Bought a Trade Dollar yesterday - 99% sure it is real but not 100%

tydye · January 12, 2012 10:13AM

It not a series that I am very familiar with. I was thinking about tacking in on an order I have set to go out.

Oh and I picked up the baby bustie as well

magikbilly · January 12, 2012 10:16AM

I'll pass on the Trade $ - it looks unusual around the denticles and mm etc.

Eric

crypto79 · January 12, 2012 10:17AM

Looks ok to me, nice too....AU something

DoubleEagle59 · January 12, 2012 10:20AM

Looks OK to me.

tydye · January 12, 2012 10:23AM

Thanks! My hesitation was the place where I purchased it from is flooded with forgeries.

michiganboy · January 12, 2012 10:33AM

Honestly the trade looks fake to me as well, its got the right die types for the year but the denticles look to mushy to me and the scroll looks like the ones I've seen on counterfeits and the ropes on the bale don't look right either. I've been seeing a lot of counterfeit trade dollars with correct die type lately and even pretty sharp detail, usually the eagles eye is wrong or the letters are not sharp though. I would of had to see that one in hand first.

kaz · January 12, 2012 10:33AM

Looks genuine to me too. The dentils are often weak in areas on trades, but they should be of uniform length and width, as these are. The legends are very sharp and squared off, too. Looks like an attractive and rather high AU coin from my seat.

keoj · January 12, 2012 10:46AM

It looks fine to me....I see nothing wrong with this coin.

keoj

TheBigB · January 12, 2012 11:15AM

Have you checked the weight on the trade dollar?

tydye · January 12, 2012 11:20AM

27.1 grams 418 grains

TheBigB · January 12, 2012 11:25AM

<< 27.1 grams 418 grains >>

Seems reasonable, I had a fake that was off considerably. The ultimate would be to do a specific gravity test.

stealer · January 12, 2012 11:28AM

<< 

<< 27.1 grams 418 grains >>

Seems reasonable, I had a fake that was off considerably. The ultimate would be to do a specific gravity test. >>

Chinese fakers use real silver in their fakes.

TheBigB · January 12, 2012 11:43AM

<< 

<< 

<< 27.1 grams 418 grains >>

Seems reasonable, I had a fake that was off considerably. The ultimate would be to do a specific gravity test. >>

Chinese fakers use real silver in their fakes. >>

I didn't mean to discount that possibility, but quantitative testing can conclusively weed out certain fakes.

rmpsrpms · January 12, 2012 12:08PM

Wow, if the counterfeits are so good that there is this much controversy determining if it's real, how would a new collector ever get into this series? How likely is it a TPG T$ is counterfeit, either the coin itself being an excellent fake or the slab itself being counterfeit? Seems the counterfeiters are ruining the hobby, at least where certain series are concerned. Not that I was interested in T$, but this seems a cancer that is spreading through the hobby.

AUandAG · January 12, 2012 12:09PM

Okay, I'm in the fake crowd on this one. Dentils, wheat chaff ropes. But, the good news is that I'm
usually wrong!

Now what is the diameter and thickness?

Should be 1.5 inches and .114 inches thick.

bob

michiganboy · January 12, 2012 12:57PM

<< Wow, if the counterfeits are so good that there is this much controversy determining if it's real, how would a new collector ever get into this series? How likely is it a TPG T$ is counterfeit, either the coin itself being an excellent fake or the slab itself being counterfeit? Seems the counterfeiters are ruining the hobby, at least where certain series are concerned. Not that I was interested in T$, but this seems a cancer that is spreading through the hobby. >>

Every year the fakes keep pouring out of china and the internet makes the collectors have access to buying them, and unfortunately the counterfeiters are stepping up their game. Good news is that I haven't heard of any passing the top TPG graders without getting noticed.

RichieURich · January 12, 2012 1:06PM

No offense to the OP intended, just my thoughts on the subject.

I am a dealer in Bust and Seated coins, and I will not buy nor sell an uncertified Trade dollar, unless I am 100% certain of its authenticity. If I have to submit the coin to a grading service to be certain, I do so. Some of the fake Trade dollars are very deceptive.

I have customers who regularly tell me about great coins they bought somewhere in an online auction or a flea market or a local auction, that are in coin series they don't know, and the coin must be authentic because my customer says "It looks good to me." The last two of these coins I was told about were a 1798 dollar that was rejected for authenticity by both PCGS and NGC, and an 1873-CC Trade dollar in AU purchased by the customer for $300 despite the Coin Values valuation of $3,500 in AU and even the Greysheet valuation of $1,175 in AU.

Two points here: 1. Maybe the "it looks good to me" isn't that good of a test of authenticity, particularly for someone who doesn't know the series.
2. If you owned the 1873-CC Trade dollar in AU, would you (a) send it to PCGS, get it authenticated, and sell it for somewhere around $1,175 or more, or (b) sell it raw for $300?

DDR · January 12, 2012 9:31PM

I rarely disagree with Crypto or Keoj, but I don't like the look of that Trade dollar.

TennesseeDave · January 12, 2012 11:08PM

I am on the fence about the authenticity of this one. There are some areas of weakness that have me leaning towards it being a fake. I hope I am wrong.Can you post a picture of the reeded edge?

joecopper · January 12, 2012 11:39PM

I am no expert here but I did pull out a pic of an 1878-S I used to own (XF45) - the mintmark was perfectly centered on the upright of the D in "DOLLAR". The obverse on the coin in question seems awfully softly struck to me but could be wrong on that. Also the dentils on mine are bolder/
????????

tradedollarnut · January 13, 2012 12:26AM

Looks ok to me

Bought a Trade Dollar yesterday - 99% sure it is real but not 100%

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