A little help with a gold buffalo purchase (fractional)
racecap97
Posts: 58 ✭✭
First off i'll start with the fact that i'm a currency guy and know little to nothing about coins when compared to most of the people on this board.
I'm planning on purchasing a 1/10oz or 1/4oz gold buffalo fractional coins just to have one because I think they are pretty cool coins. I don't want to jump right in and spend what it would take to get a 1oz, I want to start kinda small and see how it goes. Anyway what are your thoughts about buying one of these in this market? Do these coins tend to fluctuate with gold value or more along their own "collectible" value? I wish I would have bought a few of them 2yrs ago when I was thinking about it then, of course thats easy to say now. Any input is much appreciated, so what say you?
I'm planning on purchasing a 1/10oz or 1/4oz gold buffalo fractional coins just to have one because I think they are pretty cool coins. I don't want to jump right in and spend what it would take to get a 1oz, I want to start kinda small and see how it goes. Anyway what are your thoughts about buying one of these in this market? Do these coins tend to fluctuate with gold value or more along their own "collectible" value? I wish I would have bought a few of them 2yrs ago when I was thinking about it then, of course thats easy to say now. Any input is much appreciated, so what say you?
ALWAYS LOOKING FOR INTERESTING WWII HAWAII NOTES.
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Comments
The fractional gold buffalo coins were made for 1 year only.
They command quite a premium because of that. The overall market for their collectible-ness determines their value right now.
Any year 1oz buffalo will have less of a premium, and will more closely follow the gold price + premium idea.
The big year for mintage was the first year, 2006, for both proof and unc.
The 2010 Proof Buff is still for sale on the mint web site.
Uncirculated Buffs are sold by bullion dealers.
Also, you can also pick up a 1/2oz Buff and a 1/2 oz AGE as the "Double Prosperity Set"
The value of the fractional buffalo gold coins fluctuates based on collector demand. Follow their performance via ebay completed sales to get an idea how much they sell for.
<< <i>Are you looking at proof? unc? burnished?
The fractional gold buffalo coins were made for 1 year only.
They command quite a premium because of that. The overall market for their collectible-ness determines their value right now.
Any year 1oz buffalo will have less of a premium, and will more closely follow the gold price + premium idea.
The big year for mintage was the first year, 2006, for both proof and unc.
The 2010 Proof Buff is still for sale on the mint web site.
Uncirculated Buffs are sold by bullion dealers.
Also, you can also pick up a 1/2oz Buff and a 1/2 oz AGE as the "Double Prosperity Set" >>
I was probably going to try for the proof version. I'm not sure what you mean by burnished? The biggest convern that I had is that I don't want to buy one that is being driven up and down by the price of gold as that is not my interest. I'm more interested in collector value than anything else. I've wanted one of these since they came out but never pulled the trigger. I think i've made up my mind to do it this time. These coins are really neat. Also what is the AGE part of the couble prsperity set?
<< <i>I prefer the 1/4 ounce ($10 denomination) version, in MS, because the size most closely approximates the buffalo nickel.
The value of the fractional buffalo gold coins fluctuates based on collector demand. Follow their performance via ebay completed sales to get an idea how much they sell for. >>
So the 1/4oz is about the size of a nickel, does that mean that the 1/10oz would be about the same size as a dime? I've just started checking ebays completed listings. I figured that I would probably average up 10 or so of the completed auctions and come up with a price i'd like to pay by that. Does that sound reasonable?
Again, since it was a 1 year only thing, they are a lot more collectible.
<< <i>
<< <i>I prefer the 1/4 ounce ($10 denomination) version, in MS, because the size most closely approximates the buffalo nickel.
The value of the fractional buffalo gold coins fluctuates based on collector demand. Follow their performance via ebay completed sales to get an idea how much they sell for. >>
So the 1/4oz is about the size of a nickel, does that mean that the 1/10oz would be about the same size as a dime? >>
A dime is a couple of mm larger.
<< <i> I've just started checking ebays completed listings. I figured that I would probably average up 10 or so of the completed auctions and come up with a price i'd like to pay by that. Does that sound reasonable? >>
Hard to say. I'd wait for a few more people who follow the prices more closely than I do to add their thoughts.
I'd almost rather you "jump in" on a 1oz since those don't have such a high collectibility markup. I'm looking on eBay at certified proof and see the 1/4oz are only a few hundred less than a proof 1oz you get from the mint. However, it's your money and your interest, not mine. If you like them, buy what you like.
Don't forget you can post a WTB on the BST Coin forum.
you might edit in "Fractional" in the title. That might get some people's attention.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I prefer the 1/4 ounce ($10 denomination) version, in MS, because the size most closely approximates the buffalo nickel.
The value of the fractional buffalo gold coins fluctuates based on collector demand. Follow their performance via ebay completed sales to get an idea how much they sell for. >>
So the 1/4oz is about the size of a nickel, does that mean that the 1/10oz would be about the same size as a dime? >>
A dime is a couple of mm larger. >>
That being the case I think i'd like to go with a 1/4 or a 1/2oz instead. I'd like to be able to look at it without squinting my eyes, hahaha. My only reasoning behind staying away from the 1oz was just because they follow the gold price closer than the rest of the sizes do and i'm not convinced that the gold price will stay this high (I don't follow precious metals prices at all). I thought it might be best to go with collectability prices instead because if the price of gold drops huge in 2mo the price drop from a collector standpoint will probably be less than that of the precious metal standpoint.
$10 2010 AGE in Proof 70 First Strike $549
You're paying well over 2x what an American Gold Eagle would sell at.
That's a lot of premium.
One thing to note is they did peak and pull back several months ago.
Which brings us to the 1/2 oz. coins, both of which are the best deal in terms of gold content for the money. These still have a numismatic premium, but because the Uncs are slightly higher mintages (being included in another set as well as the normal offerings), they will always be seen as the "least rare" between the two, in relative terms. I'm not really sure why the 1/2 oz. Proof hasn't picked up much premium over the more common 1/2 oz Unc - which is a bit strange because it's mintage is only 12,169 which is lower than any of the 1/2 oz. Gold American Eagle Proofs going back all the way to the beginning of the American Eagle Program. It may have some potential for appreciation, as it appears to have the lowest built-in premium percentage-wise at this time, and it has no reason not to appreciate numismatically.
The 1 oz. coins are interesting to me for a couple reasons. The key to the whole Gold Buff Series at this point is the Unc. 1 oz. Gold Buff, with a mintage of 9,074 (which is also rarer than the rarest American Gold Eagle, incidently). That fact makes it the lowest mintage 1 oz. gold coin since 1892, technically speaking. So, if you really are looking for the numismatic play that still has the most upside potential, the 1 oz. Burnished Unc 2008-W Gold Buffalo is it, in my opinion.
The 1 oz. Proof Gold Buffalo has about twice the mintage (18,863) of the Unc, but it could be considered the lowest mintage 1 oz. modern issue proof gold coin, which makes it special in its own right. Appearance-wise, the 1 oz. Proof Gold Buffs are stellar, with brilliant hammered fields and frosty devices. Truly beautiful and awesome coins! That is not to say that the Uncs don't have their own appeal, because they do. Some people prefer the look of the Uncs because they look more like the traditional "look" of a gold coin. I prefer the look of the proofs, but I do like them both (alot) in terms of appearances.
You won't find either of the 1 oz. coins cheap, and in fact none of the 2008-W Gold Buffs can be considered cheap. Those days are past, even though prices are a little lower than they were a year ago.
That's my take. Good luck with your decision.
I knew it would happen.
I would really like to pick a 1/10oz Buffalo sooner or later. (for what I saw I can't now afford a bigger size).
jmski52, thank you so much for the detailed post.
Since you are tracking them, what would be a fair price to buy the Buffalos?
Would you mind to give us an idea by size?
Bear in mind that I track about 13 different categories for each coin, so the following data would be an estimate for a nice coin, generally 69 grade or so - and that could either be "in the box", PCGS, NGC or ANACS.
It could also include an NGC-70 vs. a PCGS-69, or it could include a stray coin that is 5% over the max. or 5% under the minimums shown. In truth, the market is "inefficient" and all over the map, which means that if I were buying one of these coins right now, I would wait it out for one of the lower priced ones to appear on ebay or BST and save a few bucks in the process.
The following is based on fuzzy logic estimates and recent ebay auction data:
1/10 oz. Unc - $450 to $550
1/4 oz. Unc - $1,200 to $1,350
1/2 oz. Unc - $1,150 to $1,225
1 oz. Unc -$2,550 to $3,000+
1/10 oz. Proof - $450 to $575
1/4 oz. Proof - $1,200 to $1,350
1/2 oz. Proof - $1,250 to $1,300
1 oz. Proof - $2,900 to $3,200
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Ciccio, I was afraid that would be the next question.
Thank you so much!
The background, current trends, and prices are very helpful! Way to put in the effort and passion.
Miles
My position would be if you can afford to get a 1 oz. unc. in original packaging or MS69 under $3K, just buy it and put it away. In my opinion these have the best long term potential. The 08-W proof 1 oz. still sell for more despite their higher mintage. Once the Unc. version surpasses proof version in price, I think the rate of appreciation will pick up considerably as 'relative rarity' gets priced in more accurately.
Ironically, the LONGER the 1 oz. proof series lasts, the MORE key I believe the 08-W unc. coins will become. If we can get a nice long 10-20 year proof 1 oz. Buff series, the one year type unc. coins are going to really get bid up IMO, especially the 1 oz.
If you can't or don't want to swing that big, the 1/10 oz. uncs. in MS70 or original packaging for around $500 aren't going to get you hurt financially.
That's the way I'm betting anyway, so good luck whichever logic you choose to follow. If you just want the fractional buff. that sells closest to melt, that is the 1/2 oz. unc., but I think it also has the least appreciation potential of the unc. coins.
Greg Hansen, Melbourne, FL Click here for any current EBAY auctions Multiple "Circle of Trust" transactions over 14 years on forum
.....and with coins its always a popularity contest, the $10 is the one this small set will always be known for and take on a heavier numismatic premium. When the bullion guys are gone the collectors will still be around.
<< <i>I was probably going to try for the proof version. I'm not sure what you mean by burnished? The biggest convern that I had is that I don't want to buy one that is being driven up and down by the price of gold as that is not my interest. I'm more interested in collector value than anything else. I've wanted one of these since they came out but never pulled the trigger. I think i've made up my mind to do it this time. These coins are really neat. Also what is the AGE part of the couble prsperity set? >>
Double Prosperity Set