Would you risk this or run?

comma · January 26, 2012 2:35AM

So I've been looking for a nice civil war $20 gold piece and I got an email from somebody offering me one.
It's pcgs and looks beautiful..however, he's asking like over $1k under book value.
He wants to use regular paypal, and has given me his info (name, street address, etc).
If I use regular paypal am I covered here?
Would you just run away from this?

magikbilly · January 26, 2012 2:38AM

is this somebody just anybody?

Eric

comma · January 26, 2012 2:40AM

<< is this somebody just anybody?

Eric >>

I don't know what you mean by that, but ya, it's a random email with pics.
I'm assuming he saw my post here. But he says he doesn't have an account here.
It's very fishy...I'm basically just wishful thinking.

ModCrewman · January 26, 2012 2:42AM

I believe if you use regular PayPal and they are getting their fees, you should be pretty safe.

That being said, the real question is this just a random offer, or a response to a WTB ad somewhere? From someone with whom you have SOME connection, even if just a forum, or just from some random dude.

I wouldn't let the low asking price alone be a red flag, but need to consider it in conjunction with the rest of what you know.

tahoe98 · January 26, 2012 2:46AM

...this is one of those "what does my gut tell me" moments.

comma · January 26, 2012 2:49AM

Ya...my gut is sayin 90% no. My head is saying do it. haha
He just said this is his "first sale"...which is a huge red flag to me.
Oh well.

Unknown · January 26, 2012 2:49AM

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Sonorandesertrat · January 26, 2012 3:11AM

Hmm---he doesn't have an account here, even though signing up to participate on the Forum is FREE.
Sorry, but this smells, especially if he has no record of positive transactions with (other) collectors.

messydesk · January 26, 2012 3:14AM

RFR!

DIMEMAN · January 26, 2012 3:22AM

How far away does he live from you? If close, would it be worth the drive?

Is this something hard to find?

NPD1078 · January 26, 2012 3:27AM

I had monitored this forum for a several months prior to joining so it is possibly that the person hasn't joined yet.. BUT not to join PRIOR to making an offer to someone seems fishy. I personally don't pay attention to post count or signup date but I do think the person needs to give you positive (references) transactions with collector. Also good idea to ask for there eBay account name and check there feedback as a seller....

okracer · January 26, 2012 3:27AM

Was the email like:

" Hi, I am *****, and I saw that you posted on the forums, and that you were interested in XYZ, and I happen to have this one.... I live at XXXX and my phone # is XXXX. Give me a holler if you are interested."

or more like:

" For sale: XYZ. price $XXXX. paypal is XXX. "

.....not that it matters, but just interested in how it came about....

magikbilly · January 26, 2012 3:28AM

<< 

<< is this somebody just anybody?

Eric >>

I don't know what you mean by that, but ya, it's a random email with pics.
I'm assuming he saw my post here. But he says he doesn't have an account here.
It's very fishy...I'm basically just wishful thinking. >>

I think you answered your own question.

Eric

LanceNewmanOCC · January 26, 2012 3:32AM

<< RFR! >>

XXXXXXXXXXXXX

i actually agree with Realone, set up some hoops to jump through, provide some images, a phone number etc. Paypal does protect you if you use their service.
.

RYK · January 26, 2012 3:35AM

Civil War date $20's are readily available, in all grades and price points, nearly all the time. Wait for a transaction that does not trouble you.

PS If the seller is reading this, please offer to me at ryk@blackandgoldcoins.com. I like these coins and am not afraid to buy coins from strangers.

TomB · January 26, 2012 3:43AM

If he isn't a member here then he can't get your email address through the site. Of course, if you listed it in your BST request then it is in the public domain.

golden · January 26, 2012 4:20AM

Run Forrest Run!

Billet7 · January 26, 2012 4:26AM

<< So I've been looking for a nice civil war $20 gold piece and I got an email from somebody offering me one.
It's pcgs and looks beautiful..however, he's asking like over $1k under book value.
He wants to use regular paypal, and has given me his info (name, street address, etc).
If I use regular paypal am I covered here?
Would you just run away from this? >>

You're covered up to $1000 on paypal (If I'm not mistaken.) If it's under a grand, I guess you could chance it.

comma · January 26, 2012 4:26AM

<< Civil War date $20's are readily available, in all grades and price points, nearly all the time. Wait for a transaction that does not trouble you.

PS If the seller is reading this, please offer to me at ryk@blackandgoldcoins.com. I like these coins and am not afraid to buy coins from strangers. >>

Well there's a hijack if I ever saw one

comma · January 26, 2012 4:26AM

<< How far away does he live from you? If close, would it be worth the drive?

Is this something hard to find? >>

he lives a good 5 hours away....he did offer local meetup if I was in the area...but who knows.

comma · January 26, 2012 4:27AM

<< Was the email like:

" Hi, I am *****, and I saw that you posted on the forums, and that you were interested in XYZ, and I happen to have this one.... I live at XXXX and my phone # is XXXX. Give me a holler if you are interested."

or more like:

" For sale: XYZ. price $XXXX. paypal is XXX. "

.....not that it matters, but just interested in how it came about.... >>

The email had 5 pictures and his asking price. That was it for the first one.

g048406 · January 26, 2012 5:02AM

I would ask him to list it as a buy-it-now on ebay. This way you are fully covered in case it's a scam, and, you'll have the option of returning it if it's SNAD.

comma · January 26, 2012 5:04AM

<< I would ask him to list it as a buy-it-now on ebay. This way you are fully covered in case it's a scam, and, you'll have the option of returning it if it's SNAD. >>

That's a very good idea!

rhedden · January 26, 2012 5:17AM

Two words: STOLEN GOODS

BaseballAbs · January 26, 2012 5:17AM

<< Two words: STOLEN GOODS >>

In my book that means run.

rhedden · January 26, 2012 5:23AM

Get the PCGS cert. # and do an internet search to see if it comes up under any coin robbery threads. Wasn't there a recent robbery in Houston with many gold coins stolen?

comma · January 26, 2012 5:24AM

Ya, when I told him to put it on ebay he said that he has a limit of $500 on ebay...whatever that means...
I mean I have pics of the cert number and everything...is there a way to see if it's stolen?

*edit. Did a search with the cert# and nothing came up...

johnny9434 · January 26, 2012 5:25AM

im wondering if your better off going and using someone you know to buy this coin elsewhere? just curious is all

comma · January 26, 2012 5:30AM

<< im wondering if your better off going and using someone you know to buy this coin elsewhere? just curious is all >>

Im a poor just outta college kid...so I probably shouldn't be buying gold at all haha.
The price is the only thing intriguing me here. Anywhere else would be over $1000 more for the coin (hence my hesitation).

I know I'm covered with paypal...so I'm tempted because I do have the money...but it probably isn't worth the hassle.
Something just seems off with the guy.

rhedden · January 26, 2012 5:34AM

The deal is bad. Save your money. The part about the $500 limit on eBay seals it for me.

GoldClause · January 26, 2012 5:35AM

I don't buy anything from solicitors, no matter how good it may seem.

Manorcourtman · January 26, 2012 5:37AM

Lucanus · January 26, 2012 6:03AM

Run away as fast as you can!

Doug

ModernCoin · January 26, 2012 6:11AM

<< Ya, when I told him to put it on ebay he said that he has a limit of $500 on ebay...whatever that means... >>

I heard of a selling limit on eBay recently from a very respected member on these boards, but IIRC he said it was $5000/month. Perhaps the guy has actually met his quota for the month, AND left off a zero when replying to you. That's quite a stretch, but it's plausible.

Personally I would scour the paypal help page for information on buying 'goods' via a CC, but not through eBay. Through eBay you're *solid*, but I know it's not the same outside of eBay. Still, worst case scenario is that they guy sends you a box of packing peanuts and then it goes to a dispute. As long as you pay with a legitimate credit card (NOT an 'all-in-one' card with a visa/mc logo or paypal funds) than you can always file a charge-back through your CC if paypal rules against you. Yes they'll close your account, but you can always get another one.

I gamble on zero feedback sellers on eBay and of course naturally file a lot of paypal claims too. There's just something satisfying about buying gold and silver for much less than it should be. I say go for it as long as it looks like the coin isn't stolen.

Unknown · January 26, 2012 6:23AM

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comma · January 26, 2012 6:26AM

<< Just ask yourself why would he sell it so cheap when gold is so liquid he could sell it anywhere for what it currently is going for. He is sophisticated to emailo u and others but not sophisitcated to get its true (higher value) from any number of simpler and quicker avenues. What world do you currently live on? >>

It's not the the cheap part that really made me question it. I've gotten multiple coins for 1/3 their value from reputable places...it was just the sketchiness of the guy.

I asked him for his number so I could give him a call and no emails since...haha

ModernCoin · January 26, 2012 6:27AM

<< I asked him for his number so I could give him a call and no emails since...haha >>

Case closed in that case

...

RYK · January 26, 2012 7:12AM

I was joking about the offer but not about the message. These coins are readily available, maybe not immediately, but soon enough. Wait for a legit coin from a legit source and pay up for a nice one.

Actually, Gold Rush Gallery is offering one in an OGH right now.

silverpop · January 26, 2012 8:04AM

walk away and never look back

comma · January 26, 2012 8:40AM

<< I was joking about the offer but not about the message. These coins are readily available, maybe not immediately, but soon enough. Wait for a legit coin from a legit source and pay up for a nice one.

Actually, Gold Rush Gallery is offering one in an OGH right now. >>

I know. I am going to wait and get a legit one. Thanks for the info

comma · January 26, 2012 8:41AM

Found the exact same coin listed on ebay here
Same coin/cert number...different pics.
Another member just posted a thread about the ebay auction too.

All very weird...especially that the pics are different...

RedTiger · January 26, 2012 9:59AM

I see that the coin has been spotted elsewhere. Run away.

There is an old cliche in numismatics: there is no Santa Claus.

If a coin is being offered at $1000 below fair market something is going on. These are the most likely scenarios:
a) a stolen coin.
b) a fake slab
c) a total scam, and there is no coin at all, just stolen pics, or perhaps photoshopped pics
d) the potential buyer doesn't know the real market value and the price offered is fair market value

If there is a real coin and it is really $1000 discount, why doesn't the seller sell via a proper venue such as Ebay, or consign it to an Ebay seller, or consign it to one of the auction houses for 5% to 15%? Why sell to a total stranger at a discount price when there are many other places to sell? The most likely reason would be a scam. It would be one thing if the discount were like 10% and equivalent to auction fees, quite another when the discount is so steep.

There have been any number of scammers visiting the forum. Some have tried to move expensive coins on BST, using stolen pics. Maybe some of these scammers that have been banned via IP address and can no longer post, now have to resorting to fishing for innocents via email. Most scams start out with the lure of a low price. Be careful out there.

robertpr · January 26, 2012 10:02AM

You know what they say about your gut usually being right when it's telling you something's wrong? It's right.

AUandAG · January 26, 2012 10:04AM

Since you know where he lives, why not give the local police a call and ask if they have had
any recent stolen coin reports.

I'd drive the five hours. Take the wife and stay overnight and have a good eat out with
a nice drink or two.

bob

bestclser1 · January 26, 2012 12:17PM

Listen to the wise board members.If it seems too good to be true,it is!

Buzzybest · January 26, 2012 1:03PM

<< Civil War date $20's are readily available, in all grades and price points, nearly all the time. Wait for a transaction that does not trouble you.

PS If the seller is reading this, please offer to me at ryk@blackandgoldcoins.com. I like these coins and am not afraid to buy coins from strangers. >>

I have an 1861 $20 Liberty Genuine with filed rims,but have no idea what a fair value would be.PM me if interested.

tahoe98 · January 27, 2012 12:40AM

...your statement: ....he did offer local meetup if I was in the area... now THAT makes me a tiny bit suspicious.

...never know if a surprise hold-up is about to happen.

...i know i know i'm overly cautious.

comma · January 27, 2012 1:08AM

<< ...your statement: ....he did offer local meetup if I was in the area... now THAT makes me a tiny bit suspicious.

...never know if a surprise hold-up is about to happen.

...i know i know i'm overly cautious.

>>

That is also a very good point!

Would you risk this or run?

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