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Beware, seller’s pics - Do you agree that this double eagle deserves a green bean?
KollectorKing
Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
2
KollectorKing
Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
KollectorKing
Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
KollectorKing
Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭✭✭
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No. It might technically rate a 61. But that coin has been beaten with an ugly stick.
I’m not a CAC guy, but that’s flat fugly, IMO.
Dave
I suspect the terrible pictures have something to do with it. Under normal light, I bet it looks a lot better.
Looks like a 61 to me, forget about silly stickers. Congrats!
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
Your pictures are not helping the coin.
Seller’s pics
It’s a 61, of course it’s ugly...
CN eBay
All of my collection is in a safe deposit box!
61 with lousy eye appeal. Hopefully it's the photography.
No. It does not look like an "A" or "B" MS61 coin, and the eye appeal is lacking.
I think you should call host to see about the black.is it sever rub with contamination or just service organic material. See if they can restore without losing anything. It looks graded apparently. Sometimes ugly grows on you but don’t wait.
Best place to buy !
Bronze Associate member
Maybe. Remember, not all coin sellers are gifted with photography and even those that are, and that only show a single image, can't mimic inspecting a coin in-hand. Regardless, that looks like a scan and, if so, scans are notorious for giving extremely unflattering coin images.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
I wish we could move past beating up coins’ reputations for the grade based upon images
It’s a 61 with bad photos. How good could it look?
Yup, it's a 61. It is what it is !!!
That IS what the sticker means...
This.
Coins’ reputations for the grade are both beaten up unfairly and praised undeservedly, here, based upon images. It’s inevitable and far more interesting than not assessing the coins at all.
I do wish, however, that coins which are currently up for sale, would be excluded from such exercises.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Horrible images. Might it be frosty with rubs as the dark areas?
Another example of a CAC blessed coin that's nothing special. I'd buy it but it's not worth the CAC tax or premium that most sellers would want for it.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Looks like a bad photo...TrueViews are a game changer.
My Saint Set
But I have seen WORSE 61s. So, for people who understand what CAC means, the CAC just affirms that it is a solid 61.
Not to turn this into a CAC thread, but I had a dealer buy a Wisconsin PCGS 67 CAC commem from me. I sold it at Greysheet CAC bid, by the way. He returned it because "he thought it would look better". LOL
Now, I know exactly what the now-blocked buyer meant. He assumed it would upgrade to a 68 and was taking a shot at doubling his money with a 68. I think that is part of the urban legend around CAC that a CACed coin should upgrade or has a high probability of an upgrade. In fact, a green bean suggests the opposite: high end FOR THE GRADE IT IS IN,
So, I half agree with you. In this case, the CAC is accurate for what it is, BUT people way overinterpret the meaning of the bean and, as a result, the premium for CAC coins is high.
Might look better if you have the seller fax you a photo of the scan?
I agree that CAC saw the coin as solid for the grade....and they had the slab in hand. I do not agree that viewing these images on the forum allow us to pass judgement on their decision....Just my opinion on the opinions judging the CAC opinion....
Cheers, RickO
Ahh but the coin was recently sold by the firm you work for, for $8280, the lowest recent sp in-spite of the green bean.
Sorry for not having been clear. I wasn't assuming that the coin in question was currently up for sale. My wishing that coins currently up for sale would be excluded from such exercises, was a general comment.
Why not post those pictures?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
One can easily access & view the pics of the other coins via CoinFacts & they’re head & shoulder better looking than the subject cac coin. Hence, they realized higher prices ie the market has spoken.
Guess what? The guy at CAC might be human.
And just like the grading services, the standard may change over enough time.
I'm confused, You wrote "Ahh but the coin was recently sold by the firm you work for, for $8280."
However, the one which sold for $8,280 by the the firm I work for does not appear to be the same coin you posted. It was not a CAC example, has a different cert number and looks entirely different.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
No - Somebody wasted their money. What an ugly low end dog, definitely a C coin.
I wonder how many replies this thread would have generated if the coin didn't have a CAC sticker and the thread title was simply "Do you agree that this double eagle deserves the assigned grade?"
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I too am confused now. The coin I posted was from CoinFacts and it was the one that sold for $8280. I doubled checked it prior to posting the CoinFacts prices.
Here is what I found on CoinFacts for the one which brought $8,280 https://www.pcgs.com/auctionprices/item/1875-cc-20/8974/628440700126706517
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
These can get really beat up. Clearly uncirculated. I see other coins that the bean makes me shake my head more than this.
Just checked myself. Definitely not the same coin. The $8280 coin has a provenance, no cac sticker, and doesn’t look at all the same.
CN eBay
All of my collection is in a safe deposit box!
This particular coin sold twice in 2017. Once for $11,400 and once for $13,200.
CN eBay
All of my collection is in a safe deposit box!
Here are additional photos of the coin which is the subject of this thread. My guess is that they are considerably more true to life than the ones which were posted initially.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
From ha archive
If you compare the $8280 coin (MS61 no CAC) to the one in this thread, the CAC coin is nicer.
It's a 61...I'm not sure how much nicer you expect it to be.
https://www.pcgs.com/cert/84660112
You seem to do plenty of research but don't bother to bring up the cert page for the coin in question(unless I missed it..). Two previous sales, both over $10k. If you look at those past auction pictures it appears that the coin has very nice surfaces(skin) between the unfortunate multitude of hits. The $8280 coin above does not even compare.
Coin in question:
$8280 coin:
Collector, occasional seller
Oh right, the question... Yes I think it deserves the bean, but I also don't collect these.
Collector, occasional seller
My thought initially was bad pictures. Mark Feld's post confirmed it. The second set of pictures looks a lot nicer and I agree with the grade and bean.
My YouTube Channel
No $20 gold coins are ugly, they are all beautiful works of art. I think it is a great looking coin for a 61. Couldn't care less about the CAC sticker. CAC is on a lot of ugly coins, so who cares?
Everybody knows some coins from technical view may be accurately graded but due to eye appeal issues (ugly toning) will not be easy to sell on the bourse if at all whether sticker or not. If CAC wants put sticker on ugly coin that is their choice but that will not change the above fact.
Coin #0112 is an ugly coin and I would spend the money on something else.
not for me ( I don't collect them either )
Not even going there but pics don't tell the whole story I bet.
Ditto
Your hobby is supposed to be your therapy, not the reason you need it.
POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
A $20 Lib is a large gold coin. At the MS-61 level, one should expect a lot of hits/chatter. If it's a no-question original coin, with original skin, it's no surprise that CAC approved it.
MS61 in gold doesn’t automatically mean ugly. In this case, though, the foot fits the shoe.