Sad news for exonumia collectors, but a new friend is made
tmot99
Posts: 5,238 ✭✭✭
About 3 years ago, I was contacted by a gentleman who had an original set of dies for a Columbian Expo medal. During his online research, came across my site and asked for some history regarding the medal and then showed me what he had. These are the original dies from Hanson in Chicago that had made numerous medals and tokens for many expos, stores, and trade tokens. His family members worked there for years, some still do, and when Hanson sold off their medal stamping business, they just threw out the dies! In the trash! Fortunately, the family thought they were pretty cool and picked through them and kept some, just a small portion, of what they saw in the trash can. Unfortunately, the majority of the dies that were made by Hanson are long gone in the trash heap along with virtually all mintage records.
I was invited over to his house this weekend to see the one he had from the Columbian Expo and reunite some long lost buddies.
This is the original die pair for Eglit E-35/35A. 57mm medal that came in bronze and white metal.
Here is what the medal looks like in white metal:
And then there is Eglit-231. This is a die trial for the obverse. They are known in white metal and brass. They are also numbered, mine in brass is numbered "1". I suspect that this was the first brass trial, not necessarily the first trial. I would think they would have started with a soft metal of some sort. So these two pieces were reunited for a short period of time yesterday.
It was great to meet my new friend, share some stories, and see some history of some old trade tokens and medals. He has more than what I saw yesterday so I hope that we can get together again some day soon.
I was invited over to his house this weekend to see the one he had from the Columbian Expo and reunite some long lost buddies.
This is the original die pair for Eglit E-35/35A. 57mm medal that came in bronze and white metal.
Here is what the medal looks like in white metal:
And then there is Eglit-231. This is a die trial for the obverse. They are known in white metal and brass. They are also numbered, mine in brass is numbered "1". I suspect that this was the first brass trial, not necessarily the first trial. I would think they would have started with a soft metal of some sort. So these two pieces were reunited for a short period of time yesterday.
It was great to meet my new friend, share some stories, and see some history of some old trade tokens and medals. He has more than what I saw yesterday so I hope that we can get together again some day soon.
0
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Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Why are you hiding the label on the NGC slab? I'd be interested to see what they said. >>
Not hiding it, just didn't need it for the picture. They call it what it is, E-231, brass. Nothing other than that.
Here's the picture of the entire slab:
c'mon, Perry, after a post like this from a guy who routinely updates us on how his collection grows and the what/where/how of everything you should know by now that there's nothing he's hiding, except to keep the anonymity of the sources. BTW, nice score, Tom. you epitomize "specialize" as few at this site have since i've been a member.
Maybe someday NGC could give you a free re-holder to correct their label error. At least to my eyes, that uniface brass medal doesn't look octagonal, but then, I guess I'm a numbers guy.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Cool medals!
Maybe someday NGC could give you a free re-holder to correct their label error. At least to my eyes, that uniface brass medal doesn't look octagonal, but then, I guess I'm a numbers guy.
LMAO. It does surprise me how many errors I end up with on NGC inserts. This is just one that I wasn't concerned enough to resend. Sadly, my error insert rate is worse than 10%!
i have quite a few on medal insets, also. i think it says more about how B.S. is overworked than anything else, although on a couple i mis-attributed stuff on my submission form and they simply followed suit.
<< <i> It does surprise me how many errors I end up with on NGC inserts. This is just one that I wasn't concerned enough to resend. Sadly, my error insert rate is worse than 10%!
i have quite a few on medal insets, also. i think it says more about how B.S. is overworked than anything else, although on a couple i mis-attributed stuff on my submission form and they simply followed suit. >>
Yes he is overworked. They definitely need another exonumia grader.
<< <i>Cool medals!
Maybe someday NGC could give you a free re-holder to correct their label error. At least to my eyes, that uniface brass medal doesn't look octagonal, but then, I guess I'm a numbers guy.
You're right---it's a hexanon. I missed that and I'm an engineer!
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
PCGS Registries
Box of 20
SeaEagleCoins: 11/14/54-4/5/12. Miss you Larry!
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>Is anyone concerned that these dies have never been cancelled and there is nothing to prevent several thousand restrikes from being produced thus destroying the value of the originals? >>
No. I'm sure that Tom didn't even have to approach the subject with the current owner. And if tmot99 becomes the next owner of the dies, I'm confident that won't be a concern then as well.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
<< <i>
<< <i>Is anyone concerned that these dies have never been cancelled and there is nothing to prevent several thousand restrikes from being produced thus destroying the value of the originals? >>
No. I'm sure that Tom didn't even have to approach the subject with the current owner. And if tmot99 becomes the next owner of the dies, I'm confident that won't be a concern then as well. >>
How can you be sure that tmot99 will be the next and LAST owner of these dies?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Coins are overrated. Dies are underrated.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Is anyone concerned that these dies have never been cancelled and there is nothing to prevent several thousand restrikes from being produced thus destroying the value of the originals? >>
No. I'm sure that Tom didn't even have to approach the subject with the current owner. And if tmot99 becomes the next owner of the dies, I'm confident that won't be a concern then as well. >>
How can you be sure that tmot99 will be the next and LAST owner of these dies? >>
Perry, medal stamping companies didn't cancel dies. In fact, many of the smaller size dies were likely reused over and over again. My theory is company XYZ would approach a stamping company such as Hanson and the conversation would go something like:
Company XYZ: I need a token for my company. This is what I want on it.
Stamping Company: Here are the dies that I have available. Which one do you like?
Company XYZ: Awe, this one is really cool! Let's do that one!
And this could be years after an event like the Columbian Expo. This is just theory, but given what I've seen with WCE, it makes sense.
Remember that these are medals and not coins. There was no benefit for them to be canceled. To them, what harm would these dies cause? Simple answer, none.
There are many many medal/token dies out there. I've seen plenty and none of them were canceled. I do know of one person that has some dies for some elongates that has put a marker to designate them as a modern should they ever be used.
<< <i>
<< <i>Cool medals!
Maybe someday NGC could give you a free re-holder to correct their label error. At least to my eyes, that uniface brass medal doesn't look octagonal, but then, I guess I'm a numbers guy.
You're right---it's a hexanon. I missed that and I'm an engineer!
Hey, it's got eight sides! Top, bottom, upper right, lower right, upper left, lower left, front and back!!!!!!!!
<< <i>Is anyone concerned that these dies have never been cancelled and there is nothing to prevent several thousand restrikes from being produced thus destroying the value of the originals? >>
Would you agree with me that not everything that can be struck should be struck?
TD
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