@Crypto said:
The Continental dollars is a very good comparison BTW. I would note one difference that we basically know the CSA cents were made by a token/medal maker in the north for a coin dealer who sold them all to profit where we know very little about the CDs. The Continental dollars were probably made in Europe as a commemorative. Which is basically the same, something made completely away from where it purports to be made for intentions to sell the people for nostalgia.
You're right about less information being available on the CDs. Regarding the cents, I'm not sure about Captain John White Haseltine, but I think some people like the connection to Robert Lovett.
I think we agree on most of the info we just view the correlation and relevance a bit different. My biggest grip is with the auction houses and dealers who walk the thin line between propagating the BS and educating the consumers although I agree with you the responsibility ultimately lies with the consumer even if many are idiots
The biggest gripe could probably be with the Red Book as that seems to drive a lot of the industry. They can start by not using the term "restrike" for pieces like the Fugios by Horatio Nelson Rust.
As for Carr, you would be surprised the fickle memory of society though time. Who was the biggest pop star in 1911? Who came in 4th and failed to make the Olympics in fencing at the 1975 qualifiers in Spain ? Your great great great grandfather’s middle name? Being able to dig it up gets harder as society cares less. Once his site goes dark and we are all worm food and the hobby takes a dive due to Digital everything, who knows what info they hold on too. Many movies made by Hollywood have no known copies left, only random posters and there are still people alive who saw those movies in the theaters. Many of those posters will disappear too one day.
I think coin collectors are are much more focused on history than some others. I've been pretty satisfied by how much we know about many coins and tokens. Just look at what we now know about people when record keeping was much less than it is now.
Captain John White Haseltine
Robert Lovett Jr.
Horatio Nelson Rust
John Adams Bolen
George Thomas Morgan
Even the bonafide counterfeits by the following are now well known:
@gabisdaddi said:
I took it to Stacks & Bowers (among other things). My 029 block is a known variety, not a fake or counterfeit.
I hate to be a party pooper, but I doubt Stacks would verify that yours is genuine.
Because it is not.
No Aug Frank hallmark
No bulge from the 'no-collar' strike.
Incorrect number die stamp font and placement.
All genuine bars have a concave depression around the coin strikes, and a partial impression of the edge of the die around the obverse of the coin strike.
But is a replica of a replica of a replica of something that probably never existed anyway, which itself is interesting.
@gabisdaddi said:
I took it to Stacks & Bowers (among other things). My 029 block is a known variety, not a fake or counterfeit.
I hate to be a party pooper, but I doubt Stacks would verify that yours is genuine.
Because it is not.
No Aug Frank hallmark
No bulge from the 'no-collar' strike.
Incorrect number die stamp font and placement.
All genuine bars have a concave depression around the coin strikes, and a partial impression of the edge of the die around the obverse of the coin strike.
But is a replica of a replica of a replica of something that probably never existed anyway, which itself is interesting.
First I just thought you were being a party pooper, but I looked again and your observations are compelling. Plus, look closely at the portrait - that one lacks detail and appears flat.
@fathom said:
Copies of copies of coins minted for people who wanted souvenirs of racist secessionist territories dedicated to protecting the institution of slavery a decade after the war.
What could be more inappropriate in this day and age.
Comments
You're right about less information being available on the CDs. Regarding the cents, I'm not sure about Captain John White Haseltine, but I think some people like the connection to Robert Lovett.
The biggest gripe could probably be with the Red Book as that seems to drive a lot of the industry. They can start by not using the term "restrike" for pieces like the Fugios by Horatio Nelson Rust.
I think coin collectors are are much more focused on history than some others. I've been pretty satisfied by how much we know about many coins and tokens. Just look at what we now know about people when record keeping was much less than it is now.
Even the bonafide counterfeits by the following are now well known:
I took it to Stacks & Bowers (among other things). My 029 block is a known variety, not a fake or counterfeit.
Great to know! It's a very interesting piece. with the serial number, there may be more of this variety.
Is yours the same dimensions as mentioned in the Lovett Cent book by Harold Levi and George Corell? It mentions:
I hate to be a party pooper, but I doubt Stacks would verify that yours is genuine.
Because it is not.
No Aug Frank hallmark
No bulge from the 'no-collar' strike.
Incorrect number die stamp font and placement.
All genuine bars have a concave depression around the coin strikes, and a partial impression of the edge of the die around the obverse of the coin strike.
But is a replica of a replica of a replica of something that probably never existed anyway, which itself is interesting.
First I just thought you were being a party pooper, but I looked again and your observations are compelling. Plus, look closely at the portrait - that one lacks detail and appears flat.
Well, I guess we'll just see when it makes it into their auction in the fall.
Alas, I don't have it anymore, S&B has it.
Fixed it for you
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set