<< <i>why is it this man is applauded for paying 4X PCGS guide for a coin such as this ,
and yet when I do no different with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
I get batted around like a step child ? >>
Why is it that in order to try to make your point, you presented an incorrect set of facts? >>
as usual , you are correct Sir !
how about:
Why is it this person is commended ( by knowledgeable and respected experts ) for paying multiples of PCGS Guide for this coin ,
and yet when I do similarly with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
the disrespectful and naive infer that I am a loon ? >>
That was better, but.....
Some posters congratulated him, while others, to put it nicely, were far less respectful.
Would you be so kind as to link a thread where you were treated the way you stated? Perhaps you exaggerated about your treatment, as you exaggerated in this thread.
Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar.
<< <i>why is it this man is applauded for paying 4X PCGS guide for a coin such as this ,
and yet when I do no different with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
I get batted around like a step child ? >>
Why is it that in order to try to make your point, you presented an incorrect set of facts? >>
as usual , you are correct Sir !
how about:
Why is it this person is commended ( by knowledgeable and respected experts ) for paying multiples of PCGS Guide for this coin ,
and yet when I do similarly with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
the disrespectful and naive infer that I am a loon ? >>
That was better, but.....
Some posters congratulated him, while others, to put it nicely, were far less respectful.
Would you be so kind as to link a thread where you were treated the way you stated? Perhaps you exaggerated about your treatment, as you exaggerated in this thread. >>
Guilty ............I was embellishing , and stooped to using figures of speech to portray my feelings of being made to look foolish for paying too much for coins .
<< <i>Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar. >>
I believe another of the bidders just "secreted" to us that it was. Was this a GSA coin?
<< <i>...Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar. >>
Welcome to another thread about another of your great coins, Bryan.
Another poster wrote << I'll tell everyone a little secret I knew about the coin: it was from Legends Sonnier Collection. >>
I was pretty sure that piece had been in my collection for many years though it looks a lot darker in the photo than in person. Don't recall where I picked it up though I'm confident I didn't pay and arm and a leg for it. Sounds like the new buyer is really happy with the coin and that pleases me. In the end, that's what collecting is all about.
I was pretty sure that piece had been in my collection for many years though it looks a lot darker in the photo than in person. Don't recall where I picked it up though I'm confident I didn't pay and arm and a leg for it. Sounds like the new buyer is really happy with the coin and that pleases me. In the end, that's what collecting is all about. >>
It is, indeed, quite a bit darker (and less beautiful) in the image than in person.
<< <i>Some people just pay stupid money for silly coins. This thread is a perfect example. >>
I believe another bidder on it just opened the door so to speak for the implication that it may have been a bustout from a GSA slab. If that's the case, which, I'll admit, I still don't know, as yet, it should explain the toning. Very pretty, BTW; don't you agree?
Threads like this sum up my feeling on toned coins pretty well. I would be hesitant to collect anything that produces a level of animosity and miss trust that only maintains its liquidity at the whims of a ever changing market standard and certification process, at best it would be hard to keep up. While my chosen field draws lots of fear and the end of the day it comes down to real or fake with mine, that seams to be a moving target with toners.
<< <i>Threads like this sum up my feeling on toned coins pretty well. I would be hesitant to collect anything that produces a level of animosity and miss trust that only maintains its liquidity at the whims of a ever changing market standard and certification process, at best it would be hard to keep up. While my chosen field draws lots of fear and the end of the day it comes down to real or fake with mine, that seams to be a moving target with toners. >>
Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun.
I'm sure I was called crazy a thousand times for stepping up and paying what others thought was stupid money for coins I wanted for my collection, but I didn't care. As for the issue of liquidity, as it turns out, my collecting habits proved profitable in the long run, but that was never my primary objective for collecting.
In all honesty, I never viewed my coins as investments. That's why God created stocks and bonds.
RE: The auction photo: (1) My concern about the noise in front of Liberty was for naught. I find it tough to position the coin to duplicate the level of noise shown in the Heritage photo. (2) The photo does not show the 'red river' flowing from the right side of the lower red band, along the bottom of Liberty's hair, and finishing in two tributaries through each of the eights. What a treat to behold. (3) Although not mentioned in my treatise about the purchase strategy, I typically open the large image on the Heritage website, crop the photo and shoot it to an 11x17 sheet on the color printer to get an ultra closeup of the coin - I know it is totally unfair to the coin to have this kind of blowup, but I must see it. Some of the 'warts' shown in this unfair photo do not manifest themselves whatsoever on the inhand coin. (4) The depth of the colors in a normal, sunlit room are so, so much deeper. If I go outside and look at the coin in the bright sunlight, the colors are somewhat washed out. Under my florescent desklight, the colors appear muted as in the Heritage photo. (5) The reverse is quite nice as well. What looked like darker brown complementing the gold rim toning in the photo are in fact a light blue - another pleasant surprise.
Mark Feld/coinguy1 and soty27 opinions on the inhand quality of the coin were right as rain.
I'm immensely delighted with the dollar.
I will now snap some pictures and learn how to post them. Please bear with me - when I was going to school a 'computer' was termed a 'slide rule' and adding machines weighed approximately 20 pounds.
RE: The auction photo: (1) My concern about the noise in front of Liberty was for naught. I find it tough to position the coin to duplicate the level of noise shown in the Heritage photo. (2) The photo does not show the 'red river' flowing from the right side of the lower red band, along the bottom of Liberty's hair, and finishing in two tributaries through each of the eights. What a treat to behold. (3) Although not mentioned in my treatise about the purchase strategy, I typically open the large image on the Heritage website, crop the photo and shoot it to an 11x17 sheet on the color printer to get an ultra closeup of the coin - I know it is totally unfair to the coin to have this kind of blowup, but I must see it. Some of the 'warts' shown in this unfair photo do not manifest themselves whatsoever on the inhand coin. (4) The depth of the colors in a normal, sunlit room are so, so much deeper. If I go outside and look at the coin in the bright sunlight, the colors are somewhat washed out. Under my florescent desklight, the colors appear muted as in the Heritage photo. (5) The reverse is quite nice as well. What looked like darker brown complementing the gold rim toning in the photo are in fact a light blue - another pleasant surprise.
Mark Feld/coinguy1 and soty27 opinions on the inhand quality of the coin were right as rain.
I'm immensely delighted with the dollar.
I will now snap some pictures and learn how to post them. Please bear with me - when I was going to school a 'computer' was termed a 'slide rule' and adding machines weighed approximately 20 pounds. >>
Although a bit dark I like the room lit photo's best as I can get a good feel for the color and luster...where as the white balance is way off in the first set of image and the sunlight pictures wash out the color. It looks like a very nice coin and certainly the price wasn't moon money as toned common date morgans go regardless of the less that expert opinions expressed by a few individuals in this thread.
Bryan put it very succinctly when he said all that matters is that the buyers is happy....I only wish that was the common sentiment on the PCGS forums but more times then not....bashing is the norm when others prefer a different collection style
Unfortunately, those additional images don't show how beautiful the coin is, either. However, far more importantly, the buyer is happy with his purchase.
<< <i>Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun. >>
Well, while I’ll agree that’s where we have to go, I wish it were that simple. The fact of the matter is, however, that the handful of "sophisticates" among us collecting and shelling out top dollar for these so-called "NT" coins hold and regularly vent animosity of their own in the form of the condemnation of every other toned coin which, in their I'm sure highly-esteemed and discriminating opinion, don't quite happen to measure up to their abstract standards dictating what colors, patterns and the like constitute a "marketable" toned coin. Yes, collect what you want, and don't bash the collections of others, I'm all for that, 1000%, what collector among us isn't? It applies both ways, however. You let the rest of the coin market alone that doesn't happen to subscribe to and collect by your abstract standards, and perhaps, over time, it'll respectfully reciprocate. I'd hope that, anyway, as the fact of the matter is, I don't happen to care for this kind of divisiveness every time I log on and see a toned coin shown-off in these forums, any more that it's apparent to me you do. Keep your standards, and let others have theirs. It's just mutual-respect.
<< <i>Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun. >>
Well, while I’ll agree that’s where we have to go, I wish it were that simple. The fact of the matter is, however, that the handful of "sophisticates" among us collecting and shelling out top dollar for these so-called "NT" coins hold and regularly vent animosity of their own in the form of the condemnation of every other toned coin which, in their I'm sure highly-esteemed and discriminating opinion, don't quite happen to measure up to their abstract standards dictating what colors, patterns and the like constitute a "marketable" toned coin. Yes, collect what you want, and don't bash the collections of others, I'm all for that, 1000%, what collector among us isn't? It applies both ways, however. You let the rest of the coin market alone that doesn't happen to subscribe to and collect by your abstract standards, and perhaps, over time, it'll respectfully reciprocate. I'd hope that, anyway, as the fact of the matter is, I don't happen to care for this kind of divisiveness every time I log on and see a toned coin shown-off in these forums, any more that it's apparent to me you do. Keep your standards, and let others have theirs. It's just mutual-respect. >>
What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity????
I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit.
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly.
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
Ahh I love a post like this. A dime a dozen for a coin like that?? Okay how about you show me a dozen with that look??
I also like the "Perhaps a bit over sheet but just a bit" If these coins are so darn easy to come by and a "dime a dozen" Then why at every major auction they seem to pull multiples of sheet?? So easy to come by but yet they continue to sell for so called moon money?? There is a very very big difference between an average toned morgan" Those are a dime a dozen" and a monster toned morgan " These are NOT a dime a dozen"
If these coins were so so easy to aquire for just a bit over sheet then every dealer would be buying them up and just sending them to auction where they continue to pull much much more then sheet. This would be the easiest buisness plan in the world so why doesnt every dealer do it??
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly. >>
I know exactly what that coin looks like, unless the image is of a different coin. I've seen enough of these things where unless the image is in black & white, I can very easily decipher the coin (and certainly with the presented image). There's really nothing mysterious about it. Again, it's nice but an all too common "look" on a far too common date.
I have seen the coin and can say this with authority: anyone who has not seen it cannot describe it. I have not seen any picture yet that captures all the colors.
Knowing its a Sonnier coin as well, should make you give the coin the benefit of the doubt. Has anyone seen a bad Sonnier coin? Laura told me everyone was outrageous. I believe her based on the dozen or so I have seen. There are not many coins similar to thhis 1886.
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly. >>
I know exactly what that coin looks like, unless the image is of a different coin. I've seen enough of these things where unless the image is in black & white, I can very easily decipher the coin (and certainly with the presented image). There's really nothing mysterious about it. Again, it's nice but an all too common "look" on a far too common date. >>
If, without having seen it in hand, you know "exactly what the coin looks like", you have powers and abilities in interpreting images that no one else does - congratulations to you. And as for the look being "all too common" - that's odd, considering that dealers I know, who frequent just about every major show and auction, have a very different opinion.
<< <i>I have seen the coin and can say this with authority: anyone who has not seen it cannot describe it. I have not seen any picture yet that captures all the colors.
Knowing its a Sonnier coin as well, should make you give the coin the benefit of the doubt. Has anyone seen a bad Sonnier coin? Laura told me everyone was outrageous. I believe her based on the dozen or so I have seen. There are not many coins similar to thhis 1886. >>
Sorry, Dave, but you're badly mistaken. Dizzy knows "exactly" what it looks like, even if he hasn't seen it.
If a coin like this sells for a high price at a low profile auction with a limited amount of eyeball traffic perhaps you could attempt to chaulk it up as an anomoly.....but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet? Teletrade, Ebay, Heritage, Bowers, DLRC, Legend......I can't think of a single coin related venue where this coin doesn't sell for probably $1500 to $2000 all day long and twice on Sunday. So if it would sell for that much any where other than a flea market then that's the market value whether you want to admit it or not. Nobody says you have to like it but to say the coin is common with that color and not worth a price that it could fetch during any random sale this year is to turn a blind eye to the truth. Do not let personal opinions cloud your judgment....I don't like widgets but I am not crazy enough to say that a blast white MS66 Morgan is only worth 50% graysheet because it's unoriginal? I understand that other collectors value coins in certain series much more than I do so I don't make blanket statements as to values that have no facts to support them and neither should you. I am very in tune with the market for toned Morgans and I can boast that I have sold probably 300+ Morgans in the last 3 months alone...... so what are you basing your opinions on.....facts or feelings....gee I wonder
<< <i>FYI, I love the look of the coin, the brilliant and gorgeous toning attests to its naturalness and originality and I would love to own it if I collected such. I just would like to throw caution to the wind since I learned the hard way when I similarly paid many multiples for a wonderfully toned coin that I got into trouble with. I strongly believe in buying naturally toned and original coins but I similarly believe to not pay multiples for the toning factor anymore, I just don't believe it is worth the potential negative ramifications. I wish the new owner good luck with his purchase and if he is never going to sell it in his lifetime then it doesn't matter because he will have nothing to be concerned with however if he may decide to sell in the future I hope he doesn't have the same experience that I encountered. >>
<but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility.
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken.
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be.
Dizzy is dead wrong-the coin probably would have sold for more on the floor.
I know plenty of legit dealers who would pay 4x or more for color like that.
Sounds like you got sold some marginal color coins and got stuck. Anyone who knows color and had seen this coin would never make comments like that. Do not take your frustration out on this coin.
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be. >>
You're ignoring the fact that, in addition to the winning bidder, at least three other posters to this thread placed bids on the coin at multiples of sheet. And two of them are dealers who attend shows and would gladly buy the coin for considerably more than you claim it's worth.
Also, even though you haven't seen the coin in person, yet claimed to know "exactly what it looks like" (I still can't believe you actually said that) you obviously don't. My personal opinion aside, I will go with sight-seen assessments by those who are familiar with that segment of the market, over yours.
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be. >>
Dizzy,
No need to walk it around the bourse, I am usually set up at the major shows and I would be very happy to pay multiples of sheet for this coin. If someone would have brought that coin to me and said " I would like to get 1k" I would have jumped all over the coin. I was an under bidder on the coin for more then that. I also purchased the second highest 1885 CC to ever sell at auction, for well above "sheet" prices, the only other 1885 cc to ever sell higher was the jack lee 68. I buy coins like this whenever can for well above any sheet price and I can tell you with 100% certainty that there are several others that do as well.
Since when was selling a coin on the bourse floor the best way to get top dollar for a coin?
<< <i>will someone explain the purported origin of the toning? If mint bag, how is it speculated that the coin was positioned?
I've seen fade-away toners where one edge contacted the bag, there are full-side toners, there are crescent toners where another coin overlapped.
Just exactly how does a coin get toned in a bag with two exactly straight parallel lines? thanks so much >>
Here are a couple of possibilities which were posted earlier in the thread:
1) "... it reminds me of the old albums people would house morgans in that had the clear strip that would cause these toning lines.."
2) "....I've seen somewhat similar blank centers when a coin was eiither kept in a certain album with a strip of elasticized cloth to hold it in the space rather that a plastic lens or if it were in a "tidy house" or similar holder where tape was used to secure..."
so, the relatively untoned band on the obverse was covered, or exposed, in this scenario? and the relatively untoned reverse? was in contact with this holder, or not?
thanks so much.... one assumes this was some kind of display holder, yes? trying to understand which parts of the coin were showing in this type of holder.
<< <i>What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity???? >>
Well, now, isn't that characteristic when you're cornered, simply relapse into an hysteria and shout the other side down. My goodness. But I can't say I didn't see that coming...
Listen, do me a small favor, keep my cornflakes out of this, what did they ever do to you? That really pisses me off!
<< <i>What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity???? >>
Well, now, isn't that characteristic when you're cornered, simply relapse into an hysteria and shout the other side down. My goodness. But I can't say I didn't see that coming...
Listen, do me a small favor, keep my cornflakes out of this, what did they ever do to you? That really pisses me off! >>
Who was cornered?? A hysteria, shouting the other side down? You dont make any sense!! You made a post earlier that made no sense and shane simply responded asking what the heck you were talking about. Now your talking about corn flakes?? I think maybe you should just step away from the keyboard for a bit and come back when you can make a post that actually is fact based and makes some sort of sense.
Congratulations, JBN. I hope your satisfaction increases upon receipt of the coin. Had every coin purchase made from auction had the amount of scrutinization that you provided for this purchase, many bidders would be far more satisfied with their purchases and their bids. Toned silver coins have never been an exciting factor for me, but I do understand it for others, as I truly love an nt copper of any series of 19th century coins. Again, enjoy, work well done. Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
<< <i>FYI, I love the look of the coin, the brilliant and gorgeous toning attests to its naturalness and originality and I would love to own it if I collected such. I just would like to throw caution to the wind since I learned the hard way when I similarly paid many multiples for a wonderfully toned coin that I got into trouble with. I strongly believe in buying naturally toned and original coins but I similarly believe to not pay multiples for the toning factor anymore, I just don't believe it is worth the potential negative ramifications. I wish the new owner good luck with his purchase and if he is never going to sell it in his lifetime then it doesn't matter because he will have nothing to be concerned with however if he may decide to sell in the future I hope he doesn't have the same experience that I encountered. >>
Are you Barney reincarnated? >>
Ruh Roh, so please enlighten me, I must be not in the inner circle, th eonly Barney I am familair with is a purple dino? >>
Barney was a board member who paid moon money for a common toner and lost his arse when he sold it. On the home page for this forum put barney in the box and hit search. FWIW his eBay handle was I think celexa or celexa69.
<< <i>Dizzy is dead wrong-the coin probably would have sold for more on the floor.
I know plenty of legit dealers who would pay 4x or more for color like that.
Sounds like you got sold some marginal color coins and got stuck. Anyone who knows color and had seen this coin would never make comments like that. Do not take your frustration out on this coin. >>
Dead wrong? Quite the contrary. The coin is a common date and the color is nice but nothing spectacular. It is at best a slightly over list coin (pehaps a smudge more). To say it's legitimately a 5x-10x list coin is simply ludicrous IMO but of course there are those who fall into that category.
I have collected monster toners and I have actually done very well with them, but of course I've learned my lesson here and there (just like many of us). I have absolutely no frustration to take out on any coin. Just the opposite actually. I'm trying to do the best I can with my experience in this color craze to try and be realistic and offer to those who are new to the hobby and learning about toned coins, that they need to be ever so careful not to get sucked into the fantasy world that paying 10x-15x or more for a coin (especially one with one of the most common dates and IMO, not very unique toning) is a "wise" move.
Now, if $ is no object and you plan on holding the coin for years (if not decades) for pure enjoyment purposes, then have at it. If the collector has any plans whatsoever to move the coin any time in the near or somewhat distant future, I think they're in for an unpleasant surprise.
Again, please, take this coin or one just like it (there are many out there) to the bourse and present an asking price of 10x-15x the list price. If dealers and/or other collectors jump all over it, then I truly do aplogize. But in all reality, I think I have a pretty good idea of what the feedback would be with a coin like this with an enormous price tag.
Comments
EAC 6024
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>why is it this man is applauded for paying 4X PCGS guide for a coin such as this ,
and yet when I do no different with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
I get batted around like a step child ? >>
Why is it that in order to try to make your point, you presented an incorrect set of facts?
as usual , you are correct Sir !
how about:
Why is it this person is commended ( by knowledgeable and respected experts ) for paying multiples of PCGS Guide for this coin ,
and yet when I do similarly with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
the disrespectful and naive infer that I am a loon ? >>
That was better, but.....
Some posters congratulated him, while others, to put it nicely, were far less respectful.
Would you be so kind as to link a thread where you were treated the way you stated? Perhaps you exaggerated about your treatment, as you exaggerated in this thread.
It only had one. Therefore I think this was an unwise purchase for the price paid.
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>why is it this man is applauded for paying 4X PCGS guide for a coin such as this ,
and yet when I do no different with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
I get batted around like a step child ? >>
Why is it that in order to try to make your point, you presented an incorrect set of facts?
as usual , you are correct Sir !
how about:
Why is it this person is commended ( by knowledgeable and respected experts ) for paying multiples of PCGS Guide for this coin ,
and yet when I do similarly with a superb toned PCGS Franklin ,
the disrespectful and naive infer that I am a loon ? >>
That was better, but.....
Some posters congratulated him, while others, to put it nicely, were far less respectful.
Would you be so kind as to link a thread where you were treated the way you stated? Perhaps you exaggerated about your treatment, as you exaggerated in this thread.
Guilty ............I was embellishing , and stooped to using figures of speech to portray my feelings of being made to look foolish for paying too much for coins .
<< <i>I'll tell everyone a little secret I knew about the coin: it was from Legends Sonnier Collection. >>
Do you happen also to know whether the coin was originally in a GSA slab? Or am I adding two and two together here and not getting four?
<< <i>Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar. >>
I believe another of the bidders just "secreted" to us that it was. Was this a GSA coin?
<< <i>...Haven't read this entire thread. Anyone know the history on this coin? I think it was sold as part of my collection. If not, I had one that looked quite similar. >>
Welcome to another thread about another of your great coins, Bryan.
Another poster wrote << I'll tell everyone a little secret I knew about the coin: it was from Legends Sonnier Collection. >>
I was pretty sure that piece had been in my collection for many years though it looks a lot darker in the photo than in person. Don't recall where I picked it up though I'm confident I didn't pay and arm and a leg for it. Sounds like the new buyer is really happy with the coin and that pleases me. In the end, that's what collecting is all about.
<< <i>
I was pretty sure that piece had been in my collection for many years though it looks a lot darker in the photo than in person. Don't recall where I picked it up though I'm confident I didn't pay and arm and a leg for it. Sounds like the new buyer is really happy with the coin and that pleases me. In the end, that's what collecting is all about. >>
It is, indeed, quite a bit darker (and less beautiful) in the image than in person.
<< <i>Some people just pay stupid money for silly coins. This thread is a perfect example. >>
I believe another bidder on it just opened the door so to speak for the implication that it may have been a bustout from a GSA slab. If that's the case, which, I'll admit, I still don't know, as yet, it should explain the toning. Very pretty, BTW; don't you agree?
100% Positive BST transactions
<< <i>Threads like this sum up my feeling on toned coins pretty well. I would be hesitant to collect anything that produces a level of animosity and miss trust that only maintains its liquidity at the whims of a ever changing market standard and certification process, at best it would be hard to keep up. While my chosen field draws lots of fear and the end of the day it comes down to real or fake with mine, that seams to be a moving target with toners. >>
Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun.
I'm sure I was called crazy a thousand times for stepping up and paying what others thought was stupid money for coins I wanted for my collection, but I didn't care. As for the issue of liquidity, as it turns out, my collecting habits proved profitable in the long run, but that was never my primary objective for collecting.
In all honesty, I never viewed my coins as investments. That's why God created stocks and bonds.
This coin is a visual delight.
The looks in hand are amazingly satisfying.
RE: The auction photo: (1) My concern about the noise in front of Liberty was for naught. I find it tough to position the coin to duplicate the level of noise shown in the Heritage photo. (2) The photo does not show the 'red river' flowing from the right side of the lower red band, along the bottom of Liberty's hair, and finishing in two tributaries through each of the eights. What a treat to behold. (3) Although not mentioned in my treatise about the purchase strategy, I typically open the large image on the Heritage website, crop the photo and shoot it to an 11x17 sheet on the color printer to get an ultra closeup of the coin - I know it is totally unfair to the coin to have this kind of blowup, but I must see it. Some of the 'warts' shown in this unfair photo do not manifest themselves whatsoever on the inhand coin. (4) The depth of the colors in a normal, sunlit room are so, so much deeper. If I go outside and look at the coin in the bright sunlight, the colors are somewhat washed out. Under my florescent desklight, the colors appear muted as in the Heritage photo. (5) The reverse is quite nice as well. What looked like darker brown complementing the gold rim toning in the photo are in fact a light blue - another pleasant surprise.
Mark Feld/coinguy1 and soty27 opinions on the inhand quality of the coin were right as rain.
I'm immensely delighted with the dollar.
I will now snap some pictures and learn how to post them. Please bear with me - when I was going to school a 'computer' was termed a 'slide rule' and adding machines weighed approximately 20 pounds.
<< <i>OH MY.
This coin is a visual delight.
The looks in hand are amazingly satisfying.
RE: The auction photo: (1) My concern about the noise in front of Liberty was for naught. I find it tough to position the coin to duplicate the level of noise shown in the Heritage photo. (2) The photo does not show the 'red river' flowing from the right side of the lower red band, along the bottom of Liberty's hair, and finishing in two tributaries through each of the eights. What a treat to behold. (3) Although not mentioned in my treatise about the purchase strategy, I typically open the large image on the Heritage website, crop the photo and shoot it to an 11x17 sheet on the color printer to get an ultra closeup of the coin - I know it is totally unfair to the coin to have this kind of blowup, but I must see it. Some of the 'warts' shown in this unfair photo do not manifest themselves whatsoever on the inhand coin. (4) The depth of the colors in a normal, sunlit room are so, so much deeper. If I go outside and look at the coin in the bright sunlight, the colors are somewhat washed out. Under my florescent desklight, the colors appear muted as in the Heritage photo. (5) The reverse is quite nice as well. What looked like darker brown complementing the gold rim toning in the photo are in fact a light blue - another pleasant surprise.
Mark Feld/coinguy1 and soty27 opinions on the inhand quality of the coin were right as rain.
I'm immensely delighted with the dollar.
I will now snap some pictures and learn how to post them. Please bear with me - when I was going to school a 'computer' was termed a 'slide rule' and adding machines weighed approximately 20 pounds. >>
Florescent Lit:
Sun Lit:
Room lit:
Bryan put it very succinctly when he said all that matters is that the buyers is happy....I only wish that was the common sentiment on the PCGS forums but more times then not....bashing is the norm when others prefer a different collection style
<< <i>Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun. >>
Well, while I’ll agree that’s where we have to go, I wish it were that simple. The fact of the matter is, however, that the handful of "sophisticates" among us collecting and shelling out top dollar for these so-called "NT" coins hold and regularly vent animosity of their own in the form of the condemnation of every other toned coin which, in their I'm sure highly-esteemed and discriminating opinion, don't quite happen to measure up to their abstract standards dictating what colors, patterns and the like constitute a "marketable" toned coin. Yes, collect what you want, and don't bash the collections of others, I'm all for that, 1000%, what collector among us isn't? It applies both ways, however. You let the rest of the coin market alone that doesn't happen to subscribe to and collect by your abstract standards, and perhaps, over time, it'll respectfully reciprocate. I'd hope that, anyway, as the fact of the matter is, I don't happen to care for this kind of divisiveness every time I log on and see a toned coin shown-off in these forums, any more that it's apparent to me you do. Keep your standards, and let others have theirs. It's just mutual-respect.
<< <i>
<< <i>Animosity? Just collect what you like and forget about the drama of what others might think. Worrying about what others think of your collection kills the fun in my humble opinion, and coins should be fun. >>
Well, while I’ll agree that’s where we have to go, I wish it were that simple. The fact of the matter is, however, that the handful of "sophisticates" among us collecting and shelling out top dollar for these so-called "NT" coins hold and regularly vent animosity of their own in the form of the condemnation of every other toned coin which, in their I'm sure highly-esteemed and discriminating opinion, don't quite happen to measure up to their abstract standards dictating what colors, patterns and the like constitute a "marketable" toned coin. Yes, collect what you want, and don't bash the collections of others, I'm all for that, 1000%, what collector among us isn't? It applies both ways, however. You let the rest of the coin market alone that doesn't happen to subscribe to and collect by your abstract standards, and perhaps, over time, it'll respectfully reciprocate. I'd hope that, anyway, as the fact of the matter is, I don't happen to care for this kind of divisiveness every time I log on and see a toned coin shown-off in these forums, any more that it's apparent to me you do. Keep your standards, and let others have theirs. It's just mutual-respect. >>
What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity????
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly.
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
Ahh I love a post like this. A dime a dozen for a coin like that?? Okay how about you show me a dozen with that look??
I also like the "Perhaps a bit over sheet but just a bit" If these coins are so darn easy to come by and a "dime a dozen" Then why at every major auction they seem to pull multiples of sheet?? So easy to come by but yet they continue to sell for so called moon money?? There is a very very big difference between an average toned morgan" Those are a dime a dozen" and a monster toned morgan " These are NOT a dime a dozen"
If these coins were so so easy to aquire for just a bit over sheet then every dealer would be buying them up and just sending them to auction where they continue to pull much much more then sheet. This would be the easiest buisness plan in the world so why doesnt every dealer do it??
<< <i>
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly. >>
I know exactly what that coin looks like, unless the image is of a different coin. I've seen enough of these things where unless the image is in black & white, I can very easily decipher the coin (and certainly with the presented image). There's really nothing mysterious about it.
Again, it's nice but an all too common "look" on a far too common date.
Knowing its a Sonnier coin as well, should make you give the coin the benefit of the doubt. Has anyone seen a bad Sonnier coin? Laura told me everyone was outrageous. I believe her based on the dozen or so I have seen. There are not many coins similar to thhis 1886.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>I, for one, wouldn't buy that coin even with someone else's checkbook, sorry. A dime a dozen for that coin with that look. It's nice, but "how nice" over sheet??? Perhaps a bit, but not much more than a bit. >>
You sound as if you know exactly what it looks like. And if you haven't seen it in hand, you don't. On the other hand, a number of those who did see it in person were extremely impressed and bid accordingly. >>
I know exactly what that coin looks like, unless the image is of a different coin. I've seen enough of these things where unless the image is in black & white, I can very easily decipher the coin (and certainly with the presented image). There's really nothing mysterious about it.
Again, it's nice but an all too common "look" on a far too common date. >>
If, without having seen it in hand, you know "exactly what the coin looks like", you have powers and abilities in interpreting images that no one else does - congratulations to you. And as for the look being "all too common" - that's odd, considering that dealers I know, who frequent just about every major show and auction, have a very different opinion.
<< <i>I have seen the coin and can say this with authority: anyone who has not seen it cannot describe it. I have not seen any picture yet that captures all the colors.
Knowing its a Sonnier coin as well, should make you give the coin the benefit of the doubt. Has anyone seen a bad Sonnier coin? Laura told me everyone was outrageous. I believe her based on the dozen or so I have seen. There are not many coins similar to thhis 1886. >>
Sorry, Dave, but you're badly mistaken. Dizzy knows "exactly" what it looks like, even if he hasn't seen it.
I wish I could hold it.
and they're cold.
I don't want nobody to shoot me in the foxhole."
Mary
Best Franklin Website
But most of all , I really dig the posts where somebody pays 4 to 100 times sheet for a specimen - that gets me all worked up ;
like watching a grand slam at the ballpark !
<< <i>FYI, I love the look of the coin, the brilliant and gorgeous toning attests to its naturalness and originality and I would love to own it if I collected such. I just would like to throw caution to the wind since I learned the hard way when I similarly paid many multiples for a wonderfully toned coin that I got into trouble with. I strongly believe in buying naturally toned and original coins but I similarly believe to not pay multiples for the toning factor anymore, I just don't believe it is worth the potential negative ramifications. I wish the new owner good luck with his purchase and if he is never going to sell it in his lifetime then it doesn't matter because he will have nothing to be concerned with however if he may decide to sell in the future I hope he doesn't have the same experience that I encountered. >>
Are you Barney reincarnated?
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility.
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken.
<< <i>
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be.
I know plenty of legit dealers who would pay 4x or more for color like that.
Sounds like you got sold some marginal color coins and got stuck. Anyone who knows color and had seen this coin would never make comments like that. Do not take your frustration out on this coin.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be.
You're ignoring the fact that, in addition to the winning bidder, at least three other posters to this thread placed bids on the coin at multiples of sheet. And two of them are dealers who attend shows and would gladly buy the coin for considerably more than you claim it's worth.
Also, even though you haven't seen the coin in person, yet claimed to know "exactly what it looks like" (I still can't believe you actually said that) you obviously don't. My personal opinion aside, I will go with sight-seen assessments by those who are familiar with that segment of the market, over yours.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i><but please enlighten me dizz as to where you could attempt to sell this coin where it would not bring at least 5 to 10 times sheet?>
Perhaps if enough hype is built up for an example like this (like I mentioned before, it is nice) and there are those that get into the auction frenzy. Of course it only takes two to make an auction lot go crazy. Here's my suggestion, walk a coin like that around any one of the big shows across the country or all of the big shows, and offer it to dealers or even serious collectors walking the bourse, and try moving it for 5 to 10 times sheet (or even 3x to 4x sheet for that matter). I think you might get a few laughs and I think it would no doubt be an effort in futility. >>
A number of dealers and collectors who would be at such shows have already indicated by their comments about and/or actual bids for the coin that you are mistaken. >>
I hear ya, I've seen the comments. It's one thing to praise a coin here on the forum. To actually fork over the $ at many multiples of bid is an entirely different animal. Again, walk it around the bourse and see what the results would be.
Dizzy,
No need to walk it around the bourse, I am usually set up at the major shows and I would be very happy to pay multiples of sheet for this coin. If someone would have brought that coin to me and said " I would like to get 1k" I would have jumped all over the coin. I was an under bidder on the coin for more then that. I also purchased the second highest 1885 CC to ever sell at auction, for well above "sheet" prices, the only other 1885 cc to ever sell higher was the jack lee 68. I buy coins like this whenever can for well above any sheet price and I can tell you with 100% certainty that there are several others that do as well.
Since when was selling a coin on the bourse floor the best way to get top dollar for a coin?
I've seen fade-away toners where one edge contacted the bag, there are full-side toners, there are crescent toners where another coin overlapped.
Just exactly how does a coin get toned in a bag with two exactly straight parallel lines? thanks so much
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>will someone explain the purported origin of the toning? If mint bag, how is it speculated that the coin was positioned?
I've seen fade-away toners where one edge contacted the bag, there are full-side toners, there are crescent toners where another coin overlapped.
Just exactly how does a coin get toned in a bag with two exactly straight parallel lines? thanks so much >>
Here are a couple of possibilities which were posted earlier in the thread:
1) "... it reminds me of the old albums people would house morgans in that had the clear strip that would cause these toning lines.."
2) "....I've seen somewhat similar blank centers when a coin was eiither kept in a certain album with a strip of elasticized cloth to hold it in the space rather that a plastic lens or if it were in a "tidy house" or similar holder where tape was used to secure..."
thanks so much.... one assumes this was some kind of display holder, yes? trying to understand which parts of the coin were showing in this type of holder.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity???? >>
Well, now, isn't that characteristic when you're cornered, simply relapse into an hysteria and shout the other side down. My goodness. But I can't say I didn't see that coming...
Listen, do me a small favor, keep my cornflakes out of this, what did they ever do to you? That really pisses me off!
<< <i>
<< <i>What or who are you talking about....seriously you total lost me??? Are you saying that toned coin collectors are now bashing other toned coin collectors if they don't spend enough on a coin? I only know of one toned coin collector who used to be on this forum who regularly measured the quality of his coins by how much more he could pay for them than other collectors...he got booted so who else is a snobby toned coin collector? So you are waiting for the entire toned coin collecting community to give you a big hug before you stop bashing folks for paying what you would deem to be crazy money for a coin? Last I checked in the real world it doesn't have to work that way.....it only works that way because you choose to go that route. I hate white coins with a passion.....but I can co exist with ricko just fine? I get a kick out of his comments and I don't take them personally. If others have pee peed in your cornflakes about a coin you owned not being good enough then that's their problem not yours...unless you make it your problem worry about what someone else thanks of how you spend you money. Dude just worry about the money you spend on what you collect and not what others are spending....it's real easy to back out of a thread if you think someone just paid crazy money for a coin...there is no need to interject with negative opinions and wax all philosophical about abstract standards and reciprocity???? >>
Well, now, isn't that characteristic when you're cornered, simply relapse into an hysteria and shout the other side down. My goodness. But I can't say I didn't see that coming...
Listen, do me a small favor, keep my cornflakes out of this, what did they ever do to you? That really pisses me off! >>
Who was cornered?? A hysteria, shouting the other side down? You dont make any sense!! You made a post earlier that made no sense and shane simply responded asking what the heck you were talking about. Now your talking about corn flakes?? I think maybe you should just step away from the keyboard for a bit and come back when you can make a post that actually is fact based and makes some sort of sense.
Again, enjoy, work well done.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>FYI, I love the look of the coin, the brilliant and gorgeous toning attests to its naturalness and originality and I would love to own it if I collected such. I just would like to throw caution to the wind since I learned the hard way when I similarly paid many multiples for a wonderfully toned coin that I got into trouble with. I strongly believe in buying naturally toned and original coins but I similarly believe to not pay multiples for the toning factor anymore, I just don't believe it is worth the potential negative ramifications. I wish the new owner good luck with his purchase and if he is never going to sell it in his lifetime then it doesn't matter because he will have nothing to be concerned with however if he may decide to sell in the future I hope he doesn't have the same experience that I encountered. >>
Are you Barney reincarnated?
Ruh Roh, so please enlighten me, I must be not in the inner circle, th eonly Barney I am familair with is a purple dino? >>
Barney was a board member who paid moon money for a common toner and lost his arse when he sold it. On the home page for this forum put barney in the box and hit search. FWIW his eBay handle was I think celexa or celexa69.
<< <i>Dizzy is dead wrong-the coin probably would have sold for more on the floor.
I know plenty of legit dealers who would pay 4x or more for color like that.
Sounds like you got sold some marginal color coins and got stuck. Anyone who knows color and had seen this coin would never make comments like that. Do not take your frustration out on this coin. >>
Dead wrong? Quite the contrary. The coin is a common date and the color is nice but nothing spectacular. It is at best a slightly over list coin (pehaps a smudge more). To say it's legitimately a 5x-10x list coin is simply ludicrous IMO but of course there are those who fall into that category.
I have collected monster toners and I have actually done very well with them, but of course I've learned my lesson here and there (just like many of us). I have absolutely no frustration to take out on any coin. Just the opposite actually. I'm trying to do the best I can with my experience in this color craze to try and be realistic and offer to those who are new to the hobby and learning about toned coins, that they need to be ever so careful not to get sucked into the fantasy world that paying 10x-15x or more for a coin (especially one with one of the most common dates and IMO, not very unique toning) is a "wise" move.
Now, if $ is no object and you plan on holding the coin for years (if not decades) for pure enjoyment purposes, then have at it. If the collector has any plans whatsoever to move the coin any time in the near or somewhat distant future, I think they're in for an unpleasant surprise.
Again, please, take this coin or one just like it (there are many out there) to the bourse and present an asking price of 10x-15x the list price. If dealers and/or other collectors jump all over it, then I truly do aplogize. But in all reality, I think I have a pretty good idea of what the feedback would be with a coin like this with an enormous price tag.
I'm pretty confident this is probably not an isolated incident.