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Victorian Bun Head Rarity By Date, and MAJOR Type (i.e. NO narrow dates, etc.)

7Jaguars7Jaguars Posts: 7,736 ✭✭✭✭✭
in World & Ancient Coins Forum
OK, I love bun head pennies, but hate the hyper-varietals which I guess makes me an odd duck. No narrow dates, open 3's, etc., and excluding the 1882, what would be a fair rarity rating by date for red, red-brown or brown unc. date & mint marked coins? I don't know if a brown unc. 1882 London coin even exists although I have seen pictures of one or maybe two RB unc. pieces that I wonder maybe have been some sort of saved out specimens, or?

I vote for 1864 crosslet 4 and serif 4 either together or independently at the top of the list,
then 1875 H, followed by 1871, 1869, 1868, 1867, then the pack.
What say you?
Love that Milled British (1830-1960)
Well, just Love coins, period.

Comments

  • InforaPennyInforaPenny Posts: 24
    Regarding bun head pennies (my favorite series), what makes them so interesting are the numerous design changes to both obverse and reverse dies. Like you, I have little interest in the hyper-varietals, but you should know that descriptions such as “narrow date” are often shorthand for very different and distinctive reverses (i.e. different shape and style of the lighthouse, etc.). Sure, it’s possible collect by date only and this is a good way to start, but then you “miss out” on rich range of major varieties (per Peck, Freeman or Gouby) that is what makes these coins so fascinating. If you’re planning to limit yourself to mint state coins, good luck! I've been collecting these coins fairly seriously for about 30 years, and my focus has been on first acquiring any collectable example, then hopefully upgrading to EF or better. In my opinion the most interesting coins are the beaded border pennies (various shield types), toothed-beaded mules, designer signature types (such as LCW below foot, 1862 mules with obverse signature, etc.). Even the relatively more common of these types can pose a significant challenge (try finding any dealer in the World with an LCW below foot penny in stock). You’ll probably need to look to an auction for one of these…

    Best Regards,

    InforaPenny
    image
  • 7Jaguars7Jaguars Posts: 7,736 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Well, true is that, however a few types are more recognized & at least IMO a truly uncirculated 1864 is at least as good as one of those infernal 23k pounds narrow dates (and likely quite as rare). Or an 1875 H uncirculated, well struck with considerable red that might fit in the same category....

    What each collects is to each their own, but I think some of the extreme date rarities have been pushed aside by a couple of avid varietal collectors...
    Love that Milled British (1830-1960)
    Well, just Love coins, period.
  • JCMhoustonJCMhouston Posts: 5,306 ✭✭✭
    Personally I would go with the rarer dates, and only major varities. I don't have a problem with the dates listed in the original post being tough in uncirculated..

    I have to say I don't quite see the need for having different rarities for color designation though. It seems that almost everyone would accept that Red designation 19th C. pennies are tougher for almost any date.

    For example I think any 1860 Beaded Border Penny in uncirculated is a pretty scarce coin, and the color designation doesn't really matter much to me. It fits my idea of a desirable penny, scarce in any grade, really tough in uncirculated, and a major variety that can be seen easily. NGC has only graded 2 (a 64 RD & 64 RB) don't know about PCGS though.

    NGC pops in Uncirculated/circulated (as of 3/20/12) :
    1860 Beaded - 2/0
    1864 Crosslet - 0/ 5
    1864 Serif - 2/0
    1867 - 3/4
    1868 - 6/1
    1869 - 2/5
    1871 - 2/2
    1875 H - 1/2
    1882 - 0/1
    JCM-Houston
    World Collection
    British Collection
    German States Collection
  • JCMhoustonJCMhouston Posts: 5,306 ✭✭✭
    So 7 Jaguars, do you have some of those dates in uncirculated you want to sell? Cheap? image
    JCM-Houston
    World Collection
    British Collection
    German States Collection
  • 7Jaguars7Jaguars Posts: 7,736 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Ha ha, desperate times but not that desperate.
    Believe I will be able to shortly report a buy worth of a "You Suck" award, however!
    Yikes, if it goes through will be the best penny buy I have ever made.

    And I can say that I am ever so thankful I got a good handful of nice bits before the
    current price rise...

    I am still of the opinion that great date rarities in top condition absolutely trump a
    "grilled" (hey, isn't that Texas terminology) worn bit of a variety that may or may
    not be arguably determined with a microscope. Let me think, one of the top of the
    heap dates listed above with a pristine well struck surface costing a fraction of one
    of these narrow date or incuse line leaf coins worn to a basal state, now which would
    I take?
    Hate to beat this to death but IMO some of the sales of the latter border on lunacy.
    Love that Milled British (1830-1960)
    Well, just Love coins, period.
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