Coincidence leads to discovering an altered VF 1950-D Nickel.
keets
Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
Last week my boss had some stuff waiting for me when i showed up for work on Thursday, some Cent and Nickel folders to take apart and some other left-overs from a collection he had bought. Among the folders were three Whitman Jefferson Nickel sets from 1938-1961 and the coins were all circs. I separated the Silvers and the dates like the 1939-D, 1950-D and the better Varieties to check when i had time.
Fast forward a few days and by coincidence a guy comes in and buys some silver, then asks if we have a circ 1950-D that would complete a set he's been doing from change. I grabbed the bowl with the unchecked coins and got him one of the 1950-D's and off he went, happy as a clam. About an hour later he called to tell me the coin was actually a 1958-D with the bottom loop filed away!!
I got to work this morning and he' swapped out the coin. Looking at it with a loupe I can see where it had been filed. Who would do that?? Why would someone do that??? Who would think to even look for it on a low grade coin???
Just when I think I've seen it all...........................
Al H.
Comments
Just my opinion but one never knows what to expect in our little hobby.
Practice coin?
someone who wants to turn a 5 cent coin into a $5 coin?
Now that is a weird one...The album collector could not find one in the wild, so made one...Not much else makes sense....Cheers, RickO
Nothing surprises me in the realm of collectibles.
Money wise it does not make sense, so someone was practicing with their new dremel?
Go figure. There's no end to what people will do to a coin. Peace Roy
BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall, coinsarefun, MichaelDixon, NickPatton, ProfLiz, Twobitcollector,Jesbroken oih82w8, DCW
Please post a photograph of the coin.
The Mysterious Egyptian Magic Coin
Coins in Movies
Coins on Television
Someone back in the day probably made 50 cents doing that. It was a low mintage and most were hoarded as the word was out. So, finding one in circulation back in the day was a chore. Make your own and sell it and profit a big mac or such.
bob
Perhaps it was the very early beginning of a hobo nickel creator ?
Probably not
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
I would suggest that you edit the title of the threat from "counterfeit" to "altered."
FWIW, I have never seen a 1950-D nickel that I thought was counterfeit, though I have seen pieces struck from a very worn pair of dies that some people thought were counterfeit.
I have seen one or two pieces that were altered from 1958-D coins as you say this was. That said, how come neither of you looked at the coin at the time of the sale?
TD
how come neither of you looked at the coin at the time of the sale
it was in a bowl with a few other 1950-D's and about 6-7 other Nickels, a quick glance to verify the date/mm. because...................noone monkeys with VF 1950-D's.
I've got one of these altered nickels. I'm reluctant to post this as you'll want to see images and it will take hours to find the coin and photograph it! It is not very deceptive because the "0" is too small so I don't even use it for class.
I would like to request a photo of the ENTIRE coin, please?
(just joking, im not one of those peoples)
Minor Variety Trade dollar's with chop marks set:
More Than It's Chopped Up To Be
From what I understand, the 50-D was at one time kind of expensive. Perhaps it's an old alteration? I'd love to see a picture of it!
My YouTube Channel
Better go check the one I found in change back in the 90's.
This one I could do as the coin is small enough. I'm going to try to find it but after seeing it, you'll be very disappointed as it should no fool ANY numismatist here.
Such an easy fake to spot! Like the removed and modified 4 in a 1944 cent! Sad the collector had to return and waist his time on an easy to see mistake!
I agree with you, but we're talkin' hoarded UNC coins that were the Bees Knees back then.
It would have taken at least a few years for that coin to wear down, so someone altered it for their circulated collection because they could,t find it in the wild.
Just guessing.
Pete
asheland, I'd post a picture of the coin but if it isn't a VF Insider will want to criticize me for not being a Numismatist. better safe than sorry.
Interesting. Never would have thought the '50-D would have attempted to be altered. Yet, as @asheland had asked, I wonder too- is it an old alteration? Thanks.
Earlier, perhaps the 80's, I remember this coin being worth quite a premium due to the low mintage. Then, correct me if wrong, something like a massive hoard was found, which reduced the coin's value considerably. Take a comparison of the 49S Jeff price compared to the 50D which has 1/4 the mintage. Just my thoughts.
Jim
Edited to add. In 1966 the 50D was worth 10 times the 49S, according to Red Book.
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
Keets, check your messages.
Please post the darn image and save me from looking for mine!
Here is one from a 1959 I found on the internet.
Tom, what am I looking for?
1959! Not a 1958!
(Maybe, not sure.)
Yeah, that is what I have seen. Not from 1958.
More of the behavior expected from a pawn shop, not a coin shop!
In 1963 a VF '50-D nickel was worth about $300 in today's money. It was very easy to sell and many of the buyers were highly unsophisticated.
1959-D nickels were very commonly altered into the '50-D. In those days a large percentage of the '50-D's in circulated condition were altered from other dates.
It's interesting how such common knowledge among shop owners back in the day has faded to obliviation with today's crop of shop owners!
I agree, for every bottom feeder there is an under the bottom feeder, and a subterranean under bottom feeder, and......
When I was a very young collector, I saved 2 weeks wages from delivering papers and bought a BU 1950-D.
When I got home, I examined my prize carefully and noticed that the mintmark looked "off."
I picked at it with my pinkie-nail and it popped right off.
I don't recall what a BU 1950 cost way back then, but I do remember that my 50 "D" cost the huge sum of $15.
So, the financial incentive was definitely there.
Someone who got fed up with not being able to find it in change
More of the behavior expected from a pawn shop, not a coin shop
OK, this thread and some of the replies have really gotten under my skin. the one above is sort of insulting. I don't know the member who made it or anything about them, but they have posted nothing at any time to show me they know anything. it's very confusing to me why that member would even make a reply like that.
you guys really need to take a step back and stop over-analyzing everything. this was a VF coin that isn't typically resold, it's popped out of the album and stuck in a tube, we probably have hundreds of them, they get saved for what they are but almost never resold because there just isn't a demand for worn Jefferson Nickels. the coin was in a plastic bowl with several other coins and I glanced down to pick out the 1950 instead of the 1939 or the 1942 or the 1946. satisfied, I put it in a flip, gave it to the collector and everyone was happy.
when I looked at it days later, sure, I used a loupe and saw the alteration. given the circumstances, there was never a reason to look at a VF coin, though this thread has taught me that evidently you guys always look at every coin in that manner.
Are you sure it's not a '50D small 'o'......?
Oh man! That's a terrible story. That's enough to break some young kids heart.
The evil still morphs into other schemes today.
Pete
Calm down. We need you here.
Pete
@keets
It is no big deal. No one is attacking you! If you would have bothered to even look at the coin first you would have caught it. My post about being crude and not fooling a numismatist was written to convey this to members here before I found an image.
The alteration I have was made from a 1958-D and the "0" left from the top part of the "8" is even smaller!
whatever, I'll strive to be more attentive and you can strive to be more tactful. maybe we'll get along better, there's always hope but it isn't really necessary.
So it was me! I looked back in the thread and saw nothing. As for being more tactful, I'm afraid it is not in my nature as we probably were raised in different generations. If the shoe don't fit (it didn't) ...get over it.
I thought it was a funny story- Thanks for sharing it.
I wouldn't have taken a loupe to a vf nickel either unless looking for some variety.
Collector, occasional seller
As for being more tactful, I'm afraid it is not in my nature as we probably were raised in different generations
same generation but one of us is a Democrat.
thank you, Chris, that is how it was intended and i enjoyed the irony of the coincidence. another recent thing --- we have a guy who comes in regularly and buys ASE's and out-of-the-ordinary Silver rounds, so we save that stuff for him. among the things he likes are the Eagles in Littleton plastic. when he was in Thursday and asked about them i told him we had none and we laughed about how those things stopped "coming around" to us. he left and said he'd be in Florida for the next three months.
i don't think he was gone five minutes and I bought one. then today another "walked in" so I've started him a pile.
Some of the SE sold by that company have been MS-70's! You would think that they would check them. Guess they are too busy.
Back in another Galaxy and time, I stopped in to the local B&M coin shop after work to get a coffee and banter around a bit.
The employee (a friend of mine) was busy putting together a used set of Lincoln Cents for a customer. He had a few 2x2's of each date and was picking the best one to balance the set.
He just started and was on 1911-S.
I picked up the coins he was going to look at and one of the 11-S Cents looked strange.
Just getting off work, and not having my loupe handy, I went to the microscope that the shop had to look at it closer.
It turned out to be an old alteration done to a 1944-S! And it was a good one.
There was absolutely no evidence of tooling, the fields around the date were clear, and no evidence of the 2 fours in the date visible! Just 2 normal looking ones were present.
Further examination showed the gap left between the 19 and 44 left after the alteration. The "S" was wrong, and the shoulder had the V.D.B. there. BINGO! the V.D.B. at the shoulder is not supposed to be there on any Cent before 1918.
I showed it to the owner, he laughed and threw it back at me. "You keep it", he said.
These things have been going on for years immesurable. To put that much time and effort into altering a coin with no big return has perplexed me to this day.
Pete
I have an old envelope with a bunch of circulated 1950-D's
It has date of 6/22/61 and purchase price $3 apiece
none of them are altered dates
If you can make it profitable, there is someone out there that is willing to try it or that has already done it (and there probably are some videos of it on Youtube or similar site somewhere).
No one said the op was being lazy or nonchalant with his dealings. When a customer comes into a shop though and purchases a specific item and it ends up being a poorly carved altered coin then maybe some of the blame does lie with the shop. Can't always blame the customer.