Do you ever get the feeling some Ebay sellers don't really want to sell their cards?
Hallco
Posts: 3,676 ✭✭✭✭✭
I sent an offer on a card that was above current VCP high...above SMR(it's considered a "common"). not a super rare low pop card and I get a response from the seller..."I don't accept anything less than what my price says". I don't think the person will ever sell the card at the price he is asking. It got me wondering why people even have Ebay stores or Bin's if they have the price so high no one is willing to pay it.
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Comments
<< <i> 707 >>
LOL
<< <i>you just noticed this NOW ??? >>
I haven't had much experience with making offers on cards in Ebay stores. I usually just bid on auctions.
<< <i>why people even have Ebay stores or Bin's if they have the price so high no one is willing to pay it. >>
Because someone is willing to pay it. They have time.
707 sells plenty of cards, even though it seems that he does not.
WTB: PSA 1 - PSA 3 Centered, High Eye Appeal 1950's Mantle
<< <i>I sent an offer on a card that was above current VCP high...above SMR(it's considered a "common"). not a super rare low pop card and I get a response from the seller..."I don't accept anything less than what my price says". I don't think the person will ever sell the card at the price he is asking. It got me wondering why people even have Ebay stores or Bin's if they have the price so high no one is willing to pay it. >>
Cuz they're idiots.
With that said, the best way to get them to go lower is to initiate an off-eBay transaction.
Still, I think their prices on vintage and certain other cards are fair. Garbage bin collectors need not apply.
Last 30-days: 707 on EBAY
Items Sold: 416
Sell Thru Rate: 1.8%
Value Listed: $3,552,858.00
Value Sold: $62,801.00
..................
Their STR is higher than some of the "Diamond Sellers."
While they may pay higher listing fees than top tier "Diamond Sellers,"
they likely pay slightly lower FVFs. (Most DS gangs pay no listing fees.)
When combined with their other sales venues, they are doing fine.
The notion that a well/fully capitalized online collectible-biznez has to blow
out merch at "low prices" to make money is TOTALLY false.
High-priced BINs are popular because they are profitable.
.........
John
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
"Molon Labe"
<< <i>Last 30-days: 707 on EBAY
Items Sold: 416
Sell Thru Rate: 1.8%
Value Listed: $3,552,858.00
Value Sold: $62,801.00
......... >>
Thats only an average of $151 a card. Point proven.
<< <i> Thats only an average of $151 a card. Point proven. >>
not sure the point but the cost to list the items on ebay is so low that it makes sense to keep their entire inventory listed. this is why they are there at the prices they want to sell , not what the current market is.
other sellers jsut list items hoping to catch someone who needs something right away or wants a present for someone and is not sure of the price. they may sell 1 item a month but if they sell it for 2-3x the cost it also justifies the low cost of listing items. yepbg is one of them that comes to mind. there is a pack guy I know who was doing a similar thing , every once and a while he would sell a 300 pack for 1000. one time I saw him sell a 2500 pack for 8k. that justifies the strategy even though it is a pain for the other collectors who don;t want to see all the stuff.
best thing to do is filter them from your searches and move on if it bothers you that much
merry christmas everyone
If the final value fee's were lower, I'm pretty sure most sellers would consider lowering their BIN's or be more inclined towards reasonable offers.
Sellers pricing items higher than VCP makes perfect sense.
VCP doesn't reflect the true realized sell prices. They only take
snapshots of regularly listed BIN's and auctions.
VCP doesn't track ebay store BIN's, show sales, private sales, etc...
Until VCP captures these sale prices too, while being a somewhat good gauge on the marketplace, isn't that accurate.
Most smart sellers will have their cards priced above VCP.
Also, if you want to buy a card for less than the BIN price, you should try to arrange the contact outside of ebay. If sellers can save the fee's, they would be more open to taking off 10-15% off of their BIN's.
<< <i>not sure the point but the cost to list the items on ebay is so low that it makes sense to keep their entire inventory listed. >>
Duncan I am not sure of his 'point' either.
I'd love to do 60K a month on ebay.
I wonder how much he does off of ebay
Merry Christmas to all.
<< <i>Bid on my cards!!! I got them at an opening bids lower than VCP average!! Of course, noone bids......I guess everyone would rather see a 99 cent opener, and a $200 card sell for $1.25. >>
This is the same problem I keep running into not just with sportscards but with all items.
Example : list item twice starting bid 24.99 the very least I will take (item value 30 to 40 dollars). one-3 day & one-5 day auction both auctions end with no bids, lost 1.00 in listing fees. get ticked off and list it for 99 cent starting bid no reserve 3 day auction, item sells for 31.27 + S/H. go figure
I have seen this happen at least 10 times to me in the last 3 months, 8 of the 10 auctions ended higher than my original starting bid.
This is why there is more & more BIN's. the full time sellers are either going to quit listing altogether or just go to all Buy it nows with OBO.
2nd example: list a 125 to 175 dollar item start bid 49.99, with 13 hours to go no bids and I get one clown emailing me wow I want the item but your price is steep, I have bid on 3 of your auctions (big deal) and would like this item if you cut the price by 30 to 50% and go off ebay to sell it to me I will take it off your hands, I politely tell him the item usually sells for 110 to 175 and that if it doesn't receive a bid in the next hour or two, I will just cancel the auction, he immediately bids on it LOL. oops forgot to tell him I had 13 people watching the item, item sells for 134 dollars (just needed that 1st bid) of course he doesn't win any of my auctions because all his bids were at my starting bid price of 5 to 10 dollars or 1/2 to 1/3 of real market value. I have since blocked him from bidding on any of my items , just got tired of him emailing me every week on 5 to 10 of my auctions wanting them for 1/2 of my starting bid price telling me my price was steep.
the full time sellers can't continue to list auctions at the least they want, because No One will bid & ebay listing fees add up very quickly when the starting bid is 10.00 or more. Full time sellers can't continue to list 50 to 200 dollar items at 99 cents and watch them sell for 10 cents on the dollar, because unless it is a very rare item or a very high demand superstar, the item will only sell for 10 to 40 % of true market value.
it is a buyers market right now & the low ballers & flea market mentality buyers will only bid on 99 cent auctions or auctions were they think they have a possibility of stealing the item at 5 to 15 cents on the dollar. This also causes part time sellers & some full time sellers to quit selling or not honor the auctions ending price and tell the buyer they are not getting their 200 dollar item for 15.00 dollars or ship an empty package and then refund the buyer.
I applaud sellers like 707 and others like him, because they help keep the market somewhat stable and this ticks off the cheapskate low ballers, who want to steal items. If Ebay would allow sellers to list auction items at any start price for say 10 to 20 cents, I think you would see more quality items and more reasonable prices (close to market value), but when ebay charges:
$25.00-$49.99 - $0.75, $50.00-$199.99 - $1.00, $200.00 or more - $2.00, this limits sellers from listing good quality items thus the reason for so many BINs.
just my 2 cents worth.
<< <i>
<< <i>not sure the point but the cost to list the items on ebay is so low that it makes sense to keep their entire inventory listed. >>
Duncan I am not sure of his 'point' either.
. >>
His average price a card in the last 30 days sold for $151. So that tells me he sells alot of $30-$50 cards like the previous poster does and some $200-$300 cards thus the $151 average. So hes not selling too many of his overpriced Mantles.
one of those times.
not bad, two on one page...
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stop drinking the Hatorade...
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I guess that I'm not understanding your argument here (and others who have commented the same thing). If neither the .99 cent auction route or the BIN route (at the price you want) are bringing the "true market value" of the card, what are you basing your current value on? I'm not disagreeing that current values have dropped, but it seems to me that "true market value" is the average price you can get for a card selling it today. There are tons of smart card buyers who use eBay (most buyers? most of us I would think?) - if a card repeatedly sells on eBay for $10, even if it used to consistently sell for $100, isn't $10 the actual true market value? If that card was such a steal at $10, wouldn't folks like yourself/all of us be bidding the price up trying to grab all of the great deals? I guess your position is that the cards you're referring to are simply undervalued in today's marketplace? Even so, the "true market value" would still be the $10 or whatever, and perhaps the future value might be the $100 or so. It just seems to me that the 10 to 40% of true market value is really the current value of a lot of cards now, same with folks who might have paid X for their house 5 yrs ago. The good thing for card sellers is that hopefully its easier to sit on your inventory while waiting/hoping for price increases than it is with real estate.
<< <i>If neither the .99 cent auction route or the BIN route (at the price you want) are bringing the "true market value" of the card, what are you basing your current value on? I'm not disagreeing that current values have dropped, but it seems to me that "true market value" is the average price you can get for a card selling it today. There are tons of smart card buyers who use eBay (most buyers? most of us I would think?) - if a card repeatedly sells on eBay for $10, even if it used to consistently sell for $100, isn't $10 the actual true market value? If that card was such a steal at $10, wouldn't folks like yourself/all of us be bidding the price up trying to grab all of the great deals? I guess your position is that the cards you're referring to are simply undervalued in today's marketplace? Even so, the "true market value" would still be the $10 or whatever, and perhaps the future value might be the $100 or so. It just seems to me that the 10 to 40% of true market value is really the current value of a lot of cards now, same with folks who might have paid X for their house 5 yrs ago. The good thing for card sellers is that hopefully its easier to sit on your inventory while waiting/hoping for price increases than it is with real estate. >>
I'm not 100% sure what diamondman meant, but I can share my interpretation of what he said.
It's a complicated issue, and there are several factors in play that all contribute to the deflation of card values across the board, especially when dealing with the ebay system. Comparing the card and memorabilia market to real estate is comparing apples and oranges, because the factors that affect the respective markets are totally different.
In any non-reserve ebay auction that has at least two bidders, the final selling price is determined by the second-most interested party, not the buyer or seller. This significantly reduces the seller's ability to get maximum value out of most items. This is one reason why many sellers have moved to fixed price listings.
Let's say there's a card that 10 sellers are all offering for $50 in a BIN listing. Over the course of 6 months, maybe 3 of 10 will sell at that price. Over the same period of time, 4 other sellers list the same card in auction format starting at 99 cents, and the average final bid of these 10 auctions is $32, with a low of $19 and a high of $41. These 99-cent auctions are relatively infrequent, and it's never possible to predict when the next one will be available. So by your definition, the price someone can BUY this card at today is $50, but the price someone can SELL it at might only be $33. Which is the true "market value?" And perhaps more importantly, why is there such a large discrepancy between the two numbers?
I think that was kind of the point diamondman was getting at. The insertion fees for auctions starting above $9.99 make it cost-prohibitive for sellers to list the card in my example using an auction format with a starting price of $38 or $40, since the listing only lasts for 7 days and there's a significant chance it won't get any bids.
Or, to simplify even further, ebay's 99-cent auctions constantly undermine the effectiveness of fixed price listings. If the knuckleheads who run ebay had two brain cells to rub together, they'd decrease auction-style insertion fees and increase bid increments, especially for low-priced items. The 5-cent bid increment on a $1.50 item is a total joke. If they'd help swing the pendulum the other way and create more of a seller's market, final bidding prices would go up, and this would lead to higher final value fees, helping ebay's bottom line. Too bad they're too dumb to realize this.
If it was some Nolan Ryan card from the 70s in GEM MINT 10, perhaps that can command a high premium ala 707. If a card is rare enough, an inflated price will eventualy attract someone.
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<< <i>I wish some sellers would quit cluttering ebay with ridiculously high BIN prices that wont ever sell. >>
fwiw you can always search auctions only, then you can complain the some sellers are cluttering ebay with ridiculously high starting prices that wont ever sell
just a thought
I search ONLY by auction. Sometimes I will not see the cards i am looking for at auction and there will be many overpriced BIN's for those cards instead. That is fine, I will wait. Let the cards rot at ridiculous BIN prices, if the 'sellers' want to keep them. I'll pay fair market price, if the 'sellers' want to be sellers and actually sell the card at auction
good for everyday searches John, but there could be some BIN with Best offers you can miss so search those too every now and then
VCP doesn't track ebay store BIN's, show sales, private sales, etc
and most buyer, though educated enough to pay for a vcp subscription dont realize average means just that, ALL sales are higher or lower based on a varying degree of items. Also, they neglect to see shipping charges from closed auctions. Although it might be a matter of 5-10 bucks it could be a large percentage of the cards value. I think it is a great tool and vital for a serious collector. I recently saw a new set I liked and had no idea where to even start as far as pricing, aside from completed items.
<< <i>"Full time sellers can't continue to list 50 to 200 dollar items at 99 cents and watch them sell for 10 cents on the dollar, because unless it is a very rare item or a very high demand superstar, the item will only sell for 10 to 40 % of true market value."
I guess that I'm not understanding your argument here (and others who have commented the same thing). If neither the .99 cent auction route or the BIN route (at the price you want) are bringing the "true market value" of the card, what are you basing your current value on? I'm not disagreeing that current values have dropped, but it seems to me that "true market value" is the average price you can get for a card selling it today. There are tons of smart card buyers who use eBay (most buyers? most of us I would think?) - if a card repeatedly sells on eBay for $10, even if it used to consistently sell for $100, isn't $10 the actual true market value? If that card was such a steal at $10, wouldn't folks like yourself/all of us be bidding the price up trying to grab all of the great deals? I guess your position is that the cards you're referring to are simply undervalued in today's marketplace? Even so, the "true market value" would still be the $10 or whatever, and perhaps the future value might be the $100 or so. It just seems to me that the 10 to 40% of true market value is really the current value of a lot of cards now, same with folks who might have paid X for their house 5 yrs ago. The good thing for card sellers is that hopefully its easier to sit on your inventory while waiting/hoping for price increases than it is with real estate. >>
I wasn't referring to sports cards only ( i was talking about ebay overall), there are some items that have a value of say 50 to 100 dollars, but there is probably only 1 to 4 people even looking for that item, so listing it in a 99 cent auction format is foolish for the seller. Ebay makes it cost-prohibitive with there auction listing fee structure for sellers to list these in auction format (10.00 or higher) and BIN format ebay gets 12% of FVF so sellers have to raise their price to compensate for that and as stated here a lot of buyers only look for items in auction format.
as I stated earlier I listed 10 items over the last 3 months starting bid 24.99 all 10 ended with no bid, relist at 99 cent auction and 8 out of 10 end up over 24.99 the other 2 ended at 21 to 24 dollars, so I think I was pretty accurate in thinking true market value was at least 24.99. One of these 10 auctions starting at 24.99 had 12 watchers and no one bid when relisted in 99 cent auction format it sold for 47 and some change. It just amazes me the mentality of some buyers that if it doesn't start at 99 cents it isn't worth bidding on.
There are items that are so rare or obscure or just very little demand for,that the 99 cent auction format would be insane to use.
this doesn't mean the item is worthless or the true market value is 99 cents, true market value is very complicated, unless you are talking about a very high in demand item that is traded or sold on regular basis.
Example : 1955 Topps #117 Joe blow common PSA 8, my guess is market value is 30 to 75 dollars. There might be only 1 to 4 people looking for this card, so listing in the 99 cent format could be disastrous for the seller especially if it sells for 99 cents, but if the seller could list this for 10 cents starting bid 29.99, then maybe he would list a lot more items in auction format.
so if the 1955 Topps PSA 8 # 117 Joe Common sells for 99 cents does that make 99 cents the true market value? I think Not.
Another example of ebay insanity and my own insanity: had a antique 14K gold watch, the gold alone would scrap for $146.00 if I wanted to destroy the watch by removing the watch,crystal and watchband and have the watch case melted, I also stated in my auctions what the gold would scrap for? listed the watch 6 times. starting bid was :
149.99 on 2 auctions ,139.99 on 2 auctions,,129.99 on 1 auction,,124.99 on 1 auction
the watch never sold, did have 1 offer of 85.00 LOL.
Now based on these 6 auctions market value is less than 124.99 or 85.00 I guess?
Took hammer smashed crystal, threw watch away, kept the wristband and had the watch case melted, gold had went up a little, so took the watch case to local dealer and sold it to him for $151.13. I just hated to see an antique destroyed and would have gladly took 125 to 140 for the watch to have stayed intact, but I wasn't going to gamble it away on a 99 cent auction to determine ebay true market value LOL. thus the reason for the statement: "Full time sellers can't continue to list 50 to 200 dollar items at 99 cents and watch them sell for 10 cents on the dollar".
If Ebay would return to the old format of list any item in auction format at any start price for say 10 to 20 cents per auction, you would see more quality and hard to find items in all categories.
I wasn't really arguing with anyone just making a statement and agreeing with bobbyw8469.jmho
Diamondman isn't sure what he meant either,
diamondman is mentality unstable and crazy.
Or, to simplify even further, ebay's 99-cent auctions constantly undermine the effectiveness of fixed price listings. If the knuckleheads who run ebay had two brain cells to rub together, they'd decrease auction-style insertion fees and increase bid increments, especially for low-priced items. The 5-cent bid increment on a $1.50 item is a total joke. If they'd help swing the pendulum the other way and create more of a seller's market, final bidding prices would go up, and this would lead to higher final value fees, helping ebay's bottom line. Too bad they're too dumb to realize this. >>
Crazymind2017: Thanks for the interpretation and the help.
<< <i>Diamondman isn't sure what he meant either,
diamondman is mentality unstable and crazy. >>
Just like CrazyMind2017!
To do that, I had to develop patience. I decided (thanks in no small part to members of this forum) that it is more important to get what I want out of a card than to sell it quickly.
I still put a small % of my cards on auction, if the demand for that particular card is very high and there's a potential bidding war.
Otherwise, they go in my store at a BIN that I can live with. And if it takes 6 months to sell, so be it.
I gotta say, this way brings far more peace of mind to me as a seller. I no longer need to worry that any of my cards will slide through on ridiculously low prices.
"Well, if you aren't going to accept an offer of $5 on a $5.50 BIN, why have the Make Offer up there?
I've had that happen to me several times, just strange.
I typically, dont find these threads worth replying to. There are a few million sport cards on eBay. However, I thought I would share my example. There is a card on eBay I want. It is numbered to 30 as a graded series, and the card itself is numbered to 75. The player is Jake Plummer and the card is graded BGS 8.5. I can not get the seller to go any lower then the $25 they want.
I am pretty sure I am the only one that collects this set, and if in auction, it might or would likely go for its $.99 starting bid, or if I did not bid, might not sell at all. Most likely see it as a low grade Plummer card. I offered $15, and then $20 and no dice. Anything over $10 and I am being taken...although willingly, still....I am not paying $25 plus shipping for it.
Raw: Tony Gonzalez (low #'d cards, and especially 1/1's) and Steve Young.
This may simply be evidence that a lot of eBay buyers:
1) don't like being told they must bid at least $XX.XX on an item because in their mind it eliminates the potential of getting a "good deal" (especially where they have no idea what an item's market value is)
2) see an item with a starting bid of $X and no bids as probably overpriced
"Molon Labe"
<< <i>BIN"s are the present and future. No more "bargains" for bottom feeders on good cards. chaz >>
IF YOU GO INTO A CAR DEALERSHIP AND OFFER LESS THAN STICKER PRICE FOR THE CAR, DOES THAT MEAN YOU ARE A "BOTTOM FEEDER"? IF NOT, THEN WHY DOES SOMEONE TRYING TO PURCHASE A CARD FOR AS LOW AS HE CAN GET IT A "BOTTOM FEEDER"? IS IT NOT HUMAN NATURE TO PURCHASE MERCHANDISE FOR AS LOW AS POSSIBLE? OR SHOULD WE ALWAYS PAY RETAIL?
<< <i>
<< <i>BIN"s are the present and future. No more "bargains" for bottom feeders on good cards. chaz >>
IF YOU GO INTO A CAR DEALERSHIP AND OFFER LESS THAN STICKER PRICE FOR THE CAR, DOES THAT MEAN YOU ARE A "BOTTOM FEEDER"? IF NOT, THEN WHY DOES SOMEONE TRYING TO PURCHASE A CARD FOR AS LOW AS HE CAN GET IT A "BOTTOM FEEDER"? IS IT NOT HUMAN NATURE TO PURCHASE MERCHANDISE FOR AS LOW AS POSSIBLE? OR SHOULD WE ALWAYS PAY RETAIL? >>
Working on the following: 1970 Baseball PSA, 1970-1976 Raw, World Series Subsets PSA, 1969 Expansion Teams PSA, Fleer World Series Sets, Texas Rangers Topps Run 1972-1989
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The issue some people can't handle is when the "low as possible" price they want to pay is less than what the seller will accept. The dealership folks aren't being rich and greedy jerks if they don't take your offer. They make nothing if they don't sell you a car, but they won't sell the car for less than they want. Nothing personal, just business.