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Part 2 - Revised coin and paper currency system.
RWB
Posts: 8,082 ✭
Follow-up to earlier request for comments on this proposal.
Coins of denomination 10-cents, 25 cents, 1-dollar and 5-dollars issued for circulation.
Paper currency of denomination $10, $20, $50, $100 issued for circulation.
Coins of denomination 50-cents, 1-dollar (large size) and 5-dollars (gold, old standard) used exclusively for national commemorative coins.
Reasons for specific denominations
10-cents, 25 cents, 1-dollar and 5-dollar coins issued for circulation make maximum use of existing denominations. The $5 coin allows for expansion of vending, transit and other coin-based systems and devices.
This selection of values limits cash transaction losses to an average of four-cents. The total loss or gain by an individual over a year is less than eight cents. (This is based on experience of New Zealand and other countries that have eliminated one or more low denomination coins.)
Paper currency denominations
Removal of $1, $2 and $5 eliminate the problems of preference. With only one form of a denomination, that one will be used in commerce. This also eliminates need for expensive bill discriminators ($300-$400 each) in vending machines, transit systems and similar self-service devices. It further removes necessity for BEP to compromise security features to accommodate limitations of vending machines.
Overall financial savings
1. Government – reduction of cost of printing paper currency by 70%. Associated cost of transportation, facilities, security, misc. labor, also reduced.
2. Government – long term reduction in cost of circulating currency due to 25 year life of metal coins, combined with societal reduction in demand for coins and paper currency.
3. Business – substantial cost reduction of manufacture, maintenance and upgrading of vending and other self-service devices.
4. Business – expansion of range of goods and services available on self-service basis.
Coins of denomination 10-cents, 25 cents, 1-dollar and 5-dollars issued for circulation.
Paper currency of denomination $10, $20, $50, $100 issued for circulation.
Coins of denomination 50-cents, 1-dollar (large size) and 5-dollars (gold, old standard) used exclusively for national commemorative coins.
Reasons for specific denominations
10-cents, 25 cents, 1-dollar and 5-dollar coins issued for circulation make maximum use of existing denominations. The $5 coin allows for expansion of vending, transit and other coin-based systems and devices.
This selection of values limits cash transaction losses to an average of four-cents. The total loss or gain by an individual over a year is less than eight cents. (This is based on experience of New Zealand and other countries that have eliminated one or more low denomination coins.)
Paper currency denominations
Removal of $1, $2 and $5 eliminate the problems of preference. With only one form of a denomination, that one will be used in commerce. This also eliminates need for expensive bill discriminators ($300-$400 each) in vending machines, transit systems and similar self-service devices. It further removes necessity for BEP to compromise security features to accommodate limitations of vending machines.
Overall financial savings
1. Government – reduction of cost of printing paper currency by 70%. Associated cost of transportation, facilities, security, misc. labor, also reduced.
2. Government – long term reduction in cost of circulating currency due to 25 year life of metal coins, combined with societal reduction in demand for coins and paper currency.
3. Business – substantial cost reduction of manufacture, maintenance and upgrading of vending and other self-service devices.
4. Business – expansion of range of goods and services available on self-service basis.
0
Comments
Yes, this is real.
The 20-cent denomination is inconsistent with current vending equipment. The denomination is also unknown to the American population. (The euro experience related to an entirely new system of coinage.)
Several other questions are too vague to be answerable.
Adding back a larger bill such as a $500. I know it will probably never happen for a ton of reasons mentioned in previous threads. It doesn't change the fact that I would still like it.
"3. Business – substantial cost reduction of manufacture, maintenance and upgrading of vending and other self-service devices."
Maybe after the 10 years pass and all current machines are updated and those costs are recouped? I think too much assuming is going on here. It is my guess that vending machine companies will likely lobby AGAINST the proposal for this very reason. Then....what happens 10 years further out when another change is desired?
Overall, I like it.
Not really looking for much these days but if I were, it might be a toner.
Not really looking for much these days but if I were, it might be a toner.
<< <i>Response to questions:
Yes, this is real.
>>
Seriously? This is real? Is there a link? If no nickel, I see no sense in a quarter. Have a dime, half dollar and dollar coin. Leave the dime its size. Make a half dollar out of 100% copper and make it current nickel size. Leave the dollar its current size and metallic makeup. If you want to make a two dollar coin make it the size of the quarter and out of 100% nickel. Get rid of this clad crap.
Europeans went through drastic changes 12 years ago and survived. We can survive a small alteration. We're not an old culture with deep traditions. We need to quit acting like our money is as old as the drachma.
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It is undergoing informal discussion by staff and special interest advocates to find a sound, effective consensus. It is a very tiny thing in the overall task of improving efficiency, aiding businesses and reducing unnecessary governmental activities.
The requests for coin collector comments are intended to present thoughts from a segment of the population that has a deeper interest in coinage and paper currency than most.
I can also see a use for a circulating twenty dollar coin, a hard knocks business strike working coin. Lots of day to day transactions involve $20.
<< <i>It is undergoing informal discussion by staff and special interest advocates to find a sound, effective consensus. >>
fat chance.
I still say, at this current time, they will have to force the new system upon people before they really accept it.
I do note that things could still be priced in increments of 5c with the proper change.
5c - give 25c, return 2 10c
10c
15c - give 25c, return 10c
20c
25c
30c - give 2 25c, return 2 10c
35c
40c - give 2 25c, return 10c
45c
50c
55c - give 3 25c, return 2 10c
etc.
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coins are only used to make change now days.
But to make things chang over smoothly I believe we need a five cent coin. It's absurd to
continue with the current oin that is worth more as metal than as money and is expensive
to manufacture. The simplest and most readily understood and implemented solution is
to just switch the composition to aluminum. Cost of the coin crashes and we should be able
to maintain the denomination for years and perhaps decades. A large aluminum coin like
this is easy to handle so should generate few complaints. There's no need that vending
machines accept these coins since five cents won't even come close to buying something
from a machine. Old gum ball machines will still work for a nickel and the vending mach-
ines can still dispense aluminum nickels in change without retrofit.
Without a nickel there will be times that things have to be rounded to the nearest quarter
and some people won't understand how to do this or why they should be out so "much"
money.
But just do it. We need a currency system that works rather than one from another era
that hasn't worked in decades. The biggies are getting rid of the cent and paper dollar.
<< <i>I like it overall. If I were to nit-pick I might re-examine the following two areas: Adding back a larger bill such as a $500. I know it will probably never happen for a ton of reasons mentioned in previous threads. It doesn't change the fact that I would still like it. >>
My prediction is that before the expiration of 2014, the United States will be printing bills larger than 100 dollars. My prediction is that before 2014 is over, they will be printing $1,000 bills and I predict that at some point you will use one of them to buy a coke.
(And this is coming from the guy that told you years ago PCGs was going to start grading with plus signs, who said in 1999 that most expensive collectible paper money would soon be professionally graded like coins and it's coming from the guy who a months ago said food, oil, gold and silver were gonna go up dramatically. Oh, did I happen to mention I sold my inventory at the top of the market in 2008? For what it's worth.)
<< <i>Given the quality of recently produced counterfeit coinage, I believe we would need to add some strong anticounterfeiting measures (beyond what exists with current coinage) to a $5 coin to prevent some potentially serious problems. >>
Good point.
I favor bimetallic coins above $1 just because they are much harder to counterfeit.
Love that positive, "can do" attitude.
<< <i>I do note that things could still be priced in increments of 5c with the proper change.
5c - give 25c, return 2 10c
10c
15c - give 25c, return 10c
20c
25c
30c - give 2 25c, return 2 10c
35c
40c - give 2 25c, return 10c
45c
50c
55c - give 3 25c, return 2 10c
etc. >>
Is that a roll of quarters in your pocket or are you just trying to make change for retail vendors in a ridiculous currency system?
That 25 year life number is too low; thus, the benefit is understated.
As with most change (no coin pun intended), most people won't like it until it's instituted.
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Nothing more than more social engineering. The debasement of the currency allows politicians to do whatever they want without oversight.
It's no surprise they want to trash the nickel now - it's the only real link to value left. It calls attention to the fact that the dollar is worth less.
Talk to FASB and ask them when they're going back to reality in their accounting standards for big banks. 2,500 pages of a "financial reform" bill and not a peep about the bogus accounting changes made in 2008 made in order to protect the guilty rats who torpedoed our financial system for their own benefit. And Chris Dodd was a beneficiary of that, with his VIP financing deal. Let's remember who's doing what to whom.
If you want to accomplish something meaningful, demand accountability.
Cheapening the alloys and moving toward a cashless society is just one more nail in the coffin, in my opinion. I say "no" to changing the coinage and "yes" to cutting the size of government and their spending budgets. Put the finances into better shape and the currency WILL take care of itself. Go Paul Ryan!
I knew it would happen.
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Of course I wish you and the others involved in this project success in actually getting it implemented. I am sick and tired of our current political situation where the extremes on both sides determine it will be MY way or the highway. This is a country of 300 million people and at least 100 million of them tend to be conservative and 100 million of them tend to be liberal. The other 100 million, myself included, tend to be middle of the road. I believe in compromise, and that is the only way a proposal such as this can ever become law. Only polititions and lobbyists can get laws passed so good luck.
Steve
My Complete PROOF Lincoln Cent with Major Varieties(1909-2015)Set Registry
I don't want 20% of the Dollar Coins to be FAKE!
Not really looking for much these days but if I were, it might be a toner.
<< <i>Roger,
Of course I wish you and the others involved in this project success in actually getting it implemented. I am sick and tired of our current political situation where the extremes on both sides determine it will be MY way or the highway. This is a country of 300 million people and at least 100 million of them tend to be conservative and 100 million of them tend to be liberal. The other 100 million, myself included, tend to be middle of the road. I believe in compromise, and that is the only way a proposal such as this can ever become law. Only polititions and lobbyists can get laws passed so good luck.
Steve
42% conservative
35% moderate
20% liberal
1% braindead
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<< <i>
Cheapening the alloys and moving toward a cashless society is just one more nail in the coffin, in my opinion. I say "no" to changing the coinage and "yes" to cutting the size of government and their spending budgets. Put the finances into better shape and the currency WILL take care of itself. Go Paul Ryan! >>
This may sound good on paper but in reality it's this sort of waste that got us
into this mess. The penny alone is like a stinking albatross our economy wears
as it goes about business. It is stark testimony to the importance of politics
and the unimportance of everything else.