This Vermont landscape is counterfeit

Comments

• RYK Posts: 35,800 ✭✭✭✭✭

  August 27, 2011 3:40AM

  You no doubt just saved a forum member from a regrettable purchase.
  
  It's so ugly that I could not care less if it were real, fake, R-7, etc.

  My Box of 20: https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/box-20/ryks-gold-box-20/17132

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• adamlaneus Posts: 6,969 ✭✭✭

  August 27, 2011 3:43AM

  how can you tell it is a vermont?
  

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• paladin Posts: 898 ✭✭

  August 27, 2011 3:45AM

  Because it looks like one?

  
  
  "The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
  
  ~ Vince Lombardi
  

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• ambro51 Posts: 13,949 ✭✭✭✭✭

  August 27, 2011 7:39AM

  The diameter is very small even with the great range of diameters of planchets. Clearly a copy of a Ryder 4 Vermontis even the weight is within ranges but as you see the abuse has revealed its true metal.
  
  Odd to see a piece like this, not an electrotype but seemingly cast and then plated somehow. Carlotto makes no mention of copies of this variety, Im pretty sure, but will check again later when I get to where my book is. There are copies of Ryder 7, these are old high quality pieces still in production made from plated pewter but bearing the COPY mark very firmly on the obverse.
  
  nasty piece, regardless ......

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• NewEnglandRarities Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭✭

  August 27, 2011 8:06AM

  Your piece is a known counterfeit of the Vermont RR-4 (with Vermontis legend). I have seen a few of this copy over the years. The plow and date are significantly different from the real coin, but otherwise it is quite close to the original. They most likely are fairly old, I'm thinking somewhere in the 40s-60s for date of manufacture. I have two in the office somewhere one with no copy and one with copy engraved by hand in very small writing right above the plow. I assume they are fairly rare as I have seen many Vermont landscape counterfeits but only a very small handful of this particular one over the years.
  
  

  New England Rarities...Dealer In Colonial Coinage and Americana

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• coachbedford Posts: 189

  August 27, 2011 10:48AM

  Do you mean 1940s to 1960s for manufacture?? Or 1840s-60s? I'd be way more inclined to believe the latter........ to me looks credible as 18th century counterfeit!

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• NewEnglandRarities Posts: 1,139 ✭✭✭✭

  August 27, 2011 2:27PM

  
  
  << <i>Do you mean 1940s to 1960s for manufacture?? Or 1840s-60s? I'd be way more inclined to believe the latter........ to me looks credible as 18th century counterfeit! >>
  
  
  
  I certainly think these were made in the 1900s. The feel of the pieces is somewhat modern compared to other old electrotypes of the late 1800s. Most of these pieces were artificially aged as to look much older to fool unsuspecting collectors. I could be wrong but the two I have that match the op coin have the look and feel similar to other colonial copies manufactured in the mid 1900s.
  
  There is a variety of Vermont copper that is believed to be a contemporary cast counterfeit made to circulate during the late 1700s. They have a very unique look and feel and certainly are of different manufacture than some of the more recently made cast pieces. They are very rare and highly collectable and command very strong money when they come available for sale. They also use the legend Vermontis, but are of a totally different fabric and quality from the coin posted above.

  New England Rarities...Dealer In Colonial Coinage and Americana

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• paladin Posts: 898 ✭✭

  August 27, 2011 3:22PM

  
  Thanks for your help. I was poking around some metal detecting forums and came across this coin:
  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  It was dug up in Utah, of all places, last year, just after Christmas. The weight was 11.1 grams, 28.5mm diam. Although it was decided it was counterfeit (due primarily to the weight), they didn't know if it was a contemporary one or modern. Any thoughts on this one?

  
  
  "The only place success comes before work is in the dictionary."
  
  ~ Vince Lombardi
  

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