For the six CU forum members that still sell stuff on Ebay...
Coinstartled
Posts: 10,135 ✭✭✭✭✭
Beware!!
"""As a reminder, starting October 1, 2018, if you have very high rates of "item not as described" returns you may be subject to additional 4% final value fee in affected categories based on the Service Metrics policy. Maximum fee caps do not apply to the additional 4% final value fees. See our selling fees article for more information on how final value fees are calculated."""
0
Comments
Ebay giveth and ebay taketh.
Cue eBay cheerleaders in 3... 2... 1...
There are only (6) members here that sell on eBay?
Plus the 138 that will be flipping their Big Mac tokens.
No worries as my items are perfectly described with excellent photography.
Ebay giveth? Not.
Best, SH
So 10% plus 4% is 14% plus 3% Paypal's way. plus $3-$10 shipping plus $28 for a store (which brings the 14% down to 10.15%.
Think I will call Ian.
FIFY - eBay taketh, and taketh, and taketh. . .
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
I have sold on eBay since 1998 never had any complaint like that.
I doubt there are only six people here who sell on eBay.
Having set up at several shows in the past year online has hurt shows. A parade of people who are broke or don’t want pay anything. But I get some really good buys at shows.
I am a buyer on eBay.
I am a buyer for online dealers.
All from the cool comfort of my leather furniture.
No planes, no trains, no automobiles, no hotels and no Big Macs.
Yikes !!!
Easy solution. Just describe the coin properly.
They giveth me higher hoops to jump through. Sometimes they make me feel like those nuns who used a yardstick on me in elementary school, back in the day. I know most of society is too young to remember strict rules. Does anyone remember Sister Mary Yardstick, or was I the only bad boy in the parochial system ?
Anyway, as an analogy goes ... How would the NBA players feel if we raised the hoops two feet higher just for the spectator's entertainment ?
Why should any honest eBay seller be aware? Only the ones who wish to deceive buyers with phony or overblown descriptions, along with out of focus pictures, should be aware. I have no objection to that rule.
You surely don't believe that every SNAD case has merit, do you?
For me it was the ruler on the knuckles that we had to administer ourselves
got a return for air bubbles in EU set packaging, that's the way the mint set them to me and all the coins were perfect
Can we have a definition of "very high rates of 'item not as described?'" I think this gives buyers leverage to extort sellers: "I overpaid because I engaged in a drunk bidding war. Give me $XYZ refund even if not deserved and allow me to keep the coin or I'll SNAD you and screw you over."
Buyers remorse is a very common thing. I have not had a return in ages. I believe good photos are a must. I have to wonder what they mean by “very high rates of return.”
I ship the exact item pictured - many sellers don’t and may even dump low end material on buyers. Sort of like the old mail order days where they would try stick u with a cleaned AU described as premium quality BU. I am sure those sellers hated it when the TPG’s came out.
Fake news. I do 3500 sales per year on Ebay. I get about 5 returns.
You can hate Ebay all you want, but if you have a 25 dollar widget, it's going to cost you closer to 50% to sell it through Ian.
I personally encourage all of you Ebay fee haters to stop using Ebay. Less competition and more eyeballs for me.
Funny conclusion from your own math. Ian will cost you more than 10 15% on almost everything.
When Ebay doesn't punish bad sellers, the Board members complain. When Ebay does punish bad sellers, the Board members complain.
I wonder why it's not enough for them to just not use Ebay.
Ebay for top rated sellers with a store is around 11% with paypal and shipping; less for the high volume sellers.
The snow will eventually melt...the crap...???
We should all pity the poor Mint. Imagine how many returns they get for air bubbles, fake grease spots, the imaginary nicks on the edges, and the occasional microscopic carbon spot.
By the way, the eBay standard for "excessive" is relative to peers. So, you would only be subject to penalty if your return rate was higher than OTHER COIN DEALERS. In other words, you suck!
[kidding] So the issue really is one of rooting out people who are underperforming relative to peers. Aren't those the people you, as a buyer, want penalized? [Bad photos, bait and switch coins, etc.]
I have stopped using eBay for sales. I'm glad that for you and a handful of others here, eBay has been nothing but sunshine and roses and that you haven't run into any troublesome buyers. They exist. I'm all for punishing someone that does something wrong, but the system is stacked against legitimate sellers. There are buyers that will abuse the system. As for the fee structure, it also depends on the price level. On a sub-$100 coin, a few percent is a trivial number.
As for your other comments, you are right that eBay is the only realistic venue to sell the super cheap stuff, but I don't bother with that as I suspect that many with similar views do not either. My experience is that below $150, the buyers are almost NEVER worth the effort. The cheaper the coin, the more unreasonable and irrational they become.
oh, I've run into some troublesome buyers. But the troublemakers remain a small percentage of the total.
As I've said on other threads, there is no single venue that is ideal for EVERYTHING. There are some things that are better on eBay. There are some things that are better at Stack's or Legends. There are some things that are better at Heritage. And, yes, there are some things that are better at GC.
I do not want people embracing any of those venues or rejecting them on my say-so, or anyone else's. It just bothers me when people make blanket statements, especially when those statements are rooted in falsehoods or bias. eBay fees are cheaper for EVERYTHING relative to Heritage or Stacks. eBay fees are cheaper than GC for everything under $1000. eBay fees are cheaper than Amazon on EVERYTHING. And eBay fees are definitely cheaper than a B&M operation - although you have to factor in buying opportunities there also.
In the last 6 weeks, I've sold two slabbed commems on eBay (about $250 each) for a NET $90-$100 more than I paid for them. One of them I bought on GC. One of them I bought on Heritage. Now, I would NOT conclude that eBay trumps Heritage or GC. But facts are stubborn things and someone achieved less than maximum return on those sites even without adjusting for the net they received after fees.
And, the fact is, dealers buy a lot of junk because collectors have a lot of junk. What do you do with boxes of 63/64 Morgans? What do you do with a bunch of $5 to $20 raw coins? If you don't have a B&M, you can wholesale them or you can retail them on eBay or at coin shows. You cannot send them to Heritage or GC and get anything more than sub-wholesale net on them.
So, some things go on eBay. Some things go on Heritage/Stacks. Some things go on GC. Some things go out to wholesalers.
The BST is great but for the widgets I offer eBay totally rocks.
I'm probably, what, #3?
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso
Maybe not in the eyes of the seller, but 99.9% in the eyes of the buyer. If the seller offers a 30 day no question return policy on coins as suggested by eBay, the chances of a SNAD are minimal and can be easily corrected.
I know the feeling, out of 25 originally purchased, I returned 11 back to the Mint for excessive & unattractive " air bubbles," knowing that J6Pack collector not only looks at the coins, but also the packaging.
Count me in as one of the 'cheerleaders'.
Been on Ebay since 1998 and it's still a great place to buy and sell.
I can't count all the $20 coins I've purchased and had graded and sold for $100 to $300 dollars.
and......I still enjoy and profit by selling on Ebay.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Been a eBay seller (and occasional buyer) since November of 1997. I can count the number of returns on one hand and three or four of them were bogus and over 10 years ago. Where else can a seller get world-wide 24/7 exposure for 13% or less?
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
And no running the gauntlet of thieves and burglars who hangabout coin shows to watch the crowd members...
Any one who falls in the below category, has no business selling coins on eBay and I'm all for it.
"Starting October 1, 2018, if you have **very high rates **of "item not as described" returns you may be subject to additional 4% final value fee in affected categories based on the Service Metrics policy. Maximum fee caps do not apply to the additional 4% final value fees."
Although, I'm not sure what "very high rates" mean.
First off, Opa, honest sellers occasionally get hit with item not as described complaints from rogue bidders that want to send a legitimate item back without paying postage. I have on an 89-CC Morgan that the buyer tried reselling at a profit and upon failing, used the not as described excuse.
Secondly Ebay does not (as least that I could see) define the excessive threshold that would trigger the confiscatory penalty.
Not a very bright response. If a third of sellers have no not described complaints in a year, a third have 1 and a third have 2 or more, should that last third be hit with a 4% penalty as they have had a couple of petulant buyers?
I recall Airplanenut losing his top seller rating (and discount) a few years ago because a couple fools nicked his reasonable and transparent shipping fees. There is absolutely no better respected seller than Jeremy, yet he was seen in the eyes of Ebay as les than top tier.
Interesting, perhaps good philosophy
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
Fake news. They never said 1/3. You made that up to go with your Ebay paranoia. There are 3 categories. That does not mean 1/3 in each.
Please avoid ad hominems
To my knowledge that have never specified the requirements (beyond the 4% fee). That is odd as when Ebay decides to jack fees to their non preferred sellers, they are pretty specific.
Quite a draconian penalty for an incidence or two that may well not be due to dealer non compliance. If you have additional specifics, please share them.
It's the same 4% penalty for being below standard on the shipping metrics. The reason there is no stated number yet is because itis relative to peer sellers, not all sellers which means it isn't the same for everyone.
If they handle it like the other metrics, they will add it to your status page a month before it goes into effect and probably institute a 3 month grace period.
I applaud this effort to simply improve the bottom of the seller pile.
If people don't like the terms of use, simply go elsewhere
Just saw this for the coin book sellers.
"""Starting September 15, 2018, the final value fees for Books, and DVDs & Movies categories will increase from 9.15% to 12% for Store subscribers and from 10% to 12% for non-Store sellers."
I suspect that none of these smiling folks sell Redbooks.
I agree with your statement "honest sellers occasionally." They will not be affected by this change. I can't understand however, why you support the minority that have a tendency to mislead or misrepresent what is being sold.
This thread continues to convince me of what I already know, never sell on ebay again. I will buy there, but when margins are 15%, ebay will find ways to take it all. For most coins I used to sell there, that is what is was. Back then, ebay took half of my profit and I took the other half. Those days are far gone. Yikes.
Best, SH
I'm not positive, but I think that 'Redbooks' fall into the 'Coins' 'Publications and Supplies' catagory. Avoiding the fee increase.
Where do you sell now?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
If you think ebay charges too much, open a B&M and see what your overhead is.
I still sell on ebay but the $700 ebay/PP fees on a recent $16k coin certainly got my attention!
+1
Yes, the model is almost the opposite of a B&M. In a B&M, the vast majority of your costs are fixed, so incremental sales add revenue but costs. On eBay (or other internet venues), the vast majority of the costs are variable, so incremental sales add revenue AND costs.