you gonna lose big with a coin like this one.
I think you need to read my post above before you post any more uninformed nonsense as this!!
Polishing, acid etching, etc is NOT CLEANING! Nevertheless, your point is valid.
Cleaned coins go down in value.
Acid treatment is much more serious than a cleaning. Acid treated 16/16 coins usually go for around a grand. The TPG really messed up on this one but if you're gonna throw a couple grand at a coin like this you should know what an acid treated coin looks like and bid accordingly.
Agreed on acid treated. Looks like the dateless Buff's I soaked in vinegar for 2 weeks. Has that overall grainy look on obverse/reverse. Appears that someone had tried to tone this example in order to enhance appeal, or, fool graders. Probably the later....
@lonn47
LOL my friend because this is really hilarious and I had a good laugh too. Hopefully, you learned something in the thread.
thank you and yes i did learn something today.
$8,500. for a problem free fine.
2K for this one doesn't seem too terrible.
peacockcoins
The acid treatment greatly reduces it's value. There really isn't fine details-the coin was dateless and almost totally lacking any real detail. $1000 would have been a good result for the consignor; $2000+ is way out of line.