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PCGS Europe Grading vs. U.S. location submissions
atom
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With European grading generally considered more conservative than in the U.S. (Extremely Fine in Europe can be AU/UNC in the U.S.) how have PCGS Europe graders dealt with the discrepancy?
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Well, they grade based on PCGS standards. When an European dealer tells you extremely fine you can mentally translate to US grade. When PCGS tells you 62, it means 62 whenever that was graded. And if you sell your coins in Europe, the dealer can mentally translate the 62 to extra fine or whatever they use in the country you try to do it (as it is different in different countries). But PCGS and NGC for that matters use the Sheldon scale for the grading.
Cheers!
Subjectivity will never exit the process by which coins are graded. Standards are a nice reference, but coins at various grades are just not created equal-That is how it is regardless who grades the coin.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Help me understand... How does the Third Party Grading add value when Europe & US have traditionally maintained different grading systems. Based on your remarks, it seems to me that their assigned grades may not be universally accepted.
Dealers are not stupid. I've been told that the differences in grading standards between the US and Europe have narrowed over the decades. More importantly, what dealers call a coin is not the bottom line. What they price it is!
Atom... did you just ignore my post??
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
Absolutely not! It prompted me to seek clarification on the value of TP Grading...
Of course grades are subjective as you noted, and when different standards are in use across the globe, the grade becomes even less meaningful. Thus my question above.
@atom I am sorry, perhaps did not explain myself. This is just like when you translate lb to kg. It is just a different scale, but the dealers in Europe know "the translation" if you will. 3 lb are 1.36 kg, and while the scale is different, they are the same.
Your analogy doesn't play out when the terminology of grade is the same. In your example, lb. and kg. clearly implies different systems (in the case of weight). However, "EF" used by Europeans and "EF" used by Americans look the same, therefore the PCGS/NGC grade of EF is supposed to be understood as American EF not European EF, which is at variance with a non-slabbed EF coin. This is why I believe it's confusing to the novice!
EDIT: Double post
I 'd like clarification of this WITH RAW COINS NOT SLABBED from both European dealers and American dealers who travel to Europe please and thank you.
I am not a dealer, but can attest to the fact that "EF" raw coins purchased from Europe will grade as "AU-UNC" here in the U.S. (raw or slabbed)
I have had coins graded both in the US and in Europe and do not think there is much discrepancy in the grading standards both places. You however do not get the True View like pictures for world coins and only get slab shots in Europe. I have occasionally found the European coins to be graded loosely but that's about it. I would rather buy US graded coins with nicer pictures.
Is it economical to send the coins to Europe for grading compared to the cost in US?
And I agree the TrueView is an advantage
If I remember right, the US is much cheaper. I only did send out those coins for grading in Europe since they were already there and there is a quick turnaround during the Paris grading week. I have never mailed them out from the US to Europe expecting higher grades. I don't think the grading standards differ and whatever over-graded coins I received were an anomaly.
@atom said: "However, "EF" used by Europeans and "EF" used by Americans look the same, "
Then @atom posted: "I am not a dealer, but can attest to the fact that "EF" raw coins purchased from Europe will grade as "AU-UNC" here in the U.S. (raw or slabbed)
So the terminology used does not matter because the coins LOOK identical although given a different grade. I think that's what was already posted at the beginning.
This still does not compute: "However, "EF" used by Europeans and "EF" used by Americans look the same, An American EF is a long way down the condition scale. EF in Europe is just below FDC!
To clarify: EF as a labeled grade on the European slab looks the same as an EF on the American slab, not talking about the coin.
Perhaps that's because the same company's standards are being followed???
Same company standards and in fact same graders flying over to Paris for grading weeks or in other cases the coins were simply sent from Paris to Newport Beach, at least this is how submissions in the early days in between the Express on-site grading weeks were handled.
The economic benefits are there in select situations. High value crossovers are one such example where there is no 1% premium on value in Europe where there is in the US. Downside of sending coins to Paris from the US is customs. I have had and am dealing with an instance now where PCGS Paris mismarked the customs form which means that the State of Michigan is trying to tax me for archaeological items being imported in.
In general terms I have enjoyed great success with crossovers in Paris, but I lived in Europe so hand delivering them to a show or to the offices in Paris was convenient, more so than sending them to the US.
Latin American Collection