Ichiro: 2000 Hits In 1402 Games. Awesome.

JackWESQ · September 6, 2009 7:18AM

Ichiro collected career hit number 2000 in game number 1402 today. Pretty impressive, though not the fastest as that honor belongs to Al "Buckfoot" Simmons. Strangely, Simmons did not reach 3000 and finished with 2927 career hits.

/s/ JackWESQ

softparade · September 6, 2009 7:55AM

Can you imagine where he would be if he did not get here until age 27 ??. Pete Rose would be shaking in his sneeks .....
barring injury he should be able to hit 3,000 at around age 40.

baseballfan · September 6, 2009 10:19PM

great natural hitter, he's fun to watch

larryallen73 · September 7, 2009 12:58AM

An amazing hitter for sure. So smooth.

Hoopster · September 7, 2009 9:12AM

He is an amazing singles hitter. There are plenty of better hitters than him though.

He certainly gets a lot of pub. He has a career OB% of .378 so far.

Funny thing is a maligned hitter like Adam Dunn has a career OB% of .385 so far, and he gets ripped so much for striking out a lot, yet he gets on base more frequently than Ichiro.

The difference in the amount of times striking out does not even come close to closing the gap that Dunn has on him in SLG%, and the small OB% edge. I guess people are big fans of tap outs(yes, I know a tap out can move a runner over. But the frequency of which that occurs doesn't even put a dent into the difference).

Of course, this is hitting only. Ichiro is a better fielder. I just find it funny how people view Ichiro in such a high light, and view a superior hitter, like Dunni, in such a low light.

JackWESQ · September 7, 2009 10:28AM

I don't view Dunn in such a low light. To me, he's a modern day Harmon Killebrew.

Beyond that, however, how can you not love him after reading this story about the Adam bomb; a shot estimated at 535 feet and, "[w]hich, according to local geographers, meant it was hit in Ohio and came to rest in KENTUCKY." Awesome.

/s/ JackWESQ

softparade · September 7, 2009 11:22AM

<< I don't view Dunn in such a low light. To me, he's a modern day Harmon Killebrew.

Beyond that, however, how can you not love him after reading this story about the Adam bomb; a shot estimated at 535 feet and, "[w]hich, according to local geographers, meant it was hit in Ohio and came to rest in KENTUCKY." Awesome.

/s/ JackWESQ >>

Hoopster likes to create his own senerios of players he feels are slighted. I see this thread heading south ... and real quick.
I will help it along .....

Adam Dunn is a awesome slugger and the above mentioned Harmon Killebrew comparison is spot on. Dunn is a career .251 hitter and his OBP is obvioulsy helped out immensley by being pitched around and walked. Ichiro HITS is way to his OBP. Dunn WALKS his way there.

Ichiro Suzuki is a better "hitter" than Adam Dunn 365 days per year and sometimes 366 days per year. It is beyond me how Adam Dunn could have possibly EVER been brought into this conversation. We are talking about HITTERS here. Not SLUGGERS with tons of walks.
Mark McGwire had a OBP of nearly .400 ..... was he a better or equal "hitter" than Ichiro Suzuki

Dave99B · September 8, 2009 12:59PM

Best hitter alive. On the cusp of 9 CONSECUTIVE 200 hit seasons!

Dave

Hoopster · September 8, 2009 10:40PM

Mark McGwire was a waaaay better hitter than Ichiro.

Softparade, would you feel better if they were called better 'batters' than Ichiro?

Yeah, I know, a guy who strikes out infrequently, and has a high batting averaged is called a great 'hitter' because of the high contact rate(and high batting average). Unless this batter also gets on base a lot, AND gets a lot of efficient extra base hits, then that title is simply trivial.

It really matters none how you want to define "hitter." When evaluating hitters, or batters if you will, it only matters how many runs they are worth with the bat....their performance once then step into the batters box.

Ichiro's results from after stepping into the batters box are not as good as Dunn's. McGwire and Dunn both outperform Ichiro from the batters box. That is what matters when determining hitting, and is in need of recognition...not just highlighting a portion of the story and ignoring huge elements of what constitutes a great baseball BATTER.

nam812 · September 8, 2009 11:25PM

<< ..........that honor belongs to Al "Buckfoot" Simmons........... >>

Al Simmons was called bucket foot, not buck foot.

Dave99B · September 9, 2009 12:28AM

If you needed a hit to save your life, who would you want at the plate?

The answer is obvious: ICHIRO! ICHIRO! ICHIRO!

Dave

TomGshotput · September 9, 2009 1:47AM

If hitting a single was the only thing that helped a team score a run, Dave is absolutely correct, Ichiro is the greatest hitter ever. But some people have this idea that things like homeruns and walks sometimes help teams score runs, too. If true than anyone would agree McGwire was better. One thing to Ichiro's credit is that has steps into the batters box virtually everyday. Not many players are able to do that. And he has done it into his mid-30s, with very little deterioration, soon to enter his late 30s. Lets wait until Adam Dunn does that before we give him credit for it

IchiroDeported · September 9, 2009 5:46AM

I concur that Ichiro is a great singles hitter and has (had) great speed to leg out those hits. Not sure how long that will last, but Dunn is a monster slugger, I agree with the Killebrew comparison. Ichiro does have a relatively low OB%. I'd take Rickey any day of the week and twice on Sundays.

Mickey71 · September 9, 2009 7:44AM

He is a very unique player. This is the weird thing about Ichiro. You can go to 2 games- one game he will get 4 hits with a home run, steal 3 bases and throw someone out at the plate. In the next game he will swing at balls in the dirt, swing on his toes as he's falling out of the batters box and hit 2 balls to the first baseman that are going about 5 miles an hour and strikeout twice. To me there is no in between for him. He either looks brilliant or bad depending on the game because he swings at literally anything. I will have to say living near Seattle that he can be exciting to watch.

softparade · September 9, 2009 2:46PM

<< If you needed a hit to save your life, who would you want at the plate?

The answer is obvious: ICHIRO! ICHIRO! ICHIRO!

Dave >>

Absolutely THE reason why a ball player such as Ichiro is easily a better hitter as compared to a far superior SLUGGER such as Adam Dunn.
The variables of evaluating a true hitter is lost on many. When Adam Dunn is challenged in big spots he is not in the same league as Ichiro. Not even close. Adam Dunn's OBP is jacked up by many a early and mid game pitch around walk ...... YAWN.

Now, Im not trying to tear the impressive slugger that Dunn is down .... but ..... a better "hitter" than a guy like Ichiro?

Mickey71 · September 10, 2009 2:24AM

At this point I don't know what we're talking about. Why did Adam Dunn even come into this in the first place. Why not say Rob Deer had a higher slugging % than Ichiro. This post could get very creative. Barry Larkin had more steals than Babe Ruth--"who cares".

Dave99B · September 13, 2009 12:33PM

Only player EVER with nine consecutive 200 hits seasons. Not bad!

Dave

JackWESQ · September 13, 2009 1:09PM

Indeed!

/s/ JackWESQ

softparade · September 14, 2009 5:28AM

<< At this point I don't know what we're talking about. Why did Adam Dunn even come into this in the first place. Why not say Rob Deer had a higher slugging % than Ichiro. This post could get very creative. Barry Larkin had more steals than Babe Ruth--"who cares". >>

Adam Dunn mysteriously appeared into this thread in Post # 5

WeekendHacker · September 19, 2009 1:45AM

If he is indeed so great, why is it that after 2000 hits, he had his first walk-off hit this year? Very overrated player.

Pigs · September 19, 2009 3:05AM

<< If he is indeed so great, why is it that after 2000 hits, he had his first walk-off hit this year? Very overrated player. >>

Talk about overrated, how about judging someone on how many walk-offs they've had. He has had many games in his career were he has tied a game or had a go-ahead RBI that eventually won the game. Many of your top players have very few walk-off hits. I know Griffey himself has had very few in his hall of fame career. Your grasping for meaningless negatives.

ymarea · September 19, 2009 8:37AM

Ichiro can go 0-650 in 2010 and still be averaging over 200 hits per season and have a lifetime average over .300. He is certainly not overrated. It's just that, in today's game, we have become so accustomed to the big bombers that a hit machine like Ichiro (who does much more than hit, by the way) is not fully appreciated. Just because he doesn't produce runs like Pujols, Howard, or Grady Sizemore, for that matter, does not mean that Ichiro isn't a great player in his own right. Andre Eithier's walk-off successes are not Ichiro's failures.

Dave99B · September 19, 2009 10:33AM

Best hitter in BASEBALL.

Dave

gregmo32 · September 20, 2009 3:50AM

Hoopguru did not invent mathematics or statistics. The use of machines and 140 years of baseball history have eventually brought to light what is more important to helping a team win, and therefore, what makes a baseball player "better."

And this, despite the fact that Ichiro is my favorite current player.

TomGshotput · September 20, 2009 4:52AM

<< He is certainly not overrated

Best hitter in BASEBALL >>

We know for sure one of these is completely wrong, silly, ignorant and stupid. The other is a reasonable opinion, but sometimes hard to agree with

Hoopster · September 21, 2009 12:31AM

Gregmo, well said.

Softparade, in High Leverage plate appearances, here is what Dunn and Ichiro have done...

Dunn .915 OPS in 1,129 career high leverage plate appearances
Ichiro .816 OPS in 1,064 career high leverage plate appearances

Not all high leverage plate appearances in a game of baseball occur in the 8th or 9th inning. Some extremely high level plate appearances occur in the 5th inning, or other innings. A lot depends on the score of the game, the number of base runners, number of outs, and the inning. All of that is accounted for when determining high leverage(which are plate appearances where the results have the highest effect on determining the outcome of the game)

Dunn Late/Close .846 in 820 career late/close plate appearances
Ichiro late/close .829 in in 990 career late/close appearances

Keep in mind that late/close are only a portion of what constitutes the high leverage above, and in this portion they are a bit closer, but Dunn is still ahead. However, overall, Dunn has nearly a 100 point lead in OPS in high leverage situations.

Dunn appeared in this topic as an example why Ichiro gets a little too much credit for his BATTING ability. You have guys calling him the best hitter in the game, yet Dunn is better...and others MUCH, MUCH better. Yes, I know 'hitter' is being defined by you as something else. If all you are saying as 'hitter' is that he has the best batting average and gets the most singles, then yes, he is the best 'hitter' in the game.

Unfortunately, being the best 'hitter' under that definition is sort of trivial, because there other players who do MUCH, MUCH more with the bat in their hand in terms of creating runs and wins for their team...and that is what really matters.

P.S.
McGwire's career OPS is 1.018 in 1,199 high leverage situations.

P.S. again. Keep in mind that Ichiro has a lot of soft singles, or infield singles. These are not of the same value as a single to the outfield, as infield singles do not advance baserunners as efficiently. In all of these measurements, Ichiro's infield singles are given the same weight as the further hit outfield singles. When this is taken into account, the gap in the OPS does not show the true gap(which is a even bigger).

Ichiro: 2000 Hits In 1402 Games. Awesome.

Comments