How would you define “thumbing”?

MrEureka

And to play it safe, I mean with respect to coins and coin doctoring.

topstuf

Not as oily as nosing.

Broadstruck

Smudging a coin with finger oils.

shorecoll

Agree with broadstruck. They also used to mention using grease off your nose...yuck!

MrEureka

@Broadstruck said:
Smudging a coin with finger oils.

Would it still be considered thumbing if smudged with inorganic materials like PVC or whatever?

Broadstruck

@MrEureka said:

@Broadstruck said:
Smudging a coin with finger oils.

Would it still be considered thumbing if smudged with inorganic materials like PVC or whatever?

No has to be body oils.

Broadstruck

@shorecoll said:
Agree with broadstruck. They also used to mention using grease off your nose...yuck!

I've seen forehead grease used too at a show which covered the whole coin instantly better than thumbing or nose grease.

topstuf

Jeweluster or Clearasil then?

Baley

@Broadstruck said:

@MrEureka said:

@Broadstruck said:
Smudging a coin with finger oils.

Would it still be considered thumbing if smudged with inorganic materials like PVC or whatever?

No has to be body oils.

What about if they only use their index finger? Or just their pinky toe? Still "thumbing?"

Broadstruck

@Baley said:

@Broadstruck said:

@MrEureka said:

@Broadstruck said:
Smudging a coin with finger oils.

Would it still be considered thumbing if smudged with inorganic materials like PVC or whatever?

No has to be body oils.

What about if they only use their index finger? Or just their pinky toe? Still "thumbing?"

Let us say that Thumbing is just the use of a thumb...

Before Thumbing goes from Toes to someone smuggling a coin in a sweaty butt crack!

Baley

LoL, point is, not to get too caught up in the semantics and lose sight of the concepts.

I'd say thumbing is altering surfaces by application of a hazy substance to help cover flaws.

Usually body oil by fingers, but i think any foreign substances deliberately applied by any means would generally qualify.

MrEureka

Has anyone here ever had coins rejected for thumbing, or do the coins just get graded at a reasonable level, all things considered? It seems to me that a thumbed coin would have to look pretty ridiculous before it should be no-graded, presumably as “altered surfaces”. But at this point in time, I honestly don’t know what the TPGs are doing with these coins. (I don’t thumb coins, so all I know is what I see in the marketplace. And what I see is lots of thumbed coins in holders, but they almost all look ok.)

CaptHenway

I would expand the definition to include repeated rubbing of a coin or other metal object with a thumb or any other finger often enough to cause light wear that removes, diminishes or otherwise obscures hairline scratches or other evidence of improper cleaning. The use of nose oil is optional, though usually beneficial late in the process.

Broadstruck

On copper that's a bit dry looking Thumbing can rejuvenate surfaces giving it a second life.

That being said I bet there's a lot of coins that have been thumbed that are slabbed.

MrEureka

@Baley said:
LoL, point is, not to get too caught up in the semantics and lose sight of the concepts.

I'd say thumbing is altering surfaces by application of a hazy substance to help cover flaws.

Usually body oil by fingers, but i think any foreign substances deliberately applied by any means would generally qualify.

If body oil and applied by hand, the effect is no different than some completely innocent and minor mishandling. Hard to no-grade a coin for that. Once you bring inorganic materials into the mix, it’s a different story.

Baley

Well, considering they're money, all circulated coins will have been incidentally 'thumbed' many many times in the course of circulation.

Again, i think of the numismatic term applying to high grade coins with localized, deliberate smudging to improve the appearance and receive a higher grade and/or price.

Baley

The classic example is the cheek of a Morgan dollar

Insider2

@Broadstruck said: "Smudging a coin with finger oils."

This is the standard definition for as far back when it was first observed. I became aware of it in the early 1970's.
Oils from any part of the body have been used ( I say any part because coins have been passed around the grading room that smelled like a butt!) It is a surface alteration done in an attempt to hide marks on a coin's surface - often the open parts. While graders were not there when it was done, an experienced numismatist can determine when there is a difference between any other substance besides skin oil is used. Thumbing is a surface alteration. Applying any other substance is also.

@Baley said: "LoL, point is, not to get too caught up in the semantics and lose sight of the concepts."

Words mean something. "Thumbing" is different from the other surface alterations. However, "altered surface" covers all of them.

TwoSides2aCoin

Applying nose grease by way of the thumb. Fingering, on the other hand, involves boogers.

johnny9434

I agree with broad struck

grip

@Broadstruck said:
On copper that's a bit dry looking Thumbing can rejuvenate surfaces giving it a second life.

That being said I bet there's a lot of coins that have been thumbed that are slabbed.

This.

Paradisefound

Paradisefound

Artificially modify the otherwise natural toning process ?

ricko

I have 'thumbed' old wheaties in order to read the date...I have never added nose oil...Nose oil is good to bring out the grain on old briar pipes (the smoking kind)...and give them a 'lustrous' look. Cheers, RickO

Insider2

@Paradisefound said: "Artificially modify the otherwise natural toning process?"

Not really as it has nothing to do with toning. The main reason it is done is to improve the eye appeal of a coin.

One good example above. Take a circulated copper coin with a dull surface and apply skin oil with a finger and then lightly brush it with a jeweler's brush and the coin will usually look more attractive. Large Cent dealers know all the tricks.

logger7

Considering that most coins have spent their lives in collections under plastic after possibly being dipped it is not hard to see why graders may see many of them as "cleaned" with their acute eyesight. I have seen several dealers speak favorably of the sunny windowsill method to get the tiniest layer of skin; oils however I would think would be obvious to the services.

Catbert

Does "nose oil" equal snot?

grip

Kind of like waxing your car and not compounding it.?

mustangmanbob

Considering I like to play with automotive race engines, I doubt my hands will ever come completely clean, so any coin I "thumb" will have petroleum based grease and other non "Natural body" substances.