E-Bay Buyer to be Aware Of

segoja · November 1, 2010 4:05AM

Guy buys a 1909-S VDB Cent PCGS MS64RB+ for $3200. (a nice no problem coin) see link. Link to Auction

Pays immediately with Paypal. I ship immediately with registered Mail with Signature Confirmation. E-mail him the tracking info. All same day he paid.

E-Mails me after 7 days (1 weekend day + 1 holiday) and tells me registered mail only takes 2-3 days, where is the package and how come it hasn't shipped. I faxed him the tracking number, e-mailed it to him and sent it again with the E-Bay system. Doesn't work. He files a dispute. OK Poof goes $3200 even though I have documentation. At that stage it had not been delivered.

A few days later it's delivered, but takes another 5 days for E-Bay to resolve the matter....several phones calls and e-mails on my part.

Guy says I've misdescribed the coin (my title said RD instead of RB....my mistake, even though the coin slab shows RB and the description shows RB). I offer a full refund, and he says no problem, the coin is really red, I'll keep it (all documented in e-bay mail). Case is finally closed around 10/15.

Well today he files a paypal dispute, item not as described. Won't answer the phone nor e-mails, so I have no clue what is up.

My guess is the guy tried to sell the coin, couldn't and now decides he wants his money back, even though the return period is long up.

I'm not saying block the guy, but if you want to go thru this type of hassle, keep him on your open list. woodstocck69

customroll · November 1, 2010 4:43AM

Ebay certainly is a moron magnet.
I think your guess as to what he did is most probably correct.
At least he gave you positive feedback. LOL

segoja · November 1, 2010 4:49AM

You're right about the feedback....doesn't help when they file a dispute with Paypal.

BlindedByEgo · November 1, 2010 4:55AM

<< Ebay certainly is a moron magnet.
>>

Truer words never spoken.

Wobbler on the blockage, but I'm doing it - one less possible annoyance.

boucharda · November 1, 2010 4:59AM

Is he really woodstocck69 with 2 c's ??

jm8787 · November 1, 2010 5:13AM

Woodstock's negs

airplanenut · November 1, 2010 5:15AM

With PayPal, it will depend on what he said, but I'd reply matter-of-factly pointing out emails where he said he'd keep the coin, the positive feedback (you can note that it was left after he received the item, so it's not like he left it prematurely), and that he had ample time to return it within the return period if he hadn't been happy. You may also want to call PayPal/eBay to see if they can directly access the emails in the system, just so it takes a bit of the possibility for the he-said she-said argument to be levied.

segoja · November 1, 2010 5:24AM

Jeremy,

Been on the phone with Paypal. The person would not make any commitments. They said they can't see the e-bay mail, but they thought whomever the investigator was could see it.

Bottom line, I'll end up losing this because I screwed up the title, even though the description is clear and the coin's picture is clear.

Just kind of sucks the guy won't pick the phone up when I call him. Now we have to wait another 30 days, and then we'll see what he sends me back.

So I'm out my $3200 coin + the funds for 30 days becasue of a typo!

You never know who bids on your coins. I got the lucky draw with a moron this time around.

segoja · November 1, 2010 5:31AM

Yes woodstocck69 with 2 cc's

bushmaster8 · November 1, 2010 5:45AM

blockaded.

BTW- I'll take all those silver IKES at $6/ea now.

CoinCrazyPA · November 1, 2010 5:49AM

Plus the worry he even sends the coin that you sent back, has happened in the past.

segoja · November 1, 2010 5:54AM

Coin Crazy In PA. I asked that question of Paypal. They said you have to open the package and then file a complaint. I said who should I open the package up infornt of....the post master, the cops and or film it. She said none of that matters.

It's his word against mine.

Airplanenut knowns this first hand

I'm not sure where to turn.....but Notwilight and I will talk today.

Given this guys other feedback, it's pretty clear he is playing some kind of game.

ldhair · November 1, 2010 6:06AM

He is selling an MS-61 on Ebay.

dsessom · November 1, 2010 6:07AM

Blocked. I hope it gets resolved for you. I wouldn't be comfortable selling a high-end coin like that on Ebay. I only buy there mostly anymore.

messydesk · November 1, 2010 6:10AM

Embargo expanded.

How you open the returned package doesn't matter to PayPal, but it might matter to postal inspectors or anyone you may need to get involved in the law enforcement community. Having a credible witness that can vouch for what you received from the buyer is better than not having one. I would draft something that you can take with you that such a witness can sign attesting that the coin received is not the one shown in the original auction (of course, you'll need to take a printout of that with you).

segoja · November 1, 2010 6:47AM

His MS61 09-S VDB has a typo in the description.

It says graded by NCS, not NGC.

HMMMMM

GRANDAM · November 1, 2010 6:54AM

James,

Send a couple of "Good Old Chicago Boys" to pay him a visit.

GrandAm

fastfreddie · November 1, 2010 7:08AM

<< Embargo expanded.

How you open the returned package doesn't matter to PayPal, but it might matter to postal inspectors or anyone you may need to get involved in the law enforcement community. Having a credible witness that can vouch for what you received from the buyer is better than not having one. I would draft something that you can take with you that such a witness can sign attesting that the coin received is not the one shown in the original auction (of course, you'll need to take a printout of that with you). >>

I once had a postal worker witness my opening of the package and verification of it's contents.

giorgio11 · November 1, 2010 7:16AM

I blocked him too, good luck James

airplanenut · November 1, 2010 7:21AM

<< I once had a postal worker witness my opening of the package and verification of it's contents. >>

I did that, too. Got a photocopy of the package and contents signed and postmarked. And PayPal still didn't give a hoot that the contents were a silver eagle instead of a platinum one.

segoja · November 1, 2010 7:32AM

Now the buyer sends me another e-bay note.

He says:

My wife was completely disappointed with her birthday present. She was expecting a red coin and got a red brown, even though the buyer told me he thought the coin was a red coin in hand. What BS. Of course that is 17 days AFTER he said he'd keep the coin.

Then he goes on to ask me for my help in clearing up the problem.

messydesk · November 1, 2010 9:18AM

<< 

<< I once had a postal worker witness my opening of the package and verification of it's contents. >>

I did that, too. Got a photocopy of the package and contents signed and postmarked. And PayPal still didn't give a hoot that the contents were a silver eagle instead of a platinum one. >>

As I said, PayPal may not care, but by now, you'd be contacting law enforcement, instead, and they'd find this more interesting.

Russ · November 1, 2010 9:47AM

It's ridiculous that a buyer can file an INR claim and then, when that is denied, turn around and file a SNAD claim. It should be obvious to PayPal that it's a game, and these dirtbags should get only one bite at the apple.

Blocked.

Russ, NCNE

SUMORADA · November 1, 2010 10:07AM

Blocked, thanks for the heads up...

customroll · November 1, 2010 10:11AM

James, his SNAD claim should be rejected. You described the coin as Red & Brown in your description and the photos show the same. Your title says RD, but RD is not saying RED. RD could mean anything you say it means. You can play his game too if you so desire.
In all your communications about the case, be sure to say you never called the coin RED!

coinguy1 · November 1, 2010 10:22AM

<< James, his SNAD claim should be rejected. You described the coin as Red & Brown in your description and the photos show the same. Your title says RD, but RD is not saying RED. RD could mean anything you say it means. You can play his game too if you so desire.
In all your communications about the case, be sure to say you never called the coin RED! >>

If you want to claim that the "RD" in the title doesn't really mean "RD", it should probably be considered keyword spamming and/or misleading. James has much stronger points in his favor than playing games with an honest mistake in his listing title.

relicsncoins · November 1, 2010 10:23AM

<< Now the buyer sends me another e-bay note.

He says:

My wife was completely disappointed with her birthday present. She was expecting a red coin and got a red brown, even though the buyer told me he thought the coin was a red coin in hand. What BS. Of course that is 17 days AFTER he said he'd keep the coin.

Then he goes on to ask me for my help in clearing up the problem. >>

Translation: "My wife is completely pi$$ed off that I spent over 3 grand on a coin without telling her. She says that she will leave me if I don't return the coin for a refund. I'm sorry that I'm an underfunded schmuck and living beyond my means. I would really appreciate it if you would help me out of this mess that I got myself into."

customroll · November 1, 2010 10:28AM

<< 

<< James, his SNAD claim should be rejected. You described the coin as Red & Brown in your description and the photos show the same. Your title says RD, but RD is not saying RED. RD could mean anything you say it means. You can play his game too if you so desire.
In all your communications about the case, be sure to say you never called the coin RED! >>

If you want to claim that the "RD" in the title doesn't really mean "RD", it should probably be considered keyword spamming and/or misleading. James has much stronger points in his favor than playing games with an honest mistake in his listing title. >>

Yeah, you're right Mark. It just pi$$ed me off when I see scammers like this guy
I know James (he just doesn't know who I really am on this board) . He is a straight up guy that doesn't deserve what he is getting right now.

MFH · November 1, 2010 10:29AM

Sorry to ask... but... what's the link to Block bidders on EBay ???

customroll · November 1, 2010 10:33AM

Here ya go:

Link

coinguy1 · November 1, 2010 10:35AM

<< 

<< 

<< James, his SNAD claim should be rejected. You described the coin as Red & Brown in your description and the photos show the same. Your title says RD, but RD is not saying RED. RD could mean anything you say it means. You can play his game too if you so desire.
In all your communications about the case, be sure to say you never called the coin RED! >>

If you want to claim that the "RD" in the title doesn't really mean "RD", it should probably be considered keyword spamming and/or misleading. James has much stronger points in his favor than playing games with an honest mistake in his listing title. >>

Yeah, you're right Mark. It just pi$$ed me off when I see scammers like this guy
I know James (he just doesn't know who I really am on this board) . He is a straight up guy that doesn't deserve what he is getting right now. >>

Don't get me wrong - I'm mad too and think/hope that James will deservedly prevail when all is said and done.

customroll · November 1, 2010 10:36AM

Hope you're right Mark. I'm pulling for him.

messydesk · November 1, 2010 11:19AM

<< My wife was completely disappointed with her birthday present. She was expecting a red coin and got a red brown, even though the buyer told me he thought the coin was a red coin in hand. What BS. Of course that is 17 days AFTER he said he'd keep the coin. >>

Sounds like he and his wife deserve each other. Maybe she'll file a SNAD with her mother-in-law.

Wolf359 · November 1, 2010 12:00PM

97.5% Feedback. Member for a year. Too much of a problem child for me. Blocked.

notwilight · November 1, 2010 12:01PM

Paypal is very rule driven. I think James will likely prevail but there is a small chance that Paypal will focus on the typo. At least with Paypal they will make sure you get the coin back. --Jerry

Rampage · November 1, 2010 12:04PM

James, if you check out his bidding history, you will note he has bid on and won several 1909S VDBs recently. One to note in particular is the PCGS MS64RED that he won for $2600. Maybe he thought he did not get such a good deal with your and wanted to return it. I am not backing this bidder, but it was a simple observation that made me think maybe he had buyer's remorse. I do, however, wonder if he has kept or will return all the others he has purchased.

segoja · November 1, 2010 12:22PM

Thanks Rampage!!!

I see he is such a good husband that he has bought 6 yes SIX 6 1909-S VDB's (all uncs) in the last 2 weeks (including mine).

I wish my wife was that good to me!!!

customroll · November 1, 2010 12:29PM

What makes you guys think eBay moron is married?
Just because he says so?? LOL

sinin1 · November 1, 2010 12:38PM

the scam side has turned in favor of the buyer

you will get something back, hopefully it is the coin you sent them

CoinCrazyPA · November 1, 2010 12:57PM

<< Coin Crazy In PA. I asked that question of Paypal. They said you have to open the package and then file a complaint. I said who should I open the package up infornt of....the post master, the cops and or film it. She said none of that matters.

It's his word against mine.

Airplanenut knowns this first hand

I'm not sure where to turn.....but Notwilight and I will talk today.

Given this guys other feedback, it's pretty clear he is playing some kind of game. >>

You are right, there are some past threads about this. I think one person suggested opening it in front of a postal worker with a video camera taping it.

Mar327 · November 1, 2010 2:31PM

<< James, his SNAD claim should be rejected. You described the coin as Red & Brown in your description and the photos show the same. Your title says RD, but RD is not saying RED. RD could mean anything you say it means. You can play his game too if you so desire.
In all your communications about the case, be sure to say you never called the coin RED! >>

Maybe RD meant "Read Description". If I had a dollar for every typo or wrong price I've put in an auction... well I couldn't retire but maybe I'd have a few extra crab legs at dinner. There's only one perfect person but I haven't seen Jesus listing in eBay.

Sorry this happened to you; I think you're getting some good advise. Keep a level head and don't get him PO'd with you, keep it business-like and stay calm.

segoja · November 1, 2010 10:34PM

I sent the other sellers of the 09-S VDB a note seeing if they had problems with this seller.

One sent me a note back.....you guessed it.....returns, then filed complaints.

bushmaster8 · November 1, 2010 10:45PM

How about it! But the fact that he has done this repeatedly will likely have little or no influence on the dispute in Paypud's eyes.

Being part of the Ebay Family, they will have their requisite blinders firmly on.

Woodstocck69! Oh yeah! That's the hippie spirit alright! Peace, Love, and Fraud!

segoja · November 1, 2010 11:34PM

Second seller's response

He took 5 days to fund paypal, and then filed shipping dispute when item shipped USPS didn't arrive on 3rd day after funding. Then decided( without looking at it) to return the coin

Now we have a pattern....3 coins, same MO

segoja · November 2, 2010 8:02AM

Third Sellers Response!

Unbelievable! He reveresed his PayPal payment before he got the coin. This guy is a real jerk, what can we do to cause him some "grief". I just hope he doen't steal my coin? Thanks for the heads up

customroll · November 2, 2010 8:09AM

James, can you pass these other sellers remarks along to PP & eBay to further your case, or will the idiots even listen?

Griv · November 2, 2010 8:16AM

Dang! He paid 32,000 times what the cent first went for. That's why nickels are 5 times better than cents.

airplanenut · November 2, 2010 10:14AM

<< Third Sellers Response!

Unbelievable! He reveresed his PayPal payment before he got the coin. This guy is a real jerk, what can we do to cause him some "grief". I just hope he doen't steal my coin? Thanks for the heads up >>

If he plays any games with the returns, local law enforcement may have more fun if you have multiple people making the same verifiable complaints. Plus, the value jumps dramatically from just your coin to many if he is truly being a thief rather than annoying PITA.

lkeigwin · November 2, 2010 11:48AM

Blocked. Thanks for the heads-up and sorry about the trouble.

I think you would do much better with improved images. Take advantage of the talent here before you re-list it.
Lance.

derryb · November 2, 2010 11:16PM

In any dispute, Ebay's first order of business is a review of all messages between the two parties. It is important thay you always keep this in mind when communicating with the other party through ebay messaging. Also keep in mind that messages between the two of you BEFORE there is a problem are also reviewed by Ebay. When it comes down to your word against that of the other party the professionlism and detail shown in your messages will carry great weight. I have learned this from first hand experience.

segoja · November 2, 2010 11:59PM

UPDATE

Looks like Paypal found in my favor.....reason buyer says we reached an amicable solution.

Strange since we never communicated after he filed his last complaint, other than saying we need to let the paypal process take it's course!

I'm still not sure if this buyer is trying to steal something or not. He is really being more of a PITA than anything else.

E-Bay Buyer to be Aware Of

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