What would you grade this coin? 1940 Jefferson
llafoe
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What would you grade this coin? It's is in a Secure Plus MS67FS holder... do you agree with this grade? (For those of you that don't collect Jefferson's... the last step doesn't need to be full for the FS designation.)
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Based on the enlarged photo of the steps, it is obvious that the 6th step is incomplete. But as you pointed out, that is not a qualification for the full step designation. I don't think that the two light marks, one over the "I" and the other below the 3rd pillar would preclude a full step designation. However, it appears from the photo that there is a bridge of the 3rd & 4th steps over the "E" in the fourth quadrant. Using the quarterstep method, I grade the steps 6-5-5-4 and would not give it a full step designation. Nagengast states that 20% of 1940 Jeffersons have full steps. NGC is more conservative in their application of the full step designation and I don't think they would grade this coin full steps. I feel compelled to state that my analysis of this coin is based solely on a photo and that upon in hand inspection, it is entirely possible that the steps are actually full.
I don't have a huge problem with this coin in the MS67 FS holder, but with regards to incremental grading, this is definitely a "C" coin for the grade. For many of the later dates/mm in the Jefferson series, poor strike is the result of hub deterioration and not as important in the numerical grade of the coin. However, the coins from 1940 were very well struck and a poor strike should absolutely detract from the grade. Here are some photos of a 1940 with a better strike and more clearly defined steps even though the slab is a mess and has many scuffs and scratches.
We'll use our hands and hearts and if we must we'll use our heads.
...i think the call was correct. i could see it with a bean, too.
<< <i>...i think the call was correct. i could see it with a bean, too.
You have quite the imagination since CAC won't bean business strike Jeffersons...
Lehigh96 - Thanks for the analysis!
Value = $1.00
<< <i>Unc-64, from heavily used dies; no, the steps are not full.
Value = $1.00 >>
20x face... in your face!
Hoard the keys.
Hoard the keys.
<< <i>Unc-64, from heavily used dies; no, the steps are not full.
Value = $1.00 >>
party pooper !
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but I have had many coins with nicer steps graded non FS, so I will say no to the FS claim.
+ 2..I love the coin.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
The coin does have a nice blend of luster and toning but was likely a result from middle aged dies, not new dies. It's very collectible by the larger
crowd but the strike has a lot of room for improvement.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
66lds no fs
wow edit to say Al beat me to it
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>1940 Party?
thats how your steps should look bro
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>I would grade the coin MS67. The coin is very clean with only a few very minor distractions. In fact, the discoloration in the right obverse field is more concerning to me than any of the light marks on the coin. From the photo, the luster appears to be excellent as does the eye appeal. However, this coin is not very well struck considering that the best struck coins from the Jefferson series come from 1940 & 1941. There is significant die wear on both the obverse and reverse. Jefferson's hair detail is certainly below average for the date/mm. The reverse seems better struck than the obverse but there is obvious softness in the central details of Monticello.
Based on the enlarged photo of the steps, it is obvious that the 6th step is incomplete. But as you pointed out, that is not a qualification for the full step designation. I don't think that the two light marks, one over the "I" and the other below the 3rd pillar would preclude a full step designation. However, it appears from the photo that there is a bridge of the 3rd & 4th steps over the "E" in the fourth quadrant. Using the quarterstep method, I grade the steps 6-5-5-4 and would not give it a full step designation. Nagengast states that 20% of 1940 Jeffersons have full steps. NGC is more conservative in their application of the full step designation and I don't think they would grade this coin full steps. I feel compelled to state that my analysis of this coin is based solely on a photo and that upon in hand inspection, it is entirely possible that the steps are actually full.
I don't have a huge problem with this coin in the MS67 FS holder, but with regards to incremental grading, this is definitely a "C" coin for the grade. For many of the later dates/mm in the Jefferson series, poor strike is the result of hub deterioration and not as important in the numerical grade of the coin. However, the coins from 1940 were very well struck and a poor strike should absolutely detract from the grade. Here are some photos of a 1940 with a better strike and more clearly defined steps even though the slab is a mess and has many scuffs and scratches.
IMO no steps here either-too many bridges
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>What would you grade this coin? It's is in a Secure Plus MS67FS holder... do you agree with this grade? (For those of you that don't collect Jefferson's... the last step doesn't need to be full for the FS designation.)
am I detecting slight doubling on a few letters of monticello?
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>1940 Party?
Nice strike!
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>
<< <i>...i think the call was correct. i could see it with a bean, too.
You have quite the imagination since CAC won't bean business strike Jeffersons...
Lehigh96 - Thanks for the analysis!
You are very welcome. For clarification, the CAC will accept business strike Jefferson varieties.
I find it peculiar that right after I made a post that explains why the coin is low end for the assigned grade, two people post that they think the coin is PQ but provide no explanation.
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<< <i>
IMO no steps here either-too many bridges >>
No worries, I upgraded to a coin with better step detail.
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<< <i>
<< <i>
IMO no steps here either-too many bridges >>
No worries, I upgraded to a coin with better step detail.
THAT ONE ROCKS!
Go BIG or GO HOME. ©Bill
<< <i>I received the coin today... the steps ARE full. The TrueView images drowned out the luster on all the coins and for some reason, obscured the right side of the stairs on this coin. Under a magnifying glass, the steps are full. >>
Congratulations, I was hoping that was the case.
<< <i>I received the coin today... the steps ARE full. The TrueView images drowned out the luster on all the coins and for some reason, obscured the right side of the stairs on this coin. Under a magnifying glass, the steps are full. >>
What would you grade this coin? It's is in a Secure Plus MS67FS holder... do you agree with this grade?
You started a thread that included a poll asking for opinions on the grade of your coin and the only thing you have to say about it is, the steps are full??
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>
<< <i>I received the coin today... the steps ARE full. The TrueView images drowned out the luster on all the coins and for some reason, obscured the right side of the stairs on this coin. Under a magnifying glass, the steps are full. >>
What would you grade this coin? It's is in a Secure Plus MS67FS holder... do you agree with this grade?
You started a thread that included a poll asking for opinions on the grade of your coin and the only thing you have to say about it is, the steps are full??
Leo
I said more... I said I was surprised at the TrueView images... in this case, it looks like they took a photo of the coin through a slab that had a rub above the right portion of the slab. This coin has luster that POPS! I mentioned how the TrueView image drowned out the luster of the coin. I was happy, when I had the coin in hand and was able to inspect in under magnification, that the steps were full. So I said a LOT more than "... the steps are full."
The coin has more color in person, a stronger strike, BLOOMING luster and full steps. I'm really dissapointed in the TrueViews.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>It belongs to a 10-year-old... he's happy. That used to be important? We have almost $100 in it, so Daddy's happy too. But if you'd like, I'll "educate" him so he'll stop collecting coins?
Are you saying the coin is homemade?
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<< <i>It belongs to a 10-year-old... he's happy. That used to be important? We have almost $100 in it, so Daddy's happy too. But if you'd like, I'll "educate" him so he'll stop collecting coins?
Are you saying the coin is homemade? >>
No, to my knowledge it's been wrapped in MS67FS plastic by our hosts at least three times (we just moved it into SecurePlus).
Edited to add: It was part of a large group purchase. We made money off what we sold, so effectively, we have $0 in this coin. We have $20 in TrueView, $5 in shipping and $25 in Grading.
The coin in hand has a lot of gold and blue on the obverse and gold, blue and pink on the reverse even when the coin isn't tilted. It has amazing luster. It looks a lot different in hand. The TrueView did this coin a terrible disservice. PCGS has held it at least three times, and all three times it's been graded MS67FS. It has a lot of flow lines on both the obverse and reverse, just like all the MS68 Washingtons in their collections. PCGS must have seen something in this nickel to consistently grade it MS67FS three times?
Here's the link to the Large TrueView image.
I was under the impression the coin was graded MS67+FS......my bad.
I didn't know a 10 year old wanted to know how his coin grades in an open forum. PM your address and I'll send him a nice coin.
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>It's is in a Secure Plus MS67FS holder... do you agree with this grade?
I was under the impression the coin was graded MS67+FS......my bad.
I didn't know a 10 year old wanted to know how his coin grades in an open forum. PM your address and I'll send him a nice coin.
Leo >>
It's part of his Type Set. Daddy (me) wanted to know if the grade was accurate; when I saw the TrueView, I started to question the grade. When I received the coin in hand, the coin looks like an MS67FS. I'm absolutely amazed how much different a "professional" photo can make a coin appear vs. true life. That's why I almost always have to buy coins in person now.
Best of luck with your Type set.
Cheers,
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>It belongs to a 10-year-old... he's happy. That used to be important? We have almost $100 in it, so Daddy's happy too. But if you'd like, I'll "educate" him so he'll stop collecting coins?
Are you saying the coin is homemade? >>
No, to my knowledge it's been wrapped in MS67FS plastic by our hosts at least three times (we just moved it into SecurePlus).
Edited to add: It was part of a large group purchase. We made money off what we sold, so effectively, we have $0 in this coin. We have $20 in TrueView, $5 in shipping and $25 in Grading.
The coin in hand has a lot of gold and blue on the obverse and gold, blue and pink on the reverse even when the coin isn't tilted. It has amazing luster. It looks a lot different in hand. The TrueView did this coin a terrible disservice. PCGS has held it at least three times, and all three times it's been graded MS67FS. It has a lot of flow lines on both the obverse and reverse, just like all the MS68 Washingtons in their collections. PCGS must have seen something in this nickel to consistently grade it MS67FS three times?
Here's the link to the Large TrueView image. >>
If the coin has been graded MS67FS three times, then we can safely conclude that the steps are full. I am more intrigued by the fact that the coin has been resubmitted that many times. While the surfaces, luster, and eye appeal might be PQ MS67, the poor strike is always going make that coin a low end MS67. There are many people who have responded to this thread who believe that the strike should actually limit the grade to either MS65 or MS66. Personally, I think the coin is accurately graded at the MS67 level but would never consider it a candidate for either a "+" designation or a sticker (if CAC ever decides to grade Jeffs).
Again, congrats on a very nice Jefferson, I hope your son loves it!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>It belongs to a 10-year-old... he's happy. That used to be important? We have almost $100 in it, so Daddy's happy too. But if you'd like, I'll "educate" him so he'll stop collecting coins?
Are you saying the coin is homemade? >>
No, to my knowledge it's been wrapped in MS67FS plastic by our hosts at least three times (we just moved it into SecurePlus).
Edited to add: It was part of a large group purchase. We made money off what we sold, so effectively, we have $0 in this coin. We have $20 in TrueView, $5 in shipping and $25 in Grading.
The coin in hand has a lot of gold and blue on the obverse and gold, blue and pink on the reverse even when the coin isn't tilted. It has amazing luster. It looks a lot different in hand. The TrueView did this coin a terrible disservice. PCGS has held it at least three times, and all three times it's been graded MS67FS. It has a lot of flow lines on both the obverse and reverse, just like all the MS68 Washingtons in their collections. PCGS must have seen something in this nickel to consistently grade it MS67FS three times?
Here's the link to the Large TrueView image. >>
If the coin has been graded MS67FS three times, then we can safely conclude that the steps are full. I am more intrigued by the fact that the coin has been resubmitted that many times. While the surfaces, luster, and eye appeal might be PQ MS67, the poor strike is always going make that coin a low end MS67. There are many people who have responded to this thread who believe that the strike should actually limit the grade to either MS65 or MS66. Personally, I think the coin is accurately graded at the MS67 level but would never consider it a candidate for either a "+" designation or a sticker (if CAC ever decides to grade Jeffs).
Again, congrats on a very nice Jefferson, I hope your son loves it! >>
Slabbed twice before us... we've been using our CC vouchers to move everything into SecurePlus slabs and TrueView images.
FWIW, I find it curious that many are trying to micrograde 67 coins based on a picture.
I see a MS 66 Full Step Coin.
Eye Apeal is there hence the 66
The Full Step is there by a squeak,
The 5th step is full and the tick dos'nt
dig in the flow.
The luster, color and die warping reminds me exactly of many BLAZING 1954P Jeffersons I have in my 1954 double mint sets. Those coins have amazing pop and fresh and soft colorful surfaces just like this one. But I've always been of the opinion my 54's would limit out at 65 because of the LDS.