1921 Peace Dollar - PCGS MS-64 - Doubled Profile

Stuart · November 27, 2009 11:51AM

Has any fellow forum member ever heard of a 1921 Peace Dollar with Liberty's profile slightly doubled? I am trying to do a bit of research to determine of this is strike doubling or a documented VAM die variety.

I saw a coin fitting this description today, and wanted to learn a bit more about it. Thanks in advance for your replies.

Crazy4Coins · November 27, 2009 11:58AM

Stuart, I've looked at a lot of '21 Peace dollars and I don't recall ever seeing one with a doubled profile.

19Lyds · November 27, 2009 12:04PM

Although I do not know for sure, I would think that is such a DDO coin existed, it would have been published by now.

Broadstruck · November 27, 2009 12:13PM

Yes Ms. Liberty's forehead, nose, and neck are doubled... chin maybe too as I can't recall?

Airplanenut had a primo toned PCGS MS63 example in an EBay auction a few years ago.

It's not rare as I have seen others in Heritages archives and they are not designated as being DDO by any TPG service.

It's more so just strike doubling just like the profile of some Type One 1913-P Buffalo's.

Peaceman · November 27, 2009 12:54PM

I've seen 2. They are cool... but I dont think they command a premium.

Stuart · November 28, 2009 12:53AM

Thanks to everyone for your helpful posts.

Any additional feedback?

Peaceman · November 28, 2009 1:13AM

I'll seach my recycle bin to see if I have a picture of one.... It takes about 5 minutes to load... all old coin pics...

Stuart · November 29, 2009 8:37AM

I purchased this interesting 1921 Peace Dollar with Doubled Profile today at a local Houston Coin Show, and am pleased to share it with my fellow forum members.

The profile doubling is limited to Miss Liberty's nose tip, her lower lip extending to chin, and entire neck. This doubling is not evident on either her upper lip, or horizontal portion of lower jaw from chin to neck. There is also apparent doubling in many of the crown rays above Miss Liberty’s forehead.

I have discussed it with RWB, who believes that this is most likely mechanical (strike) doubling. I'd be interested in others' thoughts and opinions on it.
Thanks!

1921 Peace Dollar - Doubled Profile

Unknown · November 29, 2009 9:15AM

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robec · November 29, 2009 10:26AM

Here is SkyMan's '34-D for comparison.

Stuart · November 29, 2009 11:37AM

Robec: Thanks for posting SkyMan's 1934-D Peace Dollar for comparison purposes. It does look very similar to that on my 1921 Peace Dollar.

Is the profile doubling on Skyman's coin attributed to mechanical (strike) doubling?

robec · November 29, 2009 11:55AM

I believe it was raw when I imaged it, but I could be mistaken. I've contacted Sy and hopefully he will respond soon.

erroid · November 29, 2009 12:36PM

That 34D is hub doubling and is either V-3 or V-4(same obv), NOT machine doubling. Note the lips, chin, nostril and nose ridge of the 34D, the doubling is rounded, defined and everywhere. The 21 has localized surface doubling on the neck, chin, and nose; appears flat(shelf-like) and I believe it to be ejection doubling.

SkyMan · November 30, 2009 7:56AM

<< <i>That 34D is hub doubling and is either V-3 or V-4(same obv), NOT machine doubling. Note the lips, chin, nostril and nose ridge of the 34D, the doubling is rounded, defined and everywhere. The 21 has localized surface doubling on the neck, chin, and nose; appears flat(shelf-like) and I believe it to be ejection doubling. >>

Erroid is correct. Here is the reverse so you can nail down the attribution. I've got it listed on the flip, but off the top of my head I can't remember what it is and I'm not a VAM guy. One thing I do know, it would not slab as it was (lightly) cleaned on one side.

and here are some other aspects of the obverse doubling...

messydesk · November 30, 2009 8:01AM

Stuart's coin looks like strike doubling to me. The tip of the nose is a very popular place for that to show up.

Stuart · November 30, 2009 12:57PM

Thanks to all who have contributed to make this thread interesting and educational.

Unknown · November 30, 2009 1:39PM

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RWB · December 1, 2009 12:17AM

Most of the 1934-D doubled obverse die dollars have a reverse with the filled large mintmark (aka: VAM 3). About 5% of the coins, however, have an open, small mintmark (aka: VAM 4).

(PS: Peace dollars have only large and small mintmarks - there is no "medium." Many old listings, including VAMworld, still use "medium" when they mean "large.")

Stuart · December 1, 2009 12:19AM

<< Do all "D"'s look like that, filled? >>

Realone: Boy, is that a leading question. I presume that you are referring to coin mint marks and not other things...

I'll resist the temptation to swing at that softball so that this thread can stay alive.

Stuart · December 4, 2009 12:53PM

Here are some new digital photos that I took today of my new 1921 Peace Dollar with Doubled Profile which was discussed earlier in this thread. (PS - The rusty appearing corrosion spot at 11:30, is much more apparent and distracting in the photos than when viewing the coin in hand)

1921 Peace Dollar (Doubled Profile) PCGS-64

RWB · December 5, 2009 1:45AM

I wonder how many of these are out there? Although not a die variety, it is a dramatic example of a mechanical defect on a large coin.

Unknown · December 5, 2009 2:01AM

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RWB · December 5, 2009 4:26AM

A filled D on the coin resulted from either a defective mintmark punch, where the central portion was filled with debris, or damage to the die where the raised central portion of the D broke off. I suspect it is the latter because coins with partially filled Ds have been reported. Also, I have one where the center of the D is raised above the rest of the mintmark.

1921 Peace Dollar - PCGS MS-64 - Doubled Profile

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