Heritage Auction 27187 held April 29th 2018
bidask
Posts: 14,017 ✭✭✭✭✭
These coins may all be pedigreed to John J Pittman:
Some proof and anecdotal evidence:
The Collection of an Engineer - A Reference Collection of Cap And Rays 8 Reales Monthly World and Ancient Coin Auction #271817
Session 1 (Lots 37001-37746) - 0:00 AM Dallas, TX time, Sunday, April 29, 2018.
https://www.sixbid.com/browse.html?auction=4740
Here is some numismatic history from an old thread:
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/789354/old-thread-numismatic-history-john-jay-pittman
Note:
John J Pittman was a chemical engineer for Kodak for many years.....hence perhaps the lots in the auction were originally from him as engineer.
I suspect a collector from Mexico bought these coins from the 1999 Pittman auction held August 6-8.
According to Chris B. at Heritage this collection came from Mexico and were submitted to NGC raw in preparation for their
April 29th 2018 auction.
In 1971 Pittman was president of the ANA and at the same time served as president of the Mexican Numismatic Association.
I posted these coins from that auction: Scroll to bottom........
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/11984732#Comment_11984732
Every coin I received had a green sticker 'W/PEDIGREE' on the reverse of the NGC slab. But only a few named Pittman
So I still need to verify if the coins I won were from the catalog from the auction August 6 -8 1999.....John J Pittman Collection.
ANYONE have catalog III of that auction from 1999 ?
Thanks in advance.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Comments
Interesting theory. I won 4 coins from the auction. Yes, every coin had a green sticker "w/ Pedigree" Wish this had been in the description or something. Did receive the flips connected to the coins. One references a Ponterio auction from August 25, 1993. Two of the others include a person name. The fourth is fairly non descript.
It wasn't Pittman's collection, but had a good amount of Pittman, JB Parker and Norweb.
How do you know it had Parker and Noreb?
Thank you .
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
I still have the Pittman catalogs, but unfortunately, they are currently in storage. But from memory, I don't recall many 8Rs in that auction. Many Pittman Mexican coins were sold separately from the big auction. I have suspected it was only the "bigger" coins in the auction.
For example, I have a silver 1/4R pedigreed to Pittman on the PCGS slab. But it was not in the 1999 auction. I never found out how it got sold.
And I want to dispel the urban legend that Pittman was ever president of the Mexican Numismatic Society. He was not. (And there is no such thing as the Mexican Numismatic Association.)
@bidask , I have the enormous Pittman III catalog, August '99 (David Akers, cataloger). I checked and there were many lots of Peruvian 8 reales (and a few 4 reales), and yes, there was a nice run of Mexican 8 reales as well as escudos/pesos etc. If you give me a few of the dates you won, I'll see what I can find in the Pittman catalog. Obviously pictures and descriptions would help. It's a slow day today ... And I've already run 3+ miles. Lots 2964-3121 are all 8 reales coins, some of them multicoin lots.
PS For what it's worth, there is an inset on one page with some 8 reales. " ... He was a long-time Governor of the American Numismatic Association and served as its President. He also served as President of the Canadian Numismatic Association and honorary President of the Mexican Numismatic Society." Don't shoot the messenger, I don't have a dog in this hunt at all (and could really care less).
The most valuable of the Pittman 8 reales in the catalog was lot 3111, an 1861 Potosí RO "Ch AU" that brought $25,300 "finest of approximately six known specimens."
Kind regards,
George
Oh @bidask I see your link above. Let me see if I can find anything that seems to match.
Kind regards,
George
@bidask So. Your 1880CN JD in MS64 NGC was of course part of the Pittman Collection, part of a lot of three. I know I'm not telling you anything you don't already know. The other two coins were 1878CN CG, described as "Unc, nearly Choice" and an 1878CN JD, "Unc." Your coin is flatteringly described as "Cn 1880 JD, DP-Cn39 (Dunigan-Parker), Choice Uncirculated, a gorgeous original coin with a sharp strike, outstanding luster and superb, natural medium toning." The three-piece lot brought $460.
The trouble with your other coins you won is that the examples of those that were in the Pittman catalog are unplated, so it's virtually impossible with much-different grading standards today (and possible "treatments" and retoning etc.) to say conclusively that "this was a Pittman coin." Only the rarer coins are plated (meaning no disrespect), and many lots have no photos at all, whether single- or multicoin. For example, there is an 1880 Guanajuato (GO) 8 reales, part of a five-coin lot and cataloged as "1880/70 SB," and accompanied by 1882 through 1885GO SB coins, all "Extremely Fine or Almost Uncirculated and have medium toning." Is that your MS65 NGC today?
Anyway, I tried.
Kind regards,
George
George !
I really appreciate your response .
I will be sending you a private message .
Thank you ,
Dan
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
@pruebas , what about SONUMEX?
As George mentioned, Pittman may have been the "honorary" President of SONUMEX, but that and 10 Pesos will buy you a cup of coffee.
I guess many of those 8Rs were part of multi-coin lots in the 1999 Pittman sale. Thanks @giorgio11 for the investigation. I still think some of his coins came out via other means, and I seem to remember a long-ago conversation with Akers photographer (whose name I have now forgotten) regarding this.
Akers' photographer, for Pittman at least, was Thomas A. Mulvaney, a well-known numismatic photographer with an extensive history. Here's his website: rarecoinphotos.com/bio.php
Kind regards,
George
Yes, George, that's him -- Tom Mulvaney. We talked at one of the ANA Summer Seminars (maybe 2000?) and I think he mentioned there were MANY coins that did not make the auction. Next time I run into him, I ought to ask him to jog my memory. The stories he had....
I don't understand why all the coins I received had a green sticker on the back of the slab that said:
W/Pedigree
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.