It's easy enough to get complacent when you do hundreds of transactions without a hitch. Don't beat yourself up over this. Could have happened to any one of us.
"The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
<< <i>Thanks for the suggestion....I do plan on pursuing the open case with the Bank after I get the expected news.
As for the other comments, my reluctance to post has now been confirmed. I do feel like a total idiot, it is just good to have it confirmed on a public forum.
Tim, sorry about your loss and hope it works out for you. I quit selling any bullion on ebay due to the high fees and what appears to be a increase in the crooks operating on the bay. I now take all bullion to the local B&M. I get a less than spot but no worries and it is nice to support local business. Also, thanks for the names, they are now blocked. Good luck!
<< <i>Tim, sorry about your loss and hope it works out for you. I quit selling any bullion on ebay due to the high fees and what appears to be a increase in the crooks operating on the bay. I now take all bullion to the local B&M. I get a less than spot but no worries and it is nice to support local business. Also, thanks for the names, they are now blocked. Good luck! >>
Thanks Timber100. This was my largest transaction on ebay. If I have a bullion sale in the future, I will probably follow your suggestion. I received tons of weird requests on this auction and I would prefer not to deal with that aspect in the future.
I had something very similar with a large silver item, also to Canada. Check was sent, but my bank wanted to send it for collection. They credited me about a week later, but I waited and finally the check was returned.
I cannot find anything at this time, but it either the same person or a group.
PNG member, numismatic dealer since 1965. Operates a retail store, also has exhibited at over 1000 shows. I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.
<< <i>During the following week, I was contacted my a fellow ebay seller (fairtraderz) who asked if I had any issues with my sell to d_belvina12. fairtraderz had sold a $10K auction to the same buyer and was concerned.
How do you get that info?
I hope it works out but there were a lot of red flags if you ask me. My bank does not place holds on checks i deposit but i am on the hook down the road if something goes wrong. It is hard to get good info from a bank IMO but there is no way they could have cleared that check that fast. >>
How indeed? As we all know, unless it's your auction on one can see who the bidders/winners are (at least until feedback is left).
I'm very sorry that this happened to your brother. It's quite a loss. I hope that they catch the crook.
Amazing, just amazing. Looks like he had his arse handed to him on this one. Of course, if there ever were grounds for a SNAD claim this is it. A fool and their money...
I've never been able to figure out when a check "clears". I asked my bank once and they told me they don't know. They just know if it eventually comes back. They never suggested (and I never tried) calling the bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
<< <i>I've never been able to figure out when a check "clears". I asked my bank once and they told me they don't know. They just know if it eventually comes back. They never suggested (and I never tried) calling the bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
Good to know for the future.
-Keith >>
even if a check clears it can still come back to haunt you. "No checks."
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
Banks won't tell you when you can be sure a check has cleared- at least, they won't make any promises that put them on the hook if it turns out to be no good. The only way to be 100% sure is when it doesn't get returned.
I've never trusted buyers I don't know or have not previously done business with and follow this:
Call the issuing bank and ask for "bookkeeping". When you get a "bookkeeper" tell them that so and so has presented you a check for $xxxx and ask if it will clear. They may ask for some additional information such as bank account number and sometimes not as they know the customer intimately.
You can tell a lot by the response that you're given: "Oh, no problem with that one" or "you not local right? You should know that that check will clear" or "hmmmm, not at this time" etc.
If I do take a check and it does not clear it's a call back to the bookkeeper with a simple when should I show up for presentation? When does he deposit funds? Fridays? Since I'm out of town if I called you would you present the check for me after his deposit on Friday?
I owned a hardware store for years and took more than 100 bad checks but collected on all but 6 by using these methods. Not perfect but it does work.
bob
Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
Several times a year I will have to come into the station and break people's hearts and tell them that the 3-6,000.00 check from some company they've never heard of and that they received for no reason other than the other end phishing for them to cash it and Western Union a chunk back is FAKE and that I will happily shred it for them....
We've also had them come in AFTER they've deposited the (fake) check and went on a 3-6,000.00 spending spree. They come in right after their bank calls them about 10 days later and informs them that the check was fake. At that point not only are they out any money they've wired back but also owe the money back to the bank and for the items they blew it on.
You wouldn't believe how hard it is to convince some people of this. I recently had a woman convinced that a man was in town in a car waiting to receive word that she had wired 800.00. Once she did he was going to drop off a 100K or something stupid. She was completely convinced he was legit..... Now of course he was not dumb, he was obviously using google's street view or something similar and describing her house as well as landmarks such as city hall, where he was supposedly sitting.
I had to have her call city hall and speak to someone. I took her out to my car and showed her page after page of proof that directly contradicted all of the lies he was telling her. I even spoke with the guy on HER phone while she listened and he cursed at me and told me he was just about to take all of her money and that he was now going to take all of my mom's, grandmother's, etc... I screwed with him pretty bad.
When I finally left, I wasn't sure that I had convinced her.
One thing that many of these fake checks have in common.....the envelopes they come in frequently bear Canadian postage.
It seems at a quick glance to be a more elaborate scheme of the above. These scammers are evolving.
IMO nothing was done correct with this sale. First of all if you buyer backed up and you had a second buyer you could have simply sent them an invoice via paypal and they could have paid with an echeck that way you would have been covered. I dont see the point in accepting a check via ebay, you save paypal fee's but pay the ebay fees, you might as well skip the ebay fees and use paypal that way you are covered. I dont accept checks for anything over 500.00 period, if they want to send a check I simply send an ivoice via paypal so I am covered. Wire transfers are another option. There was simply no reason to accept an out of the country check and then ship the next day. You are not going to get your money back thats all there is to it, even if they are caught and convicted the only thing you might get is a restitution order that simply wont get paid.
<< <i>I've never been able to figure out when a check "clears". I asked my bank once and they told me they don't know. They just know if it eventually comes back. They never suggested (and I never tried) calling the bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
Good to know for the future.
-Keith >>
The way my friend (a bank manager) explained it to me was, "After 10 business days, assume the check has cleared, but that's only an assumption."
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.
Comments
It's easy enough to get complacent when you do hundreds of transactions without a hitch. Don't beat yourself up over this. Could have happened to any one of us.
"The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
~ Vince Lombardi
<< <i>
<< <i>Thanks for the suggestion....I do plan on pursuing the open case with the Bank after I get the expected news.
As for the other comments, my reluctance to post has now been confirmed. I do feel like a total idiot, it is just good to have it confirmed on a public forum.
Tim >>
Just ignore the troll.
Russ, NCNE >>
<< <i>Tim, sorry about your loss and hope it works out for you. I quit selling any bullion on ebay due to the high fees and what appears to be a increase in the crooks operating on the bay. I now take all bullion to the local B&M. I get a less than spot but no worries and it is nice to support local business. Also, thanks for the names, they are now blocked. Good luck! >>
Thanks Timber100. This was my largest transaction on ebay. If I have a bullion sale in the future, I will probably follow your suggestion. I received tons of weird requests on this auction and I would prefer not to deal with that aspect in the future.
Appreciate the idea.
Tim
I cannot find anything at this time, but it either the same person or a group.
I firmly believe in numismatics as the world's greatest hobby, but recognize that this is a luxury and without collectors, we can all spend/melt our collections/inventories.
eBaystore
<< <i>One word. PayPal. >>
I think that waiting the full 10 days for the funds to clear and then confirming that they've cleared is fine as well.
The PayPal fees add up in an auction like this. That said, it is a lot of protection.
<< <i>During the following week, I was contacted my a fellow ebay seller (fairtraderz) who asked if I had any issues with my sell to d_belvina12. fairtraderz had sold a $10K auction to the same buyer and was concerned.
How do you get that info?
I hope it works out but there were a lot of red flags if you ask me. My bank does not place holds on checks i deposit but i am on the hook down the road if something goes wrong. It is hard to get good info from a bank IMO but there is no way they could have cleared that check that fast. >>
How indeed? As we all know, unless it's your auction on one can see who the bidders/winners are (at least until feedback is left).
I'm very sorry that this happened to your brother. It's quite a loss. I hope that they catch the crook.
<< <i>Love it he bought two of the super rolls of Prez bucks.
Gold dollars auction.
Amazing, just amazing. Looks like he had his arse handed to him on this one. Of course, if there ever were grounds for a SNAD claim this is it. A fool and their money...
bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
Good to know for the future.
-Keith
<< <i>I've never been able to figure out when a check "clears". I asked my bank once and they told me they don't know. They just know if it eventually comes back. They never suggested (and I never tried) calling the
bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
Good to know for the future.
-Keith >>
even if a check clears it can still come back to haunt you. "No checks."
"A car is a tool that takes you from one place to another. Everything beyond that is a payment for other people's perception of you."
Call the issuing bank and ask for "bookkeeping". When you get a "bookkeeper" tell them that so
and so has presented you a check for $xxxx and ask if it will clear. They may ask for some additional
information such as bank account number and sometimes not as they know the customer intimately.
You can tell a lot by the response that you're given: "Oh, no problem with that one" or "you not local
right? You should know that that check will clear" or "hmmmm, not at this time" etc.
If I do take a check and it does not clear it's a call back to the bookkeeper with a simple when should
I show up for presentation? When does he deposit funds? Fridays? Since I'm out of town if I called
you would you present the check for me after his deposit on Friday?
I owned a hardware store for years and took more than 100 bad checks but collected on all but 6 by
using these methods. Not perfect but it does work.
bob
Several times a year I will have to come into the station and break people's hearts and tell them that the 3-6,000.00 check from some company they've never heard of and that they received for no reason other than the other end phishing for them to cash it and Western Union a chunk back is FAKE and that I will happily shred it for them....
We've also had them come in AFTER they've deposited the (fake) check and went on a 3-6,000.00 spending spree. They come in right after their bank calls them about 10 days later and informs them that the check was fake. At that point not only are they out any money they've wired back but also owe the money back to the bank and for the items they blew it on.
You wouldn't believe how hard it is to convince some people of this. I recently had a woman convinced that a man was in town in a car waiting to receive word that she had wired 800.00. Once she did he was going to drop off a 100K or something stupid. She was completely convinced he was legit..... Now of course he was not dumb, he was obviously using google's street view or something similar and describing her house as well as landmarks such as city hall, where he was supposedly sitting.
I had to have her call city hall and speak to someone. I took her out to my car and showed her page after page of proof that directly contradicted all of the lies he was telling her. I even spoke with the guy on HER phone while she listened and he cursed at me and told me he was just about to take all of her money and that he was now going to take all of my mom's, grandmother's, etc... I screwed with him pretty bad.
When I finally left, I wasn't sure that I had convinced her.
One thing that many of these fake checks have in common.....the envelopes they come in frequently bear Canadian postage.
It seems at a quick glance to be a more elaborate scheme of the above. These scammers are evolving.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>Calling the issuing bank rarely yields anything. Most of the majors will no longer verify checks.
Russ, NCNE >>
Well, rarely in this case would have saved a big headache as the bank was out of business.
bob
<< <i>When does he deposit funds? Fridays? >>
lol
I can just see a bank representative answering that question.
<< <i>I've never been able to figure out when a check "clears". I asked my bank once and they told me they don't know. They just know if it eventually comes back. They never suggested (and I never tried) calling the
bank the check was written from. I can't believe my bank didn't suggest it.
Good to know for the future.
-Keith >>
The way my friend (a bank manager) explained it to me was, "After 10 business days, assume the check has cleared, but that's only an assumption."
New collectors, please educate yourself before spending money on coins; there are people who believe that using numismatic knowledge to rip the naïve is what this hobby is all about.