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Pwcc Vault
addicted2ebay
Posts: 2,092 ✭✭✭✭
It’s like a Fort Knox for Cards!
I gotta say I’m impressed!
You can buy a card from them and tell them to just toss it in the vault.... then sell it a few years down the road I guess? Lol
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It is nice to see new and fresh ideas coming to the card industry. I read about all the old time dealers at the National stuck in the past and it is nice to see entrepreneurs attempting to revolutionize the industry.
For the investor types this looks like a brilliant idea. For collectors like me no interest as I like to be able to see and handle my cards.
It starts to seem a little odd when the existence of a physical asset seems almost unnecessary to the process.
I couldn't agree more.
If someone is playing the hot rookies or current stars and wants to play the sell when hot game this is a home run. Quick Brent flip the switch and get that card listed.
When you realize you had such a good year that you are going to get hammered in taxes so let’s just blow some of it.
....and for the very first time, access to line-of-credit capital using trading cards as collateral.
What could possibly go wrong!?!?!
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
I haven't seen the information on advance rates but as long as they are not 75% like securities can be I don't see this being a big problem.
I don't have a ton of actively traded cards but for those that are it sounds like a really cool concept. Take a 1986 Fleer Michael Jordan. Let's say VCP is $3,000 for a PSA 9. I realize it might be higher just using for argument sake. They could easily advance $1,200 on this card with very little risk to both parties.
Ignoring all the potential pitfalls and scams both sides could engage in, I'll just point out that 99% of people buying cards in this price range wouldn't be in need of a line or credit from "PWCC Capital".
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
Jimmy I have no clue where you came up with the 99% number from. That is a strong assumption on your part. There are collectors who own $3,000 cards that may not be in a position at all times to buy other $3,000 cards with cash but would have no trouble doing so with credit either through their bank(s) or other sources. You could be a collector who doesn't want to pour fresh cash into your collection and still want to purchase additional cards and this it appears would allow for it. It also could be used by speculators who want to trade around the card market without selling their core holdings. Ideally it would be more for short term funding issues but who knows. I could see collectors that own larger dollar cards liking the idea and especially if they are doing a lot of buying and selling through PWCC. This is just another value add that they are offering to try and gain greater market share. Brent is no dummy so rest assured he has thought through the potential pros and cons.
This is a tilt-up concrete building and very non-discrete. I'm sure in Oregon it's pretty inexpensive. I'm doubting a bunch of millennial's want to work in a concrete building with no windows and roll up doors. This looks more like a storage facility.
The money will be in the HVAC, dehumidify controls, back up power, fire rated walls/perimeter, security, IT infrastructure. And if they want to sell safe storage of cards; an FM-200/Halon fire control system instead of water (fire sprinklers). Who wants fire sprinklers over their cards; show of hands?
My guess is PWCC will do it right, as they have always done with their business. It's time to put the AH's out of their misery and bring sports collectibles into the financial markets.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
Brent is no dummy so rest assured he has thought through the potential pros and cons.
>
Yeh, he knows that would lead to price inflation which in turn results in higher auction prices which results in higher sales commissions.
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
I feel like I am sitting next to Cliff at Cheers with the description of the security details, fire system...
KC
@Jimmy_Commonpants
There are two ways for Brent to increase revenue from EBAY. More listings and higher realized prices. I find it very hard to believe that offering credit on cards is going to significantly increase card prices. Do realize many of the same people probably are already using credit just through a different source. Offering more services where collectors view PWCC as their go to seller for both buying and selling has a much greater chance of increasing their market share and hence is a much bigger potential driver of revenue. Price inflation in cards was already tried once and probably many times in reality and it fell flat on its face. There are simply far too many cards to manipulate the market over a longer period of time because eventually you run out of money to support the prices and the supply keeps coming and down they fall. PWCC will have to approach this like any company offering credit against valuables or securities. The advance rate will need to vary based on the liquidity of the card and how recent the sales data is. There is no doubt in my mind that the various advance rate scenarios have been given thought and the notion that this will lead to collectors getting themselves into money trouble in mass seems incredibly far fetched. This to me sounds more like a cash flow assistance tool with many indicating that it can take a decent amount of time to get paid from the various auction houses and how nice would it be to be able to pull the trigger on something based on your collection until you wait to get paid. It also would allow for someone who is trying to flip cards for profit to use margin and play with more funds and while this part could in theory lead to price inflation it won't as the cards will eventually come back for sale. What really leads to price inflation in cards is when someone successfully hoards them and that is an entirely different situation all together. Jimmy I am waiting for one positive comment out of you as it pertains to graded cards. I have a feeling it is never coming.
I feel like I am sitting next to Cliff at Cheers with the description of the security details, fire system...
KC
I stand guilty of mansplaining and being a wise-ass. Didn't mean it to sound so tutorial.
IMO, if you are the owner of a large six-figure collection and live in a fire or flood-prone area, the PWCC vault might be a good option. More than likely, you can't duplicate the Vault's infrastructure in your house. This is already done for expensive wines, and some of this cardboard blows that stuff away.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
Big investment for sure and I am confident that PWCC did their homework. Good luck.
this
Looks like a great place to have a "friend" stash your collection if an unforeseen divorce arises. Or to ride out a zombie apocalypse
Kevin
.
Kevin
You know I was just busting chops and you had some great insights above - almost too detailed. My concern is having a facility like that and advertising it unwittingly making them a target. If people are told you are storing $80 million in cards there that could unintentionally invite th wrong type of characters imo,
KC
Have you and your son busted any more boxes recently?
Didn't PWCC publish some data showing that the top 100 baseball cards earn more value than the S&P 500 over the same time period? Maybe they are hoping to tap into that?
All good Keith. I deserved it. We've ripped a few Prizm boxes but nothing of note. I hope to have my recap soon.
Collecting Unopened from '72-'83; mostly BBCE certified boxes/cases/racks.
Prefer to buy in bulk.
Bing-o was his name-o
I saw on Forbes that Jenny has the first storage slot with pwcc.
I think this will be beneficial for some people. Insurance on a collection can be challenging and or not available for those in more rural areas where fire departments are not in close proximity. I have had to move my entire collection into bank storage.
I like that Brent is an innovator and forward thinker who wants to grow the hobby versus remain status quo.
Interesting idea, just remember with all the companies that handled silver and gold bullion and kept it on hand so you didn't have to take possession that if things go wrong you are gonna be SOL.
I don't use bank safety deposit boxes because I don't trust them(worked 10+ years for Bank of America/NationsBank and have my reasons).
I wouldn't use this for the same reason(s).
Care to elaborate a bit a I also have the cards in s safe deposit box...
The Doomsday Collection
Dallas Cowboys Ring of Honor | All-Time Dallas Cowboys | Bob Lilly Master | Pro Football HOF Dallas Cowboys
No good, too many people know the combination....schnapps.
eBay Store
Greg Maddux #1 Master SetGreg Maddux #2 Basic Set
Curious about this as well, because I was thinking of putting a few cards in a safe deposit box. Wondering if I should hold off.
buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball
Unless I lived local would never consider this. If I cannot see my cards what is the point to having them? Guess for some they are an asset - for me they are a hobby. I look at mine all the time and the best part to me about mail day is it gives me an excuse to pull some boxes out and see my cards!! I considered a safety deposit box but opted for insurance on my collection. To me worth the additional cost to see my cards at will. I am not sure what the limit on insurance would be but I am nowhere near that amount.
Good lord, I'm a low-roller and I have had a fire proof safe for 25 years. There are plenty of safes for your home that anybody buying high-end cards should easily be able to afford. Gun safe anyone? I assumed most people here used something in their home.
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
For the bank, all of the above. And then some. The final 5 years I worked as a regional bank examiner for B of A after the switch from NationsBank. In those 5 years I had 12 cases in which bank employees, everybody from teller to branch manager, were investigated and charged with safety deposit box theft concerning sports cards, autographs and collectible coins. Is 12 high or low for five years (02-07), who knows. It was not the norm. I would not trust anything valuable left in a bank safety deposit box. Camera's, added security , anything else a bank may offer does not override the strong possibility of rogue employees. Couldn't trust PWCC for the same reason. Top level, everyone is likely going to be honest. The worker bees however, it's a risk.
Wow, never knew theft/expected theft to be caused by bank employees, especially the branch manager. Thank you for sharing this valuable info.
buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball
(sorry duplicate post
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buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball
(sorry duplicate post
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buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball
PSA did this for years. Ended in '09. They'd lend you an amount equal to half SMR at a relatively low interest rate.
Always looking for Topps Salesman Samples, pre '51 unopened packs, E90-2, E91a, N690 Kalamazoo Bats, and T204 Square Frame Ramly's
I have a deposit box myself but it can only be opened with my key and the banks key simultaneously.
How could a employee get into it without my key?
You are freaking me out a little bit.
Recent thread on coin side.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1002775/safe-deposit-boxes-not-so-safe
If you have a collection of significant value it's wise to have it insured no matter where you're storing it. The cost will vary a lot based on how your collection is stored. It can be very expensive if you're storing at home with virtually no security precaution, like in a big cheap gun safe you picked up at Walmart on sale. It can be very inexpensive if you store it in a bank safe deposit box. If your cards are insured and you're considering any sort of third party storage then it would be wise to check with your insurer to ensure you'll be covered for whatever wacky situation you're considering.
OMG, that is funny!
Some people don't have simple lives and for them the PWCC vault makes a lot of sense. For example my buddy Cannon is a professional photographer and just accepted a 2 year assignment in China. He can now buy and sell via PWCC very easily from China.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
So are there different types of bank boxes? Mine requires a key from the bank and a different key from me, they are not the type of keys you take in and have duplicated at the local hardware store?
I once had a bank box with docs inside that I lost the key to. The bank had no way of opening it without my key so I had to authorize and pay for having a bank locksmith come in and drill out the lock.
I work for a bank in Florida. They do not have copies of the key and routinely safety deposit boxes are drilled to open because of lost keys or a death proven by death certificate and court papers.
One more note while I am thinking of it. When the locksmith came in to drill out the lock for opening (as mentioned above) it was all scheduled and I was physically in the room while he was doing it along with a bank representative.
To access my safe deposit box I must:
When someone is in the room with the box, you can't enter as the door will not open from the outside (bank staff may have an override for door).
The Doomsday Collection
Dallas Cowboys Ring of Honor | All-Time Dallas Cowboys | Bob Lilly Master | Pro Football HOF Dallas Cowboys
The idea of a vault being a target is an interesting one.
They can have layers of security where one could never get any cards before the world swoops down on them?
I wonder if your local bank - based on a letter from PSA of value - would take your "gems" as collateral?
More pics would be nice Tyler.
Some judge is gonna say
I'm putting you away
For four score years and seven
In the meantime
Eee-o-Eleven
Eeo-o-Eleven
Off the top of my head, I’d say you’re looking at a Boesky, a Jim Brown, a Miss Daisy, two Jethros, and a Leon Spinks. Not to mention the biggest Ella Fitzgerald ever.
Reminds me of the show OZark on NEtflix
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_from_Panama
I like the vault for two reasons: 1) no sales tax on purchases and 2) no more paying for added insurance to store at home.
What I don't get is we are collectors by nature. What good is collecting if you don't have access to the collection?
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.